CEOInterviews.AIThe Manufacturing Alliance with Kerrie Jordan of Epicor

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Tony Demakis1:10

Hello everybody, welcome back to the Manufacturing Alliance Podcast. As always, I'm your host Tony Demakis. This episode is powered by Alliance Specialties and Laser Sales, where we are mold makers that don't build molds. We do polishing, laser welding, laser engraving, hot runner repair, and preventative mold maintenance under one roof. We also have a full line of laser welding and engraving equipment made in the United States, and a production welding facility in Montclair, California. We talk about the US manufacturing market, successes, failures, stresses, and how we can learn together. We do this live so you can join the conversation. We have some things coming up: PT Expo at the end of March in Rosemont, Illinois, where we'll have a booth, live podcasts, and games. We also have the E-210 initiative to give back to communities, partnering with Gardner Business Media. On March 27th, we're going to Feed My Starving Children. Register at alliancelasersales.com. Today we have Kerrie Jordan from Epicor, and she's going to talk about listening to the voice of manufacturing. Let me bring her on.

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Kerrie Jordan8:35

Yes, hello! Great to be here. That all sounded very good. We do need to listen to the voice of the manufacturing worker. Raise your hand if you're having a hard time finding people to come work for you. The only way to do that is to know what people are actually looking for and respond in a way that makes sense, not just take their information and do nothing with it.

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Tony Demakis9:12

Absolutely, that is exactly right. So before we get too far, who is Kerrie Jordan?

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Kerrie Jordan9:23

Really excited to be here. I am Vice President of Product Management at Epicor. Epicor is a provider of industry technology for manufacturing, distribution, automotive retail, and building supply. My team focuses on understanding customer challenges, what workers are saying, and how we can leverage new technologies to help businesses grow, cut costs, and become more sustainable. We work on CPQ, e-commerce, business intelligence, and integration solutions. We listen closely to customers and translate their needs into technology solutions for today and the future.

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Tony Demakis11:25

So all kinds of good stuff. And your resume is quite impressive, a lot longer than 250 words. But when you have a lot you're good at, you want to share that, right?

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Kerrie Jordan11:43

I do want to share it. My team is amazing, and there's a lot of great stuff happening with AI in manufacturing, which can be both exciting and a little freaky. We should be part of the change and make AI the good guy. Let's talk about the survey. We surveyed over 600 manufacturing frontline workers to hear directly from them about challenges, morale, and what they look for in an employer. We wanted to get to the heart of the matter.

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Tony Demakis13:02

How did you get this information? Who were you guys surveying?

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Kerrie Jordan13:12

We surveyed over 600 manufacturing frontline workers. Oftentimes surveys go to the president or C-suite, but we wanted to speak directly to the workers to hear about their challenges, morale, and what they look for in an employer. We wanted to help leaders have honest conversations. We reached out through agencies and alliances that work directly with manufacturing companies.

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Tony Demakis14:18

How did you select the companies and employees to take the survey?

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Kerrie Jordan14:26

We reached out to some folks and agencies that work directly with manufacturing companies to see who would be interested in responding.

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Tony Demakis14:45

I think it's interesting. Often the people in leadership think they have a good grasp on the climate, but there's sometimes a disconnect. Did you find that disturbance?

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Kerrie Jordan15:24

Yes, there were some surprising findings. One was that 60% said they would be willing to take a pay cut to work for an organization that is more tech-savvy. That speaks to a growing appetite for technology among workers. Leaders might misperceive that investing in technology will be disruptive, when actually people want to leverage it because they're familiar with it and see it as helping to alleviate challenges.

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Tony Demakis16:50

When you talk about a more tech-driven factory, what does that look like?

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Kerrie Jordan16:56

We asked what technologies organizations are investing in. The top areas are: big data for business decisions, robotics and AI for automating dangerous or repetitive work, augmented reality to visualize processes and create digital twins, and 3D printing to improve prototyping and accelerate manufacturing.

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Tony Demakis18:13

Augmented reality is really cool. My brother-in-law works for a design company that does that. We've tried to figure out how to implement it, but there are always hurdles. If I surveyed our company about taking a pay cut for new technology, I don't think there'd be huge buy-in.

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Kerrie Jordan18:53

I understand that. What the survey says is that workers don't want to work with outdated technologies. Another finding: the greatest challenge identified was the increasing cost of raw materials, which affects the shop floor through shortages, lower-quality materials, and budget cuts leading to increased workloads. Technology can help increase flexibility and reduce workload.

