Julio Ariza entrevista a Tomás Fuertes

Well, this is not the work of one person; it's the work of many people with different training, with grouped science, and what we've done is coordinate all that science and wisdom into sufficiently developed and technological facilities to compete with the entire world.

This, this is El Pozo. This is one of the companies of the Grupo Fuertes group, and this is El Pozo. This project started over 60 years ago. We've been here half the time, about 30 years or so, and the other 30-plus years we were elsewhere. This is a project that was born very humble. We moved here precisely thinking about the evolution it had in this case 30-plus years ago, which was the common market, the evolution it had, and we had the insight to move to these much larger lands, which allowed us to do a part of what there is now, but a part that we have been growing according to the needs that the market has been asking for.

Well, this is part of the CIP. Well, the CIP is the entire process, from agriculture until the product leaves. Exactly. So, El Pozo belongs to the Grupo Corporativo Fuertes, which has the entire agricultural and livestock chain, then the industrial part, and all the development it needs. This is part of the project. What we are seeing.

Well, let's see, you're always thinking about the consumer. Of course. The consumer has the last word, the penultimate word is with the distribution or supermarkets, and the third word is with us. We have to do what the consumer needs and what the distribution needs. We are very obedient to develop the desires that ultimately are the ones who make the decision, and we have to have the means for it.

Well, this installation of about 250,000 square meters, which is equivalent to about 25 football fields more or less. This means it's built in two projects: the one we call slaughterhouse and another for manufacturing. Slaughterhouse is the slaughterhouse, the cutting room, and the packaging of fresh meats. These are fresh products, and then because daily we process the pigs, about half are sold as fresh meats, and the other half is processed daily into all the products we have. We're talking about processing around 10,000 to 12,000 animals daily. Yes, more or less, depending on that. And all that process ends here. A part is sold in fresh meats, as I say, and another is in the elaboration. We have a significant amount of it.

Well, food and current consumers, you eat à la carte now. Each person is a world, and each person needs according to their age, work, metabolism, we might say, a special diet. So, we've made a diversity in five types of animals we use, which is pig, Iberian pig, beef, turkey, and chicken. We've made a variety wide enough to cover the needs that each consumer has. Because the diet of each person is very personal. An endocrinologist has to study your metabolism specifically to tell your organism, and according to your age, the exercise you do, the work you have, and so on, to have an intelligent diet. And that intelligent diet, we in meats, in the five species we do, have made sufficiently well-studied products thinking of the consumer to cover their needs.

Well, human beings have needs; they have to nourish themselves because a person has to ingest between solid and liquid about 2 to 3 kg per day. And clearly, those foods must be well measured according to the metabolism and form they have. And we who produce food, nowadays any product that any responsible company makes is of much higher healthiness. With all due respect to say that my grandmother's stew is the best that exists, the stew that exists now, if made with the responsibility it has, should be better.

