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Welcome back to The First Million Is Always the Hardest. Today we're joined by one of the most recognized operators in American business, Marcus Lemonis. Known for The Profit and The Fixer TV shows, Marcus has built a career in buying, restructuring, and scaling businesses across fragmented industries. Marcus represents a different model of entrepreneurship, one rooted not just in starting but in acquiring, improving, and scaling what already exists. As keynote speaker for the 2026 Achieve Summit, he brings a powerful perspective on ownership, acquisition, and what it really takes to build lasting value at scale. Welcome to The First Million Is Always the Hardest, our podcast. Even though the name is talking about money, we actually care about a lot more than that. Impact is an important element of what we do, and we are so excited to have you as our keynote for the Achieve Summit 2026, which is June 4th through 6th at the Wind Creek Casino. You know, I want to confess that our mission as the Southland Development Authority is to focus on ways of growing the south suburbs of Chicago. So we represent 45 cities, towns, and villages that represent about 700,000 people. So bigger than the population of Boston, bigger than DC, but very diverse. And I know you're from the area, so we've got corn and soybean farmers that are next to sprawling suburban homes that are next to very densely populated neighborhoods like Harvey, all within the same area. So it's very unique relative to the rest of the country. But one of the things that is true for us that's also true for a lot of other places is there's this huge change that's taking place, the silver tsunami, which I'm sure you've heard quite a lot about. But in our areas, we have a lot of businesses that are ready for people to retire and move. And so there's this huge need for both generational wealth and knowledge transfer. And we decided, and part of the reason we have our conference, is that there are certain populations that have been overlooked that can play a really important role in this. One of them is women. You know, since COVID, women have been the largest number of entrepreneurs in the United States, and women of color in particular have been the largest subsegment. Another population we think is overlooked are veterans. Veterans have a difficult time translating their experiences in the military to jobs that are in corporate America, but much of their experience we think fits very well in the context of being an entrepreneur, particularly buying a business, which we really try to encourage people. The last population may be a little counterintuitive for people, but particularly young folks, we're really targeting folks that are coming out of grad schools and encouraging them to become entrepreneurs and to facilitate their effort to buy a business. And one of the reasons in particular that I wanted you is I had a chance last summer to see you at the entrepreneur conference in Vegas. And there was a woman that you called out of the crowd randomly and asked her to talk about her business. And in the process of that, it revealed that both her son and her husband had died within the same year. And one of the things that really got me was most people when that happens are so taken aback that it was hard to engage. And you didn't run from it. You engaged this woman in a way that I thought really demonstrated your emotional EQ in a way that I thought, wow, this person is keyed into people in a way that's really important. It's very different than the way other people would. And you spent a good amount of time with that woman and did it in such a way that I think she walked away, despite standing up in front of 500 people, she walked away feeling protected in the way that you engaged her. And that really stuck with me as something that said, okay, that's the person that we want to engage with the population that we're trying to encourage to take a risk that might not seem evident that they are situated to take that risk. And I'm just curious, when you think about your background, what are the things that have occurred in your life that gave you the capacity to really not run from a very potentially personally charged situation to really key in on what are the elements about that person that you could facilitate that might be different than what other people would do, and how does that translate into the people that you decide to support or not?
For me, business is really about relationships. And in order to have a really good relationship with anybody, professionally or personally, there has to be a significant degree of empathy. There has to be a significant degree of listening and there has to be a significant degree of humanity. And unfortunately, we're living today, 2026, in a society where I believe that humanity has kind of left the room, and everything feels very transactional and it feels very remote. And when I engage with a business owner, a current one or an aspiring one, it's trying to really understand, maybe from my own perspective and why I'm motivated to do things, what the context of their motivation is. And when you think about small business owners, medium business owners, I like to call them local business owners, folks that are just getting started that haven't built a regional brand or a national business, you start to wonder what their motivations are. Why are they choosing to pursue this path? And for me, and maybe the reason that the emotional connection is easier for me, is I know why I chose to be in business. I know why I'm attracted to business. I know why I love being involved with other people in business. And that is a great, immense, insatiable appetite for relationships with people. And in that process, what I end up learning more than anything else, Bo, is that context matters. And when I met that woman, and I remember it very distinctly, and I was taken aback by it, and it was one of those moments where you emotionally think she suffered significant loss. Do I want to get away from that or can I relate to that and do I want to create a connection? And that has to happen in a millisecond, but you have to be hotwired to be open to that idea, and most people are not.
