Moving Iron: Smart Evaluation Wins—In Auctions, Farming, and Football

Yeah, pretty good. Machine. Yeah. Machine Greg Peterson machine repeat that. Hey, tongue twister. That's good. Fox and socks.

No, I have not seen that.

I uh my tongue gets tied without any tongue twisters. So, it doesn't doesn't really matter.

Uh, actually a little warmer this week. Uh, we haven't had any snow for a while. So, uh, weatherman up here says looks dry through the end of January. A little bit warmer, but uh, not too bad. I did get down to Arkansas last week. That was fun. Was right in the northeast corner in Pocahontas. Um, our friend Kirk Witcher with Witcher Auctions has just a outstanding farm auction coming up on Thursday the 22nd. So, a week from Thursday, it's for Hill Farms. There's going to be some uh test the market items on that sale across the board. He's got a 23 model uh Stiger 470 Quadra with 73 hours on it. He's got a never used 24 model KH 550T 40ft air drill. Uh father and son operation there. Uh Rocky

No, they were in uh was it a father and son? Rocky and Seth uh Hill. I'll be posting the preview video. Great guys. They were in the rice business for about 10 years and they're of course you know that's tough tough sledding there. So they're repositioning focusing investing more on the poultry and livestock side of their business and they've been flooded out on the rice side. I didn't get to plant it all last year. Um, and I think flooded out like four of the last eight or something like that. They got three rivers running close there, northeast Arkansas. So, a lot of this equipment they bought, uh, just didn't get the usage. But, uh, yeah, they got a a Shellorn Reynolds RSD 32 foot stripper head used, 150 hours total. So, just a lot of late model stuff. So, again, that's on the

And it was fun to go hang out with Kirk Witcher. He's really growing his auction company down there. Kirk's a good guy. And uh should be I think that's an evening sale like 6:00 p.m. online farm auction on the 22nd. So can have my dinner and uh watch auction prices.

Well, there's a lot of restructuring out there. Um, you know, moving out of certain areas, cotton or rice, and I'm no expert on following acreage and number of shifting out of things, but uh, you know, farmers just have to pivot and that's just what uh, Rocky and Seth said, you know, we're just pivoting away from the rice side of things and, uh, you know, got all this stuff. But it is interesting at auction Casey when you see stuff like this, people, it's natural, human nature. you go, "What the heck? Why is a three-year-old staggered 470 quad has 73 hours on it?" And I just find it helpful in those cases to hear, you know, Rocky or Seth in this case just say, "Well, here's the deal." And you can absorb it as you take it. Um now, it was not not a forced deal at all. They're just they're just pivoting. Uh in fact, they're building new poultry facilities down there. So, it's just, you know, it kind of just is what it is.

Yeah, for sure. For sure.

Yeah, that was a really I thought a really strong sale Saturday, Casey. It was in um North Manchester, Indiana, which I I admit I don't frankly know where that is in Indiana off the top of my head, but it was a sale for uh I think the farm family was named Halpert. H A U P R T Halpert Farms retirement sale and kind of a similar sale, late model, low hour stuff. It was by Harmire Auction Appraisal Company. Um did a really good job promoting that sale. And a couple items that caught my eye, Casey, they had a 24 model Junior S760 combine. Uh it had 556 engine hours on it, 338 SE, and sold for 385,000, which that's the thing with these used combines. It's interesting. You can look at a lot of different ways, but from my angle, that's the second highest auction price ever on a S760. And interestingly, the only one higher was just barely higher, 389. That was back in uh get the right date for you here to be precise. It was mid December of 23 Monroeville, Ohio. I think Merit Auctions had that sale. That was a 22 model but only had 151 engine hours. And again, this one Saturday at 556 at 385. But we've been talking about a number of down the stretch here in 25 quite a bit, early 26 about how the lack of new sales of 24, 5 and now 26 model stuff is starting to have some ramifications through the chain down in the used market. And I think proof of that here on a now just barely 2-year-old machine, which I realize, you know, retail price on that was quite high. But again, I you know, I I keep track of that stuff, but also deal in the hard cash checkbook reality world and 385 was was more than I thought it was going to bring.

It's going to be a big number. It's a big number no matter what, but it's it was probably I'm totally guessing here. It was somewhere probably in in the uh the high fours. I'm guess like 485ish would be my guess.

