Núria Cabutí (Penguin Random House): «Tener nuevas voces demuestra la riqueza de una cultura»

Very well, great. I love talking to you.

Well, I think we're not exactly in the same boat. We're generating quality content—you manage an ocean liner, which in my opinion, if you'll allow me, isn't bad or good, it's simply an ocean liner. And I manage a small boat. Each one has to learn to navigate with the size of boat they have. The challenges in the end are quite similar: how do we attract content that's interesting, that people feel captivated by—whether it's created by our authors, or in our case, our writers.

It's complicated to manage. That's how I'd describe it, but I would say that's precisely what has captivated me all these years in this sector—combining management, which personally interests and appeals to me, with a very creative environment, but with very different objectives. What we're looking for is to bridge the gap between our authors and readers, and to reach the widest possible audience so that emerging authors, established authors, all kinds of literary voices find their readership. That's the great challenge: how to combine those economic results your shareholders demand with that creative side that's so diverse and has so many different interests.

Of course. Our catalog is made up of a variety of voices, authors at different stages of their professional careers. What we're looking for in the long run is for their work to find its audience. We always trust that emerging voices will become well-known, award-winning authors who reach a very broad public.

Of course. We treat each investment in a new author as a small startup. We start to see what happens, and the editor, of course, is the one who accompanies the author throughout their career. Sometimes authors reach a wider audience, others perhaps not as much, and we always have the desire to support all of them as much as possible.

Well, what happens is that there's a growing interest in local content. We've been seeing this not just during the coronavirus period but in previous years too. It's natural that the authors who perform best in our markets are the ones who are better known here, who develop their content here, whose themes sometimes relate to the country. So our business is truly very local, even though we're part of a large international conglomerate. We know the importance of an author who's well-known in a country—and imagine in Latin America, where we operate in nine Spanish-speaking countries, more than 50% of our sales are from local authors. So the cultural aspect predominates and is fundamental.

Well, this is one of our commitments as Penguin Random House—to achieve the maximum global community for those authors. With new technologies and the ability to publish books in ebook format, audio format, and print-on-demand editions, we can truly get our books across the entire Spanish-speaking world. What's difficult is making those authors known. Despite technology helping us today, the local aspect continues to predominate, but this is one of our key goals as an editorial group.

That's a very good question. We have a very good editorial team that's searching for talent everywhere. In the past, a lot came through literary agents—a manuscript would arrive, you'd look at it or not, and it would get published. Today, that talent can be anywhere, and our editors are very attentive to what's happening in society. But then the promotional side, making it known, is also fundamental. And not just promotion—also making it available. That's why our efforts are very focused on the entire supply chain.

Editors who have to work within a business structure—I love them. I think the editor is precisely the one who has to be between the author's creativity and then seeing whether that book will have a minimum possible audience. What we need to offer as a company is maximum support, and in some way give the editor maximum responsibility so they work with absolute freedom, understanding that within their editorial program there will always be books that perform better and perhaps others that don't, but they need to have the backing and full autonomy from the editorial management.

I would recommend both things. First, try to get the manuscript to publishers if possible. But self-publishing is today a very valid option where traditional publishers also look at what's being self-published. Many of the current phenomena we have on bestseller lists in this country are authors who started self-publishing and then came to publish with us—Elizabeth Benevidez, Javier Castillo. There are many authors today within major publishing groups who started that way.

First, distribution, which continues to be key—and even more so in the environment coming. The ability to have a book in a bookstore within 24 hours, at a customer's doorstep within 24 hours, is a competitive advantage that self-publishing can't achieve. That's one main advantage. The second is advice and teamwork—not just on the text, but on the cover design, how to run a promotional campaign, how to reach the public beyond social media. I believe authors value all of this, and that's why they want to come publish with us.

It's a widespread phenomenon. Famous, well-known people publish books in fiction, in self-help—it can also be novels. It's something that happens in practically all countries.

I think it demonstrates the richness of a culture to have many new voices available. Sometimes there are complaints that too many titles are produced, but I think it's ultimately a matter of market maturity. It allows reaching different voices and different publics. The difference compared to a few years ago is that not everything necessarily has to involve a huge shipment of books to bookstores—there are books published directly in ebook and audio format, small print runs. So I don't see it as a disadvantage. I personally think it's a good thing. And let's remember Spain is a major exporter to Latin America—it's a great producer of books but also a major physical exporter of the product and of licenses.

How could we have lost perspective and imagined we would stop printing on paper? In 2010 there was a big debate—exactly as you're saying—and precisely in this international board that I'm part of, it was one of the topics we discussed: where should we focus our strategy—toward the digital world or the physical? What percentage would paper be in 10 years? There were gurus saying it would be 20% paper format and the rest digital. We at Penguin Random House always believed that paper was a format that would prevail, that it was excellent for information capture—as studies have since shown—and that paper would be the chosen format for a long time. Our strategy was to boost the digital side but with a very strong focus on physical, because we believed physical would continue. In 2020, I can tell you that the most developed digital market is the US—digital ebook sales are 20-25%, no more. Paper continues to be the preferred format. In our country it's even more pronounced, with digital at around 7-10%. And I have to say with pride that we've experienced a boom—in caring for books, for the physical product, for buying different papers, artistic covers—that has turned the object into something unique.