No, that really is what struck me, is that most people would have run and instead you leaned into it. And I felt that in that moment because you leaned into it, what you did is you gave license for her to talk about it openly in an environment that maybe she wouldn't normally, but it also gave license to other people to kind of feel that emotion. And your point about what is your reason for why you're doing this, why do you want to be an entrepreneur, really sticks with me. I'll tell you one of mine is the idea that I could be in a position to actually help feed people's families. I find that to be sacred. I find that to be something that I'm really proud of and it's one of the drivers for me of why I've been an entrepreneur since I was 8 years old in one form or another. I wasn't feeding anybody's family at 8, but as I've gotten older being in that position, you mentioned your why, but what is that why?
Well, you know, we come onto this earth, God puts us on this earth, and regardless of what someone's religion is or beliefs are, they have to believe in something, some sort of faith in some kind. And my belief is that I was put here for a reason. And that there are things that are wonderful about me and there are things that are not wonderful about me and knowing when to use those things matters. And for me, the identification of understanding how to relate to people in business, understanding how to educate people in a way that they can absorb, understanding how to fight for those folks who others will not, it's probably more of a function of me feeling like I needed people to fight for me. I'm an adopted child from a foreign country. No brothers and sisters, no cousins, no aunts, no uncles of any significance, and my parents who adopted me are now gone. I look for connections with humanity. And while I'm married and I have a wonderful connection with my wife, outside of my wife, my only connection to humanity is business. And my why is a deep, deep-seated attraction to two things. One, to be a part of something. Two, to allow other people to be a part of something so they don't feel like moments of time where I felt. And business is that one thing.
It's the greatest gift, privilege. I call it a privilege to be able to own a business or be the manager of a business, because not everybody necessarily is going to start by being an owner. You could start by being a leader and being the manager and then over time buy it from the person that wants to retire. But the blessing in all of that is that you, much like you said, you have the ability to be the shepherd of somebody else in your town, in your community, in your city, in your state, and bring people along and know that every decision you make has a direct impact on the rest of their life and families. I think, look, you're going to meet plenty of speakers and read plenty of books and talk to plenty of people who are going to say, 'I decided to get in business because I'm a capitalist and I want to make money.' Right? By definition, a business has to make money. It has to, or it's a hobby.
Yeah, it has to make money because in order for you to feed your own family and to feed other people's families, you have to have a profit. And this idea that I want to do it to give back, I want to do it to change the world, I would say to people like, stop. You want to do it to change your life and you want to do it to change the people that you are responsible for's lives and you want to do it to serve the customers that allow you and your employees to live your life. That's it. That's the small bubble. You don't need to solve world hunger. We're not asking to do that. But we are asking you to take care and custody of those people. What a great privilege.
One of the things that we say, so Southland Development Authority is actually a not-for-profit organization, but we're a little different because we were formed in the middle of COVID and so we had to operate remotely. We had to focus instead of bringing big companies for new jobs to the area, we had to focus on all the businesses that already exist. That turned out to be a blessing because it forced us to work with everybody who had already made the decision to be here. They already made an investment. They were local by nature as you were describing. And that changed our model of how we operate. And so one of the things we say is there is no mission without money. You know, yes, our goal is not to make money, but without making money, we actually do not get to carry on our mission. And our mission is bigger than all of us. We are trying to promote the wealth of individuals, businesses, and municipalities. And therefore, with everything we do, we need to find out a way to make it profitable. And most investors, as you know, and you may not be in this camp, are lemmings, not leaders, as I like to say. They typically don't want to be at the forefront of any risk or any new idea. They want to do it after someone else has proven it. And we've made a point of our organization as a not-for-profit is best positioned to take the risk that the private market won't take. So if we're not taking that risk, we can't prove to them that they should take the risk. But if we can't make money at it, the private sector surely doesn't think they can make money at it.
I want to address something that you said for other folks that want to lead in a nonprofit. You use the word profit. I want to use the word cash flow. And I want any business of any kind, profit or not-for-profit, to understand that you have to generate cash flow. And the difference between a nonprofit and a for-profit is that a nonprofit will reinvest that cash flow into programs, into people, into other things, whereas a business for-profit may reinvest some but may return capital to its owner, its shareholders, its lenders, its investors. And so, but the path to get to that line is the same. The discipline to get to that line is the same. The responsibility to get to that line is the same. And over the years, I've worked with a number of nonprofits. And by the way, that is a business.
Absolutely. It's a business. You're serving a different constituency, but it is a business. It requires you to have the right people. It requires you to actually set up rules and guardrails and process. Sometimes even more discipline because the revenue that gets generated, the goal is for that nonprofit to have something to reinvest or to grant or to do. And if you don't do that, you've eaten up all this money. And so when I think about generating income, I think about generating cash flow and the line only splits. And if you are an entrepreneur today who doesn't like to sell things, you're not a natural-born salesperson or you don't like asking people for money in a different way, that doesn't mean that you can't be in the business world. You could be providing a social service as a nonprofit, but it's still a business. You could be providing education or you could be running the corner barber shop or dry cleaner or dress shop or bakery or restaurant or tree trimming service. The list goes on and on. But what you're really doing is you're saying, 'I want to wake up every morning. I want to serve. I want to solve a problem for people. And I would like to be compensated for my work, my intelligence, and I want my people to be taken care of.' That's it. In the most simplest form, that's what a business is.