As that price of new has escalated so much. You're right. It's just the uh the hit the initial hit. Yeah, that's a significant dollars. And I think that is why when I travel around Casey and go to auctions and have been out to a lot lately, it very common to get people come up to me and they'll, you know, often times verbalize it and say, "Pete, wow, what a bloodbath on the sale." And I think what gets where their head is at is looking at that price of the new one, which you know is is certainly one data point. Um uh the reason I started doing this 36 almost and a half years ago was to take out some of the gut level uh conjecture that we all used to have to make whether you were on the dealer side on the auction side as a as a farmer. And so again, when that hard cash write me a check today, 385 again based on what I'd been seeing bring, even though it was that 24 model with 556R. That's more than I thought. And another interesting data point on combines from just that same day, Casey, last this past Saturday, so two days ago as we're recording this, but our friend Bryant Robersonson with Rich and Rich Auctioneers out in the southeast at an online farm auction Saturday night. And that one was in Charles City, Virginia. And kind of the lead item on that sale was a 15 model S670 21 402 engine hours on it and it brought 102,000. And I thought, well, that that sounds maybe a little higher than I thought. So I went and looked in our machine repeat auction price data and really interesting. Last year in 25 the average auction price on a S670 was was 85,462 bucks. Now in 24 that average on a S670 was 80,924. So when I tell people actually an S670 went up 5.6% at auction last year, I get stares like what are you talking about? Yeah, that's just what the numbers are. Now behind that is the fact that how much they dropped like a rock in 23 and four. In 23 they fell 23.7% hard cash auction followed by 24 they fell 19.8%. So but again that there's that solidifying we've been talking about for quite a while now. So this you know that's a 10 year old 11y old combine. Um and that S600 series made from what 12 to 17. So give or take either side 10 years it's firming up. And uh again that just sold Saturday.

23.7. Yep. 23.7 then 19 is some change in 24. If you do the math on that, that's that's 52% that that

That that that came off in and it's what drove the marketplace of COVID was supply and demand, right? It was there was a total lack of supply and a lot of demand, right? and and then you had a all the supply hit at one time and it there was not the demand actually the demand probably didn't really really change um uh for a lot of things but it just the amount of supply that was out there and and what it was was driving that and then again so you had this big decrease in value but you know it's it's a tough conversation to have with somebody when you're sitting there talking about hey you know what I'm going to uh take this auction and then, you know, get 65 cents on the dollar. Well, I hear you. But that in today's marketplace, those numbers are are are what you would expect to see happen on a 2-year-old machine with those kind of hours.

Yeah. I mean what we've talked about it before but what is the auction company doing or what are they not doing? I mean to obviously internet bidding is huge and that takes care of a lot of it but there was a reason I was in Pocahontas Arkansas on last Thursday and you know Kirk Witcher and those two brother or father and son are having this sale. They wanted me there because I think when you put it in voice like I like standing there with my iPhone and saying, "Seth, why does your 470 quad have 73 hours on it?" And then Seth will explain, "Well, you know, we're getting out of rice and stuff." Again, it's personal. And I I do find uh you know, I get hit with this as I go all over the country. And again, I I understand where it comes from, this big gap between new and used. Um, but if we dive deeper on those S670s, that's really interesting because we talked about how much they fell 23 and four. They bumped up a little bit so far. Well, in 25 and our friend Bryant just sold that 15 model Saturday night for 102, which I thought was pretty good. The current average dealer advertised price on a S670 is 111,980 bucks. And so my old my machine repeat ratio average auction price versus average dealer ad price 76.3%. So 26 years ago when I started compiling average dealer ad price on 2-year-old stuff, 20-y old stuff, 10 71 to 76 is right in the stable window. And so when we've been talking about stabilizing this last year, that's proof of it right there. And it's uh again, I just encourage people to really plug into these trends and be aware of them even as you're talking to your lender. Uh it's just so dangerous to go off of a kind of a gut level, oh things things are down in the dumps or things are, you know, how much are we talking about? So, you got to be specific. And that's hopefully what our data has helped people get a handle on over the last 36 years.

The market is really never wrong. It just is what it is on a certain day. Whether you're talking land values or used machinery, we don't have to like it, but boy, you better be aware of it. And it's uh again, I I found it interesting that sale these two sales Saturday, Casey, because here we are approaching mid January. So these now we stripped out to whatever extent you think there was, you know, or I might think there was froth in the market in December, which I think there was. Um there there's no year end tax buyers last Saturday. They just they're just looking for that right machine, whether it's a 10-y old combine in Charles City, Virginia, or the 2-year-old one in North Manchester, Indiana. And again, I just I start it's it's just looking more clear to me that uh I'm not saying we're anywhere near 21 and two in terms of used inventory record tight levels, but it's so much tighter than it was say at two years ago at the start of 24. Um and you track that more than anybody volume of late model units on the market. And I think it's starting. That's why I think that S 760 went as high as 385 on on Saturday.