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Tony Demakis21:23

Yeah, that helps a lot. Mike Magliano is with us; thanks for joining. A question: what was the age demographic of those looking for more technology?

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Kerrie Jordan21:44

We asked about time in the job. 15% had over 15 years, so the rest were less, implying a younger workforce.

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Tony Demakis22:09

Looking at the data, you asked how many people say their documents are digital. Is it easier to get people to do things digitally versus paper?

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Kerrie Jordan22:57

It depends on the workforce. One way to ease the transition is using AI for automation, like scanning invoices with machine learning. If confidence is low, a person gets involved. AI can help with content digitization.

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Tony Demakis23:57

It seems overwhelming to digitize all processes. From time sheets to data transfer, how do we ever get there?

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Kerrie Jordan24:50

Start small. Focus on a business pain and phase it in. That avoids data overload and high costs.

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Tony Demakis25:25

Of the survey, what was the most surprising question?

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Kerrie Jordan25:36

That 61% would take a 10% pay cut to work for a more sustainable company. That was surprising. It ties to what workers love most about their job: building something lasting, contributing to the company's mission, and being part of a team. Sustainability is a growing focus in manufacturing.

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Tony Demakis27:25

Did you say 10%? And is that at their own company or if they were leaving?

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Kerrie Jordan27:39

We asked. If planning to leave, higher pay was a factor, but also more paid time off and work-life balance. They want an employer who listens. So it's not just money; it's being invested in through technology, sustainability, and upskilling. 80% said their employer invests in upskilling through training, apprenticeships, online tools, or tuition reimbursement.

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Tony Demakis29:29

How do you balance those things? They want pay cuts for tech but also more pay and time off.

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Kerrie Jordan29:33

Nobody should take away money from employees. It's about empowering people with great technology, data, and non-monetary perks. Upskilling is critical before investing in automation. You need a team that can take on new skills and want to. Robotics should be used for dangerous or repetitive tasks to let people grow into more fulfilling roles.

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Tony Demakis31:55

Exactly. People think the robot will replace them, but it allows them to grow into different areas. We cover upskilling and sustainability. Vanessa and I have done a few shows now...

Sustainability comes up. It's one of those tricky things where what does sustainability actually mean? What does that look like? How as a business do you become more sustainable without making people use paper straws? Nobody wants those. So when people mention sustainability from your standpoint, when you did the survey, what are they actually looking for?

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Kerrie Jordan33:49

We asked about it pretty broadly. I think a great follow-up would be how do you become a more sustainable company? What ways are you seeing in your business? From my experience, it's taking place in a lot of different ways: choosing more sustainable suppliers, reducing carbon emissions, for distribution making sure they choose the most sustainable routes, regulatory compliance, sourcing raw materials from sustainable sources. Sustainability is a growing force within manufacturing, not just at the c-suite but within workers. Now is the time to dig into how you want to contribute to this mission because a lot of people want to be part of the change.

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Tony Demakis35:11

And I think that's my point. Like, what do you want to do? What does it look like? Everybody is going to say yes, we should be part of a sustainability movement, but what does that mean? It can't simply be putting a green recycling bin next to the garbage can. What does that actually mean? If you had to say we can be a little more green but in the summer we have to keep the air conditioning off until it hits a certain temperature, are people still interested in that? Once they know what it means, or do they just like the word sustainability? Do they know what that actually looks like in their own lives and are they still willing to participate?

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Kerrie Jordan36:00

Yes, it becomes easier once you're part of a bigger organization that can make a big impact. It's hard in my personal life to know how much difference recycling a cereal box makes, but once you see it at an organizational level, you're really making a difference. If I'm working at a company that cares about that, I'm making even more of a difference. There's a lot of implication that we all need to dig into.

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Tony Demakis36:37

I think the most troubling statistic that you had, the one that was eye-opening to me, was 56% plan to leave their job in the next year. As a company, as an employer, that's terrifying.

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Kerrie Jordan36:55

That was a high one. I was pretty surprised by that as well. We then asked what they're looking for in the next job: more paid time off, more flexibility in work schedules, and a management team that listens. When asked why they would worry about their current company, many pointed to high turnover. If we go back to the greatest challenges, one was increasing workload. If you're a tenured employee, you get the most workload when others leave. So these 56% are thinking about leaving, currently overstressed because more work is placed on them as companies downsize or think they're being more efficient.

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Tony Demakis38:20

Is that part of what is forcing people out of their jobs? Susie and Billy?

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Kerrie Jordan38:30

That's absolutely what the data implies. The people who are there are getting overworked and looking for tools and more flexibility to alleviate stress.