Well, food is a very serious thing, right? A very serious thing that I believe those of us dedicated to making food products, while making a variety so that each one adjusts it to their diet, we have to have that responsibility to be able to do all that. So, nowadays there are three things for us that we consider very important for the consumer: one is food safety, which we play with the brand and the company by doing things right because it's part of our own prestige. I say we do it not only out of obligation but also out of devotion and because it's a good business to do things well. Then, normally, another thing is product quality, and another is the fair price. We consider that the consumer needs three basic things: first, food safety; second, product quality; and third, a fair price. That is, when you give a consumer those three things, that person has no choice but to accept it because it's basic. Then there are the small nuances, and we've been very concerned about giving those three things. And for that, we have these state-of-the-art facilities because it's important today to compete, because you no longer have to compete only with Murcia or Spain or even Europe. You have to compete with the entire world, and now it's not about being the best in your street or town, province or nation, but in the world. You have to be the best in the world. And clearly, for that, you need three important things: wanting, knowing, and having the means. Wanting is having the illusion to do things well. Second, knowing, because with so much competition, if you don't know what you're doing, it's hard to be competitive. And third, making it so that the product is competitive. It's as clear as that. It's as easy as that and as difficult as the images you're probably seeing behind our interview. We're projecting images of this company, and when you look inside and see the size and conditions of this organization, you say, 'Well, I didn't know something like this could exist in the world.' But look, here you have some trucks, and I think you're not only thinking about who consumes your product, but also about someone who does the job of getting your product to that consumer and someone who distributes it. And distribution has changed a lot in Spain, right? Yes, a lot. I think in the last 20 years, and especially in the last 10 years, distribution has become much more professionalized, and nowadays there are organizations that have distribution very developed. We are, as I said before, servers of the distribution so that the assortment we make, this assortment of 100 references, because they ask, 'What's your specialty?' We say any of them, because nowadays, as we seek quality through biology, not chemistry, biology, aroma, flavor, we all seek a quality that adjusts to the consumer's own demands. How many trucks like these are on Spanish roads right now, Tomás, that say 'El Pozo'? How many? Well, several hundred. Several hundred, yes, in any part of Spain. I cross them in Asturias or in Seville. It's just that we have a distribution of over one and a half million kilos daily of products. A distribution that doesn't only reach Carrefour or department stores like El Corte Inglés, but to anyone, to the small shop in a town. To all distribution, so you reach a small shop in a town? Yes, yes. That is, this precisely goes to distribution in general, all those interested in our products. Now, we've been very surprised, and we have to confess humbly, but it has given us great joy that the Kantar organization has given us that out of every ten homes in Spain, eight have our products. That is, because we believe that eight out of ten refrigerators have El Pozo. Yes. And this has given us great satisfaction because we believe we've focused our company on the needs of today's consumer and distribution, which is what I said earlier: the consumer wants those three things: safety, quality, and a competitive price. But also, the distribution, we help them with the wide assortment we have so they can make the efficient assortment they need. As a businessman, how many people work here, Tomás? Well, about 4,500 people. And when you see 4,500 people coming and going from this house, and I've crossed paths with many of them and seen the work pace, how they feel here, what do you think as a businessman? I'm one of those who think that the value a person has is never what they've done, but what they're going to do. The merit of a painter, once the painting is done, it's no longer his, it's humanity's, society's, culture's. His is the one he's going to paint. Therefore, I believe that the person, at least with the desire to develop, should never, well, feel proud, why not? You shouldn't have false modesty, but I think you should try to see what you're still capable of doing, because when a baby is born, it's a project of about 3,500 to 4 kg, and nature gives it a whole life of 60, 70, 80, 90, 100 years to incorporate things. So, each of us, I believe, is born with a light; the important thing is to light it. Many wait for others to light it, but one has to work to light it, because all people, no matter how humble, have values. But it's important that the person tries to be interested, perhaps first out of selfishness, to be able to serve humanity and society to earn a living. Why not? Cristiano Ronaldo earns for the kicks he gets from the ball or not. I mean, each person seeks their own path, and it's not necessary to be the smartest, most powerful, or most potent to succeed. Optimize your own resources, and we here, in the culture we have, help our people, all people here, no matter how humble, to encourage them so that each one contributes the value they have, and we really compensate them morally, personally, professionally, and economically based on what they are capable of producing.