Well, we're going to have a good test on that sale. I mentioned on the 22nd Casey down in Arkansas Pocahontas. So, they've got uh we talked about the tractors, but they've got a 19 model case 8250 542 set powers on it. So, if you're in the market for that 5-ish year old tri combine, here's one with Now, again, you could look and say, I'm in Minnesota, so historically people used to say, well, Arkansas, it's pretty far south. You know, it it's south of here. It's a rice machine. Had the chrome package on it, whatever. You can hear the owners talk about it. It's only got 542 sub hours. So, we'll see on Thursday the 22nd in the evening what a 70-year-old 8250 with hardly any hours on it is worth. U yeah, that's the beauty and the power and the brutal honesty of the auction market at work. It's just it's going to bring what it's going to bring. Sometimes they trend up and like we documented in 24 and back in 1415, you know, it fell like a rock. So, um you know, we shall see.

Yeah it'll it'll be interesting. Um, and I some other interesting data points last week, Casey. I mean, again, the P-DEF stuff is continuing to do what it's doing. We saw an '05 8320 that Big Iron sold. I think it was out of Brockton, Illinois last Wednesday. A guy's name was Larry Upgraph. I think it was his online farm retirement auction. Low hours for an05, what 20 plus years old now. 2267 hours. You expect there to be a premium and brought 134. So again, when you let

Well, that's the highest in 23 months hard cash auction.

By I've been looking for a a car for my wife for, you know, I'm always looking, right? So what's where's the deal at out there? But you know, there's some of these if you just look at a at a basic I'm just SUV. You pick you picked, you know, whether you're looking at a Ford GM or whatever it is you're looking at, right? fullsize SUV, you're you're gonna be spending $65,000 just to get the four wheels and the windows, you know? I mean, that's that's, you know, like I told a guy one day, I was down here looking at a car. I was like, I just want to I don't want to drive it. I don't want to live in it. So, I don't I don't need I don't know where you're This one was like it was a $100,000 thing. It was not like an Escalade or anything like that. It was just a it was a you know I a well equipped equipped car you know and I was so I was looking at that going like man that's you start doing the math on that in your head and you just dividing by 72 and you come up real quick with a thousand plus dollar a month payment and and I'm thinking to myself at what point in time does that but then you go look at a at a used one that's got 40,000 miles on it 50,000 miles on it and it's not that much cheaper than the new one is, right? So,

I think we might have also further defined the K-shaped economy, Casey, because on the one hand, oldest fleet of vehicles ever on US roads. So, people stretching out how long they hold their cars, but sales of new vehicles have gone up. So, that tells you the people on the top part of the K are flush. They're doing well. They're spending money. They can drop 100K on that, whatever. And if you're on the other part of that K, it's Katie bar the door, buckle down, and hold on with white knuckles to what you got. And it's not fun.

That's really interesting. If you want uh confirmation of what you just said, go back to our Twitter feed, Machine Repeat, and find that post I made Saturday, I think, Saturday morning when I read that. And I just again, I just posted, hey, average age of US fleet of vehicles on the road, 12.8 all-time record high. Look at the comments. Some of it pertains to the price of news or is a joke. I don't want to pay that. Some of it is like the new stuff. I don't like it as much as the older simpler stuff. But then there's like the the whole payment factor. You're saying, well, so it's just all across the broad spectrum. People are chiming in with their take on it. But it's all based around accurate data, which again I that's the thing that I like to cement the conversation on is okay, what are we talking about here? And uh I just think on our farm equipment end of things, the used market again, it surprised me when it started to solidify so quickly last year back in February and that it held all year. And it surprised me when it went up a little bit in November, December. And it surprised me some of these early first big test cases in January have been so strong. But again, the market is not wrong. It's just reflecting all the mix of factors we're talking about, right?

Yeah. If you can find uh the widest point of that supply side, whatever model year and I've always written the auction data that for 36 years tracking it. We talk about it a lot, Casey, but that kind of I say three to seveny old is is really a great value place to land if you're buying on on the farmer side because that big depreciation bump we talked about the one two three-year-old stuff. But then again, like just like that S670 sold in Virginia Saturday night, a 102 hard cash that's solidifying and holding. And so you get yourself into that 3 to seveny old spot with the nicest lowest hour stuff you can get. call your dealer. There's good stuff on the lot. There's plenty at auction, for sale, private, whatever. But that's still a good value play in my book. And then uh if you get to be 10 years old and still have low hours on it, you're going to be in a really strong place whether you want to trade that or sell it outright or have an auction. Come and have an auction.