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Tony Demakis38:50

Is that where you guys come in, by helping to provide some of those tools to alleviate some of that stress?

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Kerrie Jordan38:58

Technology is certainly a way to do that. But there needs to be a plan in place rather than just investing in technology for technology's sake. I would get to the bottom of why the workforce is overwhelmed. I would look at the process itself: at what point of their day are they feeling overwhelmed? What part of your process is breaking down that you could invest in to improve? Employees want you to ask; they want a management team that listens. Then you can have a more informed decision process around what to invest in.

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Tony Demakis40:00

I think that's great. I've given you a lot of challenges. You have data, I'm saying I don't see it here, I don't know how to wrap my brain around these things. One thing you said is employers have to ask those questions. I would also challenge that employees have to be honest and tell you what they need. Often we ask and people say 'it's fine,' but then they expect you to read their minds. It's like a husband and wife. The wife wants the husband to pick up shoes, but when asked, she says 'I'm fine.' That's literally like Vanessa from Friends. At some point, I asked, if you don't tell me, I can't help. Maybe it's a trust issue. My friend Clint Pulver says you will never get a real answer from your team because they won't tell you.

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Kerrie Jordan42:11

We see that absolutely. It takes trust and credibility to have an honest conversation. To business leaders, it might not be you; you might need to find someone you trust to have these conversations with your team members. Also, look at the workloads assigned to each member. Look at people who left and why. Exit surveys can be honest because they have nothing to lose. But Clint says even on exit interviews, people may not be honest because they just want to get out.

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Tony Demakis43:19

Even with my kids, I ask what's wrong, they say nothing. I say I'll ask one more time and then I don't care. Then we have a conversation. Does that work the third time? Kind of, because I just don't care anymore. I've opened it up for discussion. If you don't want to tell me, you can be in a bad mood. I don't know what else to do.

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Kerrie Jordan44:01

It's true. I've got young kids. Does ice cream work? It works for me to get them to see what's wrong. Bribery? I call it encouragement. I have a 15-year-old today, and ice cream doesn't work on him, but soon the car will.

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Tony Demakis44:48

I'm terrified of that. My son is 16 and it's great. He's very responsible. For a long time he didn't want to get his license because he realized how dangerous it was. We always use incentives, not bribes. When he was little, he loved Thomas the Train. We put Thomas on the shelf until he did what he was supposed to do. Incentives work for everybody.

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Kerrie Jordan45:59

That's part of talking to your team. We have to listen to the voices of people we work with. Not everybody has the same voice or desire or incentive. Not every kid wants Thomas the Train; some want ice cream. Same with teams: some want more pay, some want better technology, some want more days off, some just want to be left alone and not fill out a survey.

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Tony Demakis46:55

That's 100% right. There are all different types of opinions. It behooves leaders to have those honest conversations all the time. When we do reviews, some people love filling out forms, others are like 'seriously, I do my job, what else do you want?' It's either very excited or very mad, rarely in the middle.

I want to ask you some questions. What is the main quality you think makes for a great parent?

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Kerrie Jordan48:07

Patience. It's cliche but I couldn't survive without it.

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Tony Demakis48:23

That's critical. I like that question because it applies to leadership as a whole. As a parent you are the leader of your household, at work you are the leader of people. Patience falls into every area. If you become impatient, it says more about you than the other person because they're not getting it as fast as you want.

What is the main thing that influences your decisions?

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Kerrie Jordan49:17

I have Post-it notes on my monitor. One says 'get the data, rely on the data.' Another says 'be kind, not nice.' That's important because you might have to say something not nice, but in the long run it's the kind thing to do. If someone didn't do a great job on a presentation, giving painful feedback is kind to help them improve.

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Tony Demakis50:11

I really like that. Every once in a while we get good nuggets. You're going to have difficult conversations, and it's hard because you don't want to hurt feelings. But things don't always go as hoped. There's no reason to do it with malice. At church we say it's not loving to let people keep doing bad things because you don't want to upset them.

Do you ever find that people want all the data, collect it, but then have no way to implement it? They have spreadsheets and notebooks but don't know how to make real decisions with it.

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Kerrie Jordan51:38

Yes, definitely. How do we help those people? There are always those people. I work with someone who is a legend with their data. But at some point that data needs to become part of a system that's accessible and secured. It's not great to have it on a single desktop. Make sure it's protected with multi-factor authentication and encryption. Once it's secure, empower everyone with role-based access to the data they need. That's investing in your workforce.