That's it. But you know the one thing I will slightly differ with you is that the art of storytelling is everything. The one thing that makes America distinct is we are really good storytellers. May not always be about the truth, but we tell a story really well. And I tell all of my peers, because I didn't come from the not-for-profit space, I came from the for-profit space. If you can't tell your story effectively, you can't hire people. You can't find partnerships. You can't raise money. You actually can't even demonstrate to the communities that you serve that you are serving them, because they rely on that story as a way to digest the information that you're providing them. So I agree with most of what you said.
But what's the different part? But what's the different part? Well, I think the only thing I heard differently was the idea it's okay if you're not always able to generate the story, as I heard you say it. No. Okay. I may have misheard what you were saying.
No, no, no, no. Because story isn't the right word. I want to challenge that. Purpose. My purpose is a narrative. Why does my business exist? Why do I exist? People like to say it's a story. And I'm not challenging the concept. I'm challenging why do I exist? Do customers, do potential employees, does my community, my bank, everybody else, do they understand why I exist and what purpose I'm intended to serve and how I'm going to do that? That's the same as the story, right? I'd like to wrap it in like, why do I exist?
Yeah. Well, you know, interestingly enough, in the transition, one of the things I've noticed about your businesses that is, it doesn't have to be unique, but I think is more unique than it should be, that you've tended to focus on businesses where there was the ability to create these really vibrant communities, right? Not just that they were consumers of your product, but they were people who were actually going to talk to each other. Now, this is a little funny. So, I'm actually an RVer from time to time in a camper. And I tell people that when black families go out and RV and camp, it's like other people walk the forest and it's like they saw Sasquatch, right? They stop and take a double take like, 'Wait a minute. Did I see what I, it wasn't just one person. It was a whole family.' And we go on a regular basis and go out because I really love the outdoors in that way and I love that spirit. But that community is more than just consumers, right? They are talking to one another. And as I look at some of the things you've invested in, it appears to me that your effort around branding is really keyed in on the idea of having these people who love your product talk to one another as much as it is that they are actually buying your product. And I just wanted to get a sense of, is that an accurate take? How do you think about that? How does that differ for you versus others?
I think I'll go back to why do I exist? Why does this business exist? And the businesses that I like to be involved in exist to solve a problem. The reason that I love the RV space or the reason that I love the home space now with Bed Bath and Container Store and all these other brands is because I see a total addressable market. And every business owner should think like, if I want to be in business, is the product or service I'm going to sell relevant? And then secondly, is there an audience for it? And so when I decided to get into the RV business years ago, I was trying to understand what the industry existed long before I ever came around. It'll exist long after I'm gone. But what could I do in the period that I have a presence inside of a space, an industry, a segment? And I'm not an RVer. You've RVed more than I have. But what I love about it is that I love that people want to be with their family, want to be in the outdoors, want to see different parts of this country, want to unhook and unlock from screen time and noise and phones and internet and all the nonsense. And they want to build love and they want to build trust and community with their family, with their friends. They could do it tailgating. So what I liked is I liked the idea of what they were doing. What I saw as the problem is that there was not one company that stitched it all together to make it simpler and more affordable. And I wasn't going to change the idea. My goal was never to try to take the person outside in New York City and say you should go camping. It was never about creating millions and millions of converters. I wasn't selling a religion. I was ingesting myself into a lifestyle that already existed, trying to make it more understandable and simpler to execute for those who were there, which would ultimately make it easier for people who are contemplating it to get in. And yes, it's around community for sure, but it was around why do I exist? What am I going to do differently to leave my thumbprint on something that needs it?
Do you get that knot in your stomach every Sunday night? You've checked all the boxes. Career, title, income. But if you're honest, this is not the life you imagined. What if the problem isn't you? It's the design of your life. I'm Bo. I help high performers redesign their lives for freedom, purpose, and real wealth. Join my master class and I'll walk you through the exact framework. Go to lifedesign.com. Your new chapter doesn't start someday, it starts now. You're listening to The First Million Is Always the Hardest. We are now returning to the show. Well, when you think about entering and buying a business, whether it's an add-on to an existing platform or even something that's new, I'm curious, in your assessment, what is harder: to repair a broken brand, to repair a broken culture, or to repair a broken customer promise?