Tomás, why do you tell your distributors, your salespeople, the salespeople, to become advisors to your clients? Well, because I think there are three modalities there. One is the order-taker, another is the seller, and another is the advisor or counselor, who, to some extent, the client knows what he needs, but when there's a person who tries to transmit something for him to succeed, because his success is your success, because then if the product is successful, the retailer sells it, it's a success for him, but also for the manufacturer. And we advise our sellers that rather than being order-takers, just repeating, anyone can do that, or selling, trying to deceive or create something unreal, but to help him as much as possible from the point of view of the product he carries, to advise him to make a more efficient assortment. You insist a lot, it makes me laugh because it's obvious, but it's an obviousness we reflect on little: first we think and then we act. We don't act and then think because that usually has sometimes dangerous consequences. This gold card you gave me earlier, I don't know if we can see it, a gold card that you said, you put it in here and money comes out. Why did you make this? Is this a compendium of the philosophy you've applied? No, it's just that this is a question that the gold card is already known: you put it in an ATM and it gives you money, right? So we created this type of card. What happens is that we don't have that machine here, but we joke a bit. Allow me? Allow me to say that this card, we say you put it in here and then take it out here and it gives you money. Why? Because there are 20 golden rules for professional success. Of course. But how do you see the bottle, Tomás? How do you see the bottle? Well, of course, always half empty. That is, the creative person never thinks about what they've done, but what they're going to do. There are those who always see it full because they don't have that creative capacity, which is very dignified for each person to be as they are, that aspirations have no limits. You're thinking about what Americans call the self-made man, the people who are able to make themselves and make it well. Of course, aspirations have no limit. Let's see, a person has to be ambitious, but not greedy. The person must have ambition for what they can do, but not ambition for what they cannot do, that is greed. So, what you have to seek specifically is to see the virtues you might have to put them in an honest and reasonable way at the service of others, so that others pay you. If really nowadays, as I say, a person should do whatever they want, but always prior payment of its price. Here appear an olive, an orange, and a melon, and you say, 'Order your actions by system, by order.' They're by size. A melon is larger than an orange, and an orange is smaller than an olive. No, because normally we have big problems, medium problems, and small problems. I think a big problem is the first to attack. After, if you have time left, you go to the medium and then the small, but don't waste time on the small because the big is what kills you. And let me ask you a question. How do you gain authority in a company? What is for you the formula for the businessman to be respected by the staff, by his people? There are many qualities, right? To be respectful precisely with others, so that they respect you, you have to respect them. And above all, with example. The example is very important. The word convinces, but the fact convinces more. And the truth is that a person must convince with facts, and a businessman is watched by society, consumers, workers, and society in general, so he must be sacrificial. The profession of businessman is not for someone who just wants to make money; it's a vocation. To be a bullfighter, indeed you need to have a vocation because you risk your life in each fight, but the businessman risks, why not, also his life; sometimes the excess of zeal can cause you an illness, but the truth is that you risk a lot: your prestige, money, and sometimes health, and many times subtracting from the family everything that many people can do, that the businessman with so much competition must be very attentive because if not, with this brutal competition, well, no, he cannot move forward. You dreamed of all this, of everything you were going to do, or it has been coming to you and building, or did you conceive it from the first moment? Did you think you really had no limits? Dream. Well, one thing I remember from when I was 9 years old, they asked me what I wanted to be when I grew up, as happens to all children. And at that time, I simply answered, 'I want to be something.' And they said, 'But that's not a profession.' I said, 'I didn't know; at 9 I didn't know, but people have restlessness. When you're a child, you have restlessness. What's important is that you try to motivate it.' And there are many reasons because we are composed of defects and virtues, so no one escapes having defects and also virtues. What you have to be is hardworking. I call it laziness. A person has not one laziness, but three lazinesses. That you hadn't told me. Yes, three lazinesses: physical laziness, mental laziness, and emotional laziness. Physical laziness is, oh, it's so cold, or it's so far to go now. Laziness, don't send that to your body. Intellectual laziness: don't bother me. Don't provoke your talent, what you have. That's another laziness. And there's another laziness that is emotional laziness, which is living like a slacker or living with passion. A minute is a gift from God. A minute is priceless. It has no price, a minute of life. Take advantage of it. Get out what you have. No, no, no, get out what you don't have, but what you have, yes. But what stops you from getting all that out is laziness, which is what restricts you from bringing it to light. So, you have to give it to laziness. Have you been very disappointed by many people, Tomás, throughout your life? Disappoint? I don't ask, I don't ask for what's given to me. I try to sow, and if a storm comes and the sowing is taken away, well, look, I sow again. Disappointment. Yes, there are things in life that disappoint you, but I think there are many things to do and you can't focus only on those things that demotivate you. You have to seek things that motivate you, because there are things that demotivate and also things that motivate. That's why the half-full or half-empty bottle, it's very important to see it half-empty because you see there's the possibility of filling it. That space in the bottle is what you have the obligation to fill. But for that, you need to have that spirit because I believe when a person is born, something very important is born, but the importance is that the person works on it. Many, I believe that society...

Success in life is not merely about power, success, and money. While those have great value, true success is the optimization of the self—bringing out the values you possess. One must be envious of one's own virtues, not those of others. Leave others' virtues to them, as they are theirs, not yours. Your virtues are what you must utilize, and that is what we strive to do to avoid demotivation at any moment.

Well, Murcia—I know Spain, Europe, and almost the entire world. I've traveled to many countries, and I feel proud to be Murcian. I think a Valencian can be proud to be Valencian, a Galician proud to be Galician, and even those from Bilbao or Andalusia. But I don't know if it's because, and this isn't complacency, simply bringing out the values Murcia has. It has a wonderful climate. Murcia has two fundamental values: agri-food and tourism. We have a good Mediterranean climate and also agriculture and livestock, precisely because agri-food—Murcia feeds many. For example, the other day I heard that with 5% of the water Murcia has, it exports 20% of all exports. Here, we need a bit more water, and I believe Spain in general would be grateful because we have entrepreneurial drive, demonstrated by the agri-food industry, agriculture, livestock, and even tourism in Murcia has much potential.

Yes, well, I was born in Murcia, I live in Murcia, and I feel proud, but it doesn't mean it's the best in the world. One arrives here and realizes all the things you've said about its attractions, its capabilities, but the people here are very enterprising and innovative.

Well, I believe more in the person than in the region or country. Each person is a world, and what one should worry about is discovering oneself before dying, because many people die without having realized they were phenomenal. That is the greatest pain and glory. I believe one goes to hell by omission sometimes, because you didn't want to bring out your potential due to laziness. Some say they couldn't, blaming time, others, but there are reasons. Whenever there is motivation, there is demotivation.

In the moment one dies, another is born. When one laughs, another cries. Life is like that, thanks to existence having 'have' and 'must.' What would accounting be without credits? But the balance is what matters for one's own consciousness, not power or money, but your own happiness. There's a phrase I liked: happiness doesn't consist in doing what you want, but in wanting what you do. One must be in love with it. We spend about 45 years from age 20 to 65 in a professional activity. Initially, perhaps for money to support our families, but there's something more important: personal fulfillment. I would replace 'work' with 'activity.' Working is when you do something you don't want to or are forced to do; otherwise, it's enjoyment. Even in a disco, someone dancing under loud music makes a great effort but does it with devotion, not obligation. So, transform obligation into devotion.

