Innovatie, investeren en insurance wereldwijd | Marco Keim (Aegon Europe) @ #DIA Amsterdam

I am responsible for Europe, excluding the UK due to Brexit, and also for Asia, where most of our business is. The pace of digital acceptance and innovation in Asia is incredible. I travel there every month and am constantly amazed at the speed of change.

That is a good question and a frustration of mine. We create significant value in the new world, but our companies are still measured on old indices. Our PE ratio is around 13, while new tech companies that lose money get much higher valuations. I hope this recognition comes in the next few years.

Correct. I have been saying for a decade that our valuation should reflect the value we create. Knab has the highest NPS and we learned a lot about setting up and positioning a bank. Our newest venture is a freelancer bank that helps many people.

The most important thing is to keep innovation at arm's length. As a traditional company, you should interfere as little as possible. Hire people who understand it and give them space outside the core business. Bringing it too close kills it by integrating it too early into existing processes.

In the US, we take up to 5% stakes and have 30 investments now, with eight or nine intensive partnerships. In Europe, we started a fund that takes 30-40% stakes, with board seats. We avoid taking majority control so that innovation stays alive.

It went very well. A lot of routine work disappeared, but new, higher-skilled jobs emerged. Marketing now has 20 different disciplines for precise targeting. Work became more data-driven and automated, while simpler tasks were replaced by more specialized roles.

A great example is a company called Cetelem. It is like a combination of bol.com and a digital platform. They created a teenage platform where products were listed and agents with the highest customer satisfaction got priority. It was very successful, and when new iPhones came out, people bought them faster because you had to click quickly. That platform integrated online and offline, inspired us for Knab, and we later sold it.

In the US, we integrated a robotics company into our pension business. It automates saving and investment. That is a good example of investing in and partnering with a startup. When it is successful, we integrate it, but we keep it under a different label to avoid governance issues from the parent company.

Machine learning algorithms are simple and available to everyone. I believe in very straightforward applications. Data is the future: those who can translate data into customer relevance at the right moment will be the winners. Products are no longer the differentiator; it is all about customer relevance.

We have the usual functions: risk, IT, finance – the standard things for a financial institution. But today, everything is a board matter because mistakes are not allowed, and regulation has become extremely important. Every financial institution has that, and luckily, business people are listened to.

Two things: I think our markets are too small for those Asian giants; they will go to other markets first. I hope we can learn a lot from Asia and implement it here. But this is not a given. A final thought: five years ago I drove a Tesla; now I drive a Mini. That is not an electric car, but that change will come in the future.