Yeah, I love it. Hey, thanks for uh stirring the conversation all these weeks, Casey. And, uh I'm glad to see the sun is shining out there in Scots.

Oh, well, I I am a Big 10 boy, Minnesota. So, our golfers haven't been to the Rose what used to be the Rose Bowl since ' 62. So, our dad taught us once the golfers were out, cheer for the Big 10. And uh it is cool to see Indiana uh do what they've been doing. And I'm so old, Casey. I remember the last undefeated college basketball national champion was the University of Indiana. 50 years ago exactly March of 76. So how cool if the Hooers now can do it on the football side. Yeah. And I know that's getting into paying players and stuff like that. It's kind of wild, but it is pretty cool to see the University of Indiana just come out and beat the tar out of some traditional powers. It shows you what's possible, I guess. Yeah.

Yeah, I've got a couple of Miami references that might make you smile. Now, one, we got a shout out to our Nebraska viewers. We have tons of viewers. Well, you're in Nebraska. So, if you're old like me, you remember New Year's Night in 1984. So, the end of the 83 season, University of Nebraska, that was the Kendall Gil, Mike Rosir, Turner Gill, uh, Juggernaut. They came up to Minnesota and beat our golfers in the dome 84-13. They were unbeaten. Get to the Rose Bowl. They're playing University of Miami. Yeah. Who at the time was an upstart. Bernie Kosar was the quarterback. Like, who are these guys? And of course, Miami was awesome. They wound up winning the game. And if you want a really old University of Miami reference, my all-time favorite Minnesota Viking player was Chuck Foreman, running back in the 70s. He graduated from Miami in 1972, first round pick of the Vikings. And number 44 is my all-time favorite.

I read I read something already about on the internet an article this morning about how Indiana is under investigation for cheating because for having such a perfect season. I mean, seriously, jealousy is a human emotion. I tell you what, hopefully hopefully it'll be a great game. What day is the finals? I'm not even sure.

Monday night. Okay.

Monday night. It'll be uh it's going to be a good one. It's going to be a good one. And then I gota I got to go 1985 Super Bowl all over again. Bears. Bears Patriots.

Exactly. Just reach out folks. Uh love to talk and catch up and uh yeah it's uh Facebook, Twitter, machineree.com. You know where to find me.

Sounds great, brother.