I admire many people who are positive, constructive, and contribute to society and humanity. I admire anyone who is such, and even those I don't admire, I respect everyone's right to their life because it's their life. Nature and society later reward or punish with prizes or consequences.

Any person, no matter how lazy or deviant, has the right to their life. You must put it to value because otherwise, why were you born? We must spend the life given well.

Hams were invented by the Phoenicians, who were seafarers. They took pork meat in wooden containers with salt, and it preserved and dried, undergoing a proteolysis process. That's why they're consumed in Italy, France, and Spain, with Spain being the largest producer. Spain consumes 47 million hams annually—each Spaniard eats one ham per year. In France, half a ham per person per year, and in Italy, a quarter. Spain is number one. However, as a Mediterranean product, in places like Australia, England, Japan, or North America, there are no consumption habits. But we've tested with people who never ate ham before, and they liked it. The human taste buds appreciate natural products like ham, similar to wine. I think very few people dislike good ham, though some products are called cured meat, not ham. Ham must age 1-2 years for Serrano and 2-4 years for Ibérico.

Ham remains for two to three years in the environment. The salting process requires a cool place, but then the microclimate helps with flora and natural development. We've seen that Jabugo in Huelva's sierra has a microclimate that favors the curing and drying process. Since ham must be there for two or three years, breathing that mountain air, we chose Jabugo from all over Spain.

Yes, some more. We'll produce based on market demand. We have our own livestock. ElPozo belongs to Grupo Corporativo Fuertes, which includes agriculture, livestock, slaughterhouses, cutting rooms, and drying facilities—controlling the entire process.

ElPozo belongs to Grupo Corporativo Fuertes, which has about twenty companies, mainly agri-food. ElPozo is the most important, the 'mother of the lamb.' But to give dimension to our viewers, we're talking about 4,500 people working here with a turnover of 1,000 million euros. Currently, being integrated with agriculture and livestock provides traceability, which is beneficial. Making a quality product requires many factors.

The winery has its team and managers, to whom we transmit ElPozo's culture of excellence and demand. For example, if a winery has 10 million liters of wine, perhaps only half or less is bottled, based on quality. Quality is part of our culture and philosophy. It's more valuable than what it costs, but you have to strive for it. When making a product, we first think of quality and then producing at a good price along production lines. Cloning that quality while maintaining good price is key. Quality is fundamental because it safeguards your future. If someone doesn't focus on quality, they're undermining their own roof.

We've seen the needs of society, consumers, and distribution, and we're adapting to what they want.

If asked where I'd like to be born, I'd choose Spain. I like Spain. Regarding politics, all countries have their nuances and leaders. Entrepreneurs are not politicians; entrepreneurs are long-term technical, socio-economic works, while negotiators are short-term economic works. Entrepreneurs develop social, technical, and economic aspects. A company must make money to reinvest and maintain facilities for quality and service.

More, even more. When I'm abroad, I'm eager to return to Spain. We have a country that must be in Europe, which is a guarantee. We have the climate, and I believe we have good food, good climate, and good people—Spain has good people. We're here between Andalusia and Valencia, neither speaking Valencian nor Andalusian. We're a uniprovincial region with charm, values, and inconveniences, like everywhere.

We've understood that perfection doesn't exist, like the ceiling of the sky. But we've found that 'less imperfection' does exist. That's why we strive, as we are laborers of problems, fighting against our imperfections. If you remove a calorie, you gain a frigorie—remove defects, and a virtue will incorporate itself.

Well, it took us over sixty years. This project wasn't done in a day, hour, or year. It required much work, effort, and teams of people working with enthusiasm and a desire to be useful to society and humanity.

Calories—human beings need about 100 calories, but we have a voracity of 3,000, sometimes 4,000 or 5,000. The body is intelligent; it stores excess calories for later use, in case you don't eat tomorrow. This is good advice: know your calorie intake based on exercise, and don't exceed reserves. Exercise is crucial; it burns calories and improves health. In nutrition, we offer a wide range so each person can choose suitable foods, avoiding intolerances or allergies. But exercise is key—doing both, one will live many years.

In Christmas, the word 'Navidad' is beautiful and joyful, and turkey is part of it. Turkey is between chicken and pork—it's not white meat like chicken or pink like pork. It's a pinkish meat, a discovery for me. It has superior texture and flavor to chicken. Pork loin is lean without the calories of fat, but fat has many calories. Today, consumers need education on nutrition, not just knowing geography, but what to include in their diet. We make diverse products to suit each person.

It's about feeling useful in this world. If any of our discussion helps someone, we'll feel rewarded. Many thanks, and until next week, if God wills. It has been a pleasure.