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Tony Demakis53:07

Sometimes we go round and round collecting data and then don't know what to do with it. We fail in that regard. Taking data and saying 'this is what we found, this is how we'll make an impact' is hard.

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Kerrie Jordan53:40

A way to overcome overload is to focus on three to five questions or key performance indicators. Those are your gold metrics. Focus on those, then you can add more over time. For example, within inventory management: my turnover, how am I tracking to demand? Focus on a specific functional area.

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Tony Demakis54:35

I think offline we'll have to talk about inventory management. We build laser welding and engraving equipment and started developing an inventory management system but don't know how to start. We have ideas, shelves labeled, but not a full digital version. We don't know exactly when to order more.

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Kerrie Jordan55:25

Those are the questions. Once you chart out what you need to solve for, you can back into the technology solution. I don't want to do a whole sales call on a live podcast, but that would be interesting. I see areas where we need more ERP systems, but also areas where it would be overkill for staff already burdened.

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Tony Demakis56:12

We recently started using Paychecks online and can't get everybody to sign up. It's an easy app, just do it. But they get paid either way, so there's no incentive. That would be de-incentivizing.

We're coming up to 57 minutes. Are there any other things you want to talk about that we haven't hit on?

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Kerrie Jordan56:56

We talked a lot about sustainability, challenges around cost of raw materials, what makes a great workplace: more paid time off, flexibility. Another interesting stat: 48% said their company was very modern. But is 'modern' a good thing or a bad thing? I'm assuming it's good, but what does modern actually mean?

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Tony Demakis57:48

That's a good question. Modern could be a number of things. For us, a lot of people like the family feel, the historic side. Some value that and don't want to leave it. If it's too modern, maybe they don't like it. One thing I thought of: of the 56% planning to leave, if their employer were willing to discuss more flexibility and be more open to feedback, are those people likely to stay or are they just burnt out?

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Kerrie Jordan58:43

I bet they'd be more likely to stay. Another piece is upskilling. It's about investing in your people. It's worthwhile to go down that path with any employee you're concerned about losing.

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Tony Demakis59:04

A lot of those conversations happen in reviews. How often would you recommend doing reviews to get this information?

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Kerrie Jordan59:14

At least once a year, but regular check-ins quarterly or monthly. You need an ongoing dialogue with your workforce, not just once a year.

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Tony Demakis59:35

I agree. We're wrapping up. We always end our show with prayer requests. Do you have any prayer requests? If you're listening, put them in the chat.

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Kerrie Jordan1:00:01

It's my son's 15th birthday and we might be getting closer to him driving. In Virginia, driver's ed starts junior year, so he can get a permit at 15 years and 6 months. That's next year.

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Tony Demakis1:00:27

The freedom of having a child that can drive is amazing. Jack, can you take Grace to get this thing? As long as you own the car, they still have to listen to you. It's an incentive. 'Your car doesn't have any gas, too bad. Do you need $10 for a quarter tank?'

I'm going to say a quick prayer. Heavenly Father, thank you for this opportunity to talk with Kerrie. Thank you for her knowledge and expertise and her caring about individuals. Help us to learn and grow in working with our teams and listening to what people in manufacturing are saying. We pray for her son getting ready to drive, that you are in control. Help us remember that you know what's going on and your story is better than ours. In Jesus' name. Kerrie, thank you for reaching out and being part of the show. I really enjoyed talking with you.

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Kerrie Jordan1:02:19

It was my pleasure. Thank you. I hope you enjoyed it and maybe we can find ways to work together in the future. As you continue to grow, you may need these services. How can people get a hold of you? Learn more about Epicor at epicor.com, and find me on LinkedIn, Kerrie Jordan.

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Tony Demakis1:02:52

That's Kerrie Jordan from Epicor, one of my new LinkedIn friends. LinkedIn is so good. If you are not using LinkedIn, you should be. This is the power of LinkedIn. I would have never known Kerrie was around, and she reached out to ask to be on the podcast. We had this amazing hour of conversation. If you want to be part of the show, tell your story, share data important for manufacturers, please don't keep it to yourself. Send us a message or email Vanessa at allianzlazersales.com. We want to hear your story. Encourage people to come to PT Expo, sign up for E210, and make a difference in your life. With the people you work for, work with, live with, in your communities. We do that through grit, gratitude, relationships, integrity, and tenacity. How you do it is up to you, but find a way to make a difference for somebody else this week. That's your challenge. On behalf of myself and Kerrie and Epicor and Alliance, thank you for watching, thank you for listening, take care and God bless.