The hardest thing is to repair a broken owner and a broken manager. I tend to have a gravity towards the misfit toys, only because I'm in the same toy box with them. And I tend to be really interested in a couple of things when I'm looking at a business. One, am I excited by it? Do I like it? Is it fun? Is it interesting? Do I have an affinity for it? I rarely have invested in a business or bought a business that I didn't have excitement around, because if you don't have the excitement, it's like, well, I need to be married, so let me just marry anybody. No, I want to be married to somebody that I'm excited to be with. I want to be in business with people that I like to be with. I want to sell a product or service that I believe is something that's good. And I think you have to start with that. I think the second thing is, do I like the people that I'm going to work with? And business owners, potential business owners, buyers of businesses have to put on a special set of glasses and say, 'Do I like the business?' Yes or no. We covered that. Do I like the people that work there? Could I see myself being part of that culture? Yes or no? And if I'm on the fence about it, why is it? Because I feel like the culture is too capitalistic, or the culture is too non-consumer friendly, or the culture is not investing enough in training? What's missing from that? What I will walk away from a business for, and what I would want anybody that ever listens to this to walk away from an opportunity to buy a business, invest in a business, or be part of a business to walk away from, is you can't do business with knuckleheads. And you can't do business with people that don't love themselves and love others. And when I say love themselves, that doesn't mean think that they're the most important thing, but have self-respect and to have a knowledge of why they exist. They're there to be servants, to understand the product. And if you find people that, oh, it's a great deal. The returns are amazing, but I don't really like the people, but the place makes great money. Usually, in the end, those things fall apart. I would much prefer to invest in the people that own the business or work there. We're like-minded in how we think about life. We're like-minded in how we think about the customer. We're like-minded in how we think about selling our product or delivering our service. And where there's a disjointment is, gosh, they don't really have the technical things right. The technology is missing. They don't understand their supply chain. They're not great marketers. And so you should buy a business for its capability and you should fix a business to make the capability more efficient and yield something for it. But you have to also be capable.
So if you told me, okay, I'm going to bring you 10 businesses and all the people are amazing and they all have something missing from them that makes them not as good of a business as it could be, how would you start to parse those out?
Well, I would start saying like, okay, there's 10. Let me get rid of all the ones that I either know nothing about or I'm not excited about. Great. What's the next thing? Let me get rid of the ones that I think the technology can crush it and it's easily beatable. Okay, great. Let me get rid of the ones where I don't like the culture of the business and I don't like how consumers feel about them.
How they think about them. I don't like how they think about each other. Let me get rid of those. And what you get down to is businesses that you and I'll reverse it. You like the business, you're excited about it. You think the people that you could have like a snack with them and you wouldn't want to run away. And you think that you can add something to their existing capability where the yield goes from X to Y. And it is that simple. I think too often people want to buy businesses that they think are cool or they think people are going to like, you know, they're going to be able to influence the outcome, but they have no aptitude around it. And I see that happen a lot. Oh, I found this business. It's a bar and I've always wanted to own a bar. Well, why?
Yeah, that's a tough, that's a tough gig. Bars and restaurants are tough.
Unless you work them. And if your life allows you to be able to do that and you want to dedicate your life to serving customers all the time, which is 24/7 in a business like that, then you should do it.
Yeah. Well, you know, it kind of leads me to I think one of the most difficult things that investors have to deal with, that you went through the filtering process. You got down to someone that you actually decided to invest in, but now you're really evaluating to what degree can the business be rescued and to what degree should I allow this thing to die? And those are always the most difficult questions. But how do you kind of screen through that process for yourself?
I would say that that's part of my filter process. Do I believe that there's a total addressable market here? And do I believe that ultimately there's something viable? I tend to be maybe the wrong person to ask because I don't want any business to ever close and I'm idealist in a lot of ways. When I find great people with a good idea but they just can't find their feet, I have made several mistakes over the years where I have chased things because I fell in love with them and I missed one of my filter checks or I fell in love with them or I became enamored by the idea or I let my ego get in the way or I looked at a business that was struggling and I still have a tendency to do it today but I've gotten better at it to believe that I could fix everything or fix everyone. And so if you're out there thinking about buying a business, I would strongly encourage you not to believe that you're the only solution that could happen because if you're wrong, the business goes bad. Finding the perfect balance between being practical and being passionate matters. I'm passionate about snow cones. Really, really, really passionate about snow cones. I love the syrup. I love the whole deal. But I would not buy a snow cone business in Buffalo.
Because I would know that my addressable market was short. And so you have to start thinking practically once you get to like what are the numbers, how do they present them. We didn't cover something that I need to come back to, which is what's the most important filter after understanding that you like the people and all those things are great is the data that the business is providing you, the financial reporting that it's providing you.
Yes. Because if it's not, you either have to A, invest money and time to reverse engineer what the actual results are, which is possible, or B, you have to not do the transaction.
Yeah, I would add to that timely as another one.
Before you write a check.
Well, no, meaning that the information has to be accurate, but it also has to be timely. Oh, like in the last couple months, not seven years ago.
