Three finance heavyweights have been openly warning about the credit market and say that they are getting deja vu. Danny Moses from the big short believes the private credit push into retail products reminds him of the beginning of the 2008 crash. Jamie Dimon who loves to warn about the industry says that he's seeing parallels to the financial crisis. But Boaz Weinstein saying the wheels are coming off for private credit. Let's discuss the Tikehau Capital co-founder Mathieu Chabran. His firm oversees more than $60 billion dollars, about 46 of which is in private debt. No one else you'd want to talk with right now.
Well, I mean it's real because you know when you're investing in credit, there is some risk that you need to underwrite and I think that people had lost sight that there could be effectively some work to be done in credit. So it's great to see this movement in the market and I think it comes down to the fundamental of credit which is are you financing cash flow, do you have an asset coverage, and all of a sudden people wake up to the fact that effectively over the past few years some may have used credit as a proxy to equity, and when you're financing some ARR based company, you must wake up at some point to this credit cycle. So overall, yes, there are some actions taking place in the market, but for the better. You know, I
If I were to look out at this dispersion because there always is this thing of maybe it's less transparent so it's hard to find. If I'm to look out and say where have the mistakes been made, what would I look for?
Well, the first of all, in my view is when you started having an asset liability mismatch and this huge development in the private market of this open-ended fund, semi-liquid fund, pushed to retail. By the way, sometimes when people realize that they want out, you've got this mismatch. I mean, we're not trading QIP based securities, those are private assets. We saw that a couple of years ago on the real estate side, and you remember the headlines there. So now it's coming to credit. So I think it's the right asset with the wrong structure. I think there is a silver lining there for sure in my view, which is you can still use this type of structure but by not promising some outperforming return, not having so much leverage in the system, and coming back to the basics of asset underwriting.
Yeah, I mean to me, Boaz Weinstein really captured it when he said the problem is they convinced investors that this was the greatest invention since the internet, private credit, right when it really was just lending money to small companies. So how do you see the wheels on the car? Are they coming off? Is it that bad? Or is this just the kind of blip that Mark Lipshult says they've been through before?
Yeah. Well, if I may, the people saying that is that they want to take the opportunity to park their garbage truck and try to fill in with everything they could,
Which by the way, Boaz Weinstein, of course, did buy some of what was sold off of Blue Owl. And he wants to take, I mean he has really taken the gloves off that guy. No, but I mean listen, as you were saying Danny, the secondary private credit that is a new asset class in itself. I mean, you know what happened to the private equity secondaries that has grown over the past 20 years. I mean, now that the golden age of this new asset class for sure, because you're going to be providing liquidity to an illiquid asset class otherwise, but with the right structure. I mean, you guys here at the BDCs, right, the BDC market is nothing else than effectively a private credit fund which is supposed to address its liquidity on its own through the market, and effectively right now those BDCs are trading at a discount. They're generating a double-digit yield, and that's a great data point to reset the market. So, and of course, we should mention you just raised a very large secondary private credit fund, $1 billion. So you hear stories of Blue Owl is selling some of their BDC exposure. New Mountain Capital, what does it actually look out there? Is there a fire sale happening right now?
Actually, you know, the private market are not reacting as aggressively maybe as the public market if you're looking at the stock price. The processes are still orderly in an orderly manner for sure. The price discovery here, you have to do the work, and the numbers that some of the people externalize where they sold their private credit asset is actually not that distressed. People expecting for some distress. I think it's certainly too early because yes, you want
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Chabran, M. (2026, April 7). Co-Founder Mathieu Chabran on Bloomberg’s Open Interest [Interview transcript]. Tikehau Capital. CEOInterviews.AI. https://ceointerviews.ai/interview/1127902/
MLA
Mathieu Chabran. "Co-Founder Mathieu Chabran on Bloomberg’s Open Interest." Tikehau Capital, 7 Apr. 2026. Transcript, CEOInterviews.AI, https://ceointerviews.ai/interview/1127902/.
BibTeX
@misc{chabran2026_1127902,
author = {Mathieu Chabran},
title = {Co-Founder Mathieu Chabran on Bloomberg’s Open Interest},
howpublished = {Interview transcript, Tikehau Capital. CEOInterviews.AI},
year = {2026},
month = {apr},
url = {https://ceointerviews.ai/interview/1127902/},
note = {Speaker-attributed transcript with timestamps}
}