Well, first of all, all my media consumption is digital. When I read the newspaper, I do it mostly digitally because of the speed. But when I want to focus on an article, I go to the physical version. In the case of books, I personally always prefer the physical book. I feel more comfortable—perhaps because of my age, perhaps because I grew up with the physical book. But I also honestly tell you that the ones who are really doing the heavy reading are the editors. We have an editorial team of more than 70 people who are constantly choosing titles, reading manuscripts, and as I said, they have total autonomy to propose titles and choose what they think fits their editorial program best.

What I mean is that when an editor proposes a book that's very different and sometimes surprising—we believe in it, we go for it, and we try new things. And I think this is important, because otherwise you end up always publishing the same thing. What we need is to find fresh, different proposals that sometimes surprise and whose viability isn't clear at the moment, but we bet on different things. I always give the example of a practical non-fiction book—'How to Tidy Up Your Home.' When we acquired it, we thought we'd sell 38,000 copies. We've now sold over 200,000 copies in Spanish. The truth is it's almost a curse, because we have so many books we don't know where to shelve, and now Marie Kondo comes along telling us how to organize our house—another book!

Look, in our case, there's a fantastic coexistence—I say this very seriously. We've identified very well which editorial imprints each editor runs. There's a children's and YA line, a more practical non-fiction line, a more literary line, and within each, editors can fully develop their creativity and find great authors. There really is a wonderful working environment—not just in the editorial area, but something that distinguishes Penguin is our workplace culture. We've created teams that feel comfortable, that are deeply committed—and I can confirm this during these confinement days, when the commitment of all employees has been magnificent.

I think that's fundamental. Apart from all the back-office support that's running and backing them up, this personal relationship is very important. Because in the end, we're dealing with people who have strong opinions, know clearly what they want, have dedicated countless hours to writing. We're very respectful of them, but we do give them—all the feedback they want—on our opinions.

Well, during lockdown, reading rates grew enormously. People had more free time and sought other forms of entertainment—with museums closed, theaters closed, they really looked for alternatives. Our reading indices surged. I wish bookstores had been open, because I think there would have been an opportunity to introduce new books. Many people also reread classics—books they had at home. But I also have to say it's been regrettable that bookstores had to stay closed. At the same time, we continued serving through bookstores that wanted it—we offered a drop-shipping system where they sent us orders and we shipped directly from our central warehouse to their customers. It was an innovative, creative formula we launched very quickly during confinement, and it allowed readers and bookstores to not lose sales opportunities. I'm very proud of that.

Look, during the weeks of economic closure, the book market dropped enormously—by 56%. It's tremendous. It's a time of year with enormous activity: Sant Jordi, the Book Fair—overall, a 56% decline for the sector. It's affected bookstores terribly. The channel that remained active was online—it could continue fulfilling orders—and some supermarkets that sell books could also sell some. But a huge part of the business was lost.

Well, these events—I think today, for example, the Madrid Book Fair was supposed to open. The Madrid Fair moves an enormous amount of public, as you know—more than half a million books are sold there. The idea is for it to take place in October. We'll see with what safety measures—there will have to be extreme safety measures—but we're optimistic, and we're working to make it happen. For Sant Jordi, they sell more than two and a half million books during the campaign. All of that was lost. What we hope is to hold a different kind of Sant Jordi on July 23rd—not just Sant Jordi but Simon Diaz's Book Day for all of Spain, if we can manage it. We're optimistic, working with bookstores, and we'll be able to recover part of the sales. But it's clear that traditional commerce has suffered enormously.

It depends on each title. If it's an instant book—we're publishing some books right now related to pandemics and viruses—those were produced very quickly. Sometimes it can take a year and a half or two years for the entire publication process. But there's no single rule, no clear standard.

Well, I'm currently looking at the new titles coming in the fall. But we're also focusing on everything coming for summer, which will be very interesting titles. For example, this week we're publishing the latest book by Carmen Mola—you know she's with Alfaguara and has sold enormously. We're also very active with a book by Alex Alón—I don't know if you know the 'November Comic' series. We're about to publish a novel by Reyes Monforte, the books by Elizabeth Benevidez and Javier Castillo. We're going to publish the paperback edition of Julián Amar's latest title. So we're working on all of this and combining it with fall launches—the new book by Ken Follett will be out in the fall.

And it's not just about the economy, not just about politics. What we want is for that variety of titles to have a positive impact on society, for there to be a variety of voices, and for us all to be more tolerant in general with everything around us. So I would say that after this crisis, I hope that apart from serving as a societal reflection, the role of books gains even greater importance in this new stage.

Absolutely. And it's good to remember that. What we want is plurality and to offer possibilities for all kinds of voices.

Publish good books, we need them. And a hug to everyone.