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Well, I I think it's like weather models, right? Uh I think anyone can look at the history of weather models, uh whether whether it's the GFS or the Euro and know that they're maybe 20% accurate on a two-e forecast. Yep. when they say something, somehow the the market believes that the models know best and they trade them. Even though their track record is so bad, they still trade the weather models. Um, and they still do it to this day. USDA is no different. Whether we're talking about coffee, whether we're talking about sugar, corn, cotton, if you look at the history of USDA reports and their estimates and what actually turn out to be the true uh production numbers, you know, their accuracy is very very poor, like not even close to being accurate. Yet somehow just because it's the government the you and the market just says well if they say it then it must be true. And unfortunately until we break the shackles of that ridiculous orientation that we should believe entities and models that have such a poor track record of predicting whatever they're supposed to be predicting. If and until we stop trading that we are subject to um very very inefficient markets and markets that for a w little while will go you know significantly against the true nature of the fundamentals. This is not the first time we've had a bogus USDA report. I mean this happens all the time. um and they always find a way to um correct it over time. Historically, when they've made a mistake like they've clearly made, um they'll first correct it in the quarterly grain stocks report in the March report and in the June report. Those are the next two quarterly grain stocks. So, let's just somehow say we just can't find all those bushels. It must be that demand is stronger than we thought and the residual stronger than we thought and they and they they they they put their hand on the Ouija board and and and come up with a you know a dramatic change of events. The problem is this getting the number right in June is very very different than getting the number right in January. Y getting the number right in January means for upper $4 corn. Uh I don't know what it means getting in June because so many other factors will now be part of the corn market at that time. We'll have South American weather on corn. We'll have the planting season on corn. We'll have the initial stages of June weather in the new in the uh growing cycle. We'll have whatever new geopolitics we have. The problem is by the time they get to the right number, the market is so far removed from it that they're just focused on something else. And it just I'm I'm not saying it's it's not a factor. It just is not as important a factor as it would be if they came out with what I believe to be a more appropriate number today. And so the problem with that is is that um farmers have to sell. We know they have to sell. They have they periodically have to sell. They have to raise cash. They have to pay their bills. They have to pay their bankers. And you know, you can only go so long without selling before it's like, you know, I just kind of got to sell. And after a day like today where the USDA, you know, comes out with what they did and the price does what it did. A lot of farmers are going to sell today and tomorrow and maybe over the next week. This is what happens. you get a bunch of cheap corn that gets flooded into the market because the farmer is scared to death. Understandably so, by the way. Um, and he says, "I just I I can't stomach any more decline from a price that's it was already not profitable before. Now it's really really unprofitable." And so the end user just buys a bunch of cheap corn and then all of a sudden they they tell everybody it's not so bad. And I mean it's not so good and it's not and things are not as good as we thought and all of a sudden the weather is this and then you have yourself and you find yourself back at 480 corn but the farmer has already sold at 420 corn or you know and and and that's the insidiousness of this type of give and take that we see repeatedly and as I said it's not just the grain markets uh you know uh that we see this I mean we see this in a bunch of other markets that the USDA puts numbers out for and um it's really unfortunate. The other problem with the USDA is sometimes they do tell the truth. They do every once in a while. Sometimes they do. Last year in January they did. They did tell the truth and the market took off. So that's the problem. The problem is, are they in the mood of telling the truth or are they not in the mood of telling the truth? So, there's two forecasts, Casey. There's the forecast of what is the USDA going to say and this forecast of what's actually true. Now, those that uh gamble on correctly ascertaining the USD report got a 50-50 chance of being right. Anytime you be, hey, it's going to be good, it's going to be bad. Well, it half the people are going to get it right and half the people get it wrong if you're just flipping a coin, right? So, those that get the USD report right are revered as soothsayers. They understand what's going on in the country's line. No, they just either got super lucky or they just happen to gain the system of how the USDA was going to operate in this particular growing season. What I've always believed is the correct thing to do is I don't really believe anybody can correctly predict what the USDA is going to say given that they're so much of a chameleon in terms of sometimes they tell the truth, sometimes they don't tell the truth. You know, trying to predict that kind of inconsistency to me is not something I'm interested in. I always have a pretty good idea of what the truth is. And if they happen to say something significantly against what the actual true fundamental picture really is and the market does something stupid like it did today and it may do it tomorrow, there's an opportunity. That's how I've always felt is the best way for the farmer, for the end user, for those in agriculture is not to try to predict a report that can't be predicted. Tell me anybody that accurately predicts every USD report every year. It does not exist, Casey. There is nobody that says, "I have a a 95% track record of predicting USD." They don't exist. Half of the time they get it right. Half. So, we stop doing it because we're going to get it right half the We're going to wrong half the time because that's the nature of the beast. So, more

Importantly, do you actually know what the true nature of the fundamentals are? Do you have an ability historically, statistically, cyclically to know or have a really good idea of what the truth actually is, so that if the USDA pulls a fast one and if the markets do something against the direction of the true trend, you can advise your customers correctly. And I believe this is one of those times where I don't think there's any doubt in my mind in our work based upon the weather that took place, the evidence of the harvest results that in our network, and today we shared a network of a totally independent source of somebody who's really, really sharp, who's looking at 8,900 different plots across the entire grain belt that did the same thing last year, saying the crop is worse than last year. You know, some very, very serious people, you know, put some significant granularity to what this crop's going to be. And just because the USDA decided they're going to say 186 and a half has nothing to do with that being the truth.

What it does mean is that speculative traders who are taught to trade headlines and sell thousands and thousands of contracts in the blink of an eye based upon headlines, which they're free to do, by the way. They're allowed to do this. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with speculators doing whatever they think they need to do on a short-term basis, but it doesn't mean that they're validating the report. Doesn't mean they're validating the USDA. They're just trading what they think is a short-term opportunity to profit.

And I would argue that those on the other side, those involved more in what I believe in, in the actual physical farming business, can do the exact same thing. They're free to trade that on the negative side. We're free to take advantage of their shortsightedness and look at the longer-term picture that they're just trading a number that's actually quite incorrect. And so that's where I believe we are. When we try to utilize, Casey, something called linear regression analysis. It's a simple statistical tool that puts layers of supports and resistance levels based upon a time frame that you select. And we try to select a 10-year window. Meaning, how do prices tend to trade over a 10-year window? Usually over any 10-year period, Casey, you've seen inflation, you've seen deflation, you've seen a good economy, you've seen a bad economy, you've seen a black swan event, you've seen big crops, small crops, droughts, floods, perfect weather. You've kind of seen it all. And so there's a rhythm to the market. And so when we do that analysis on March corn and May corn on a monthly and on a quarterly basis, I always love when we can get multiple time frames that are giving us similar levels. 410 May corn, 410 March corn is extreme support on a linear regression 10-year basis.

And if we're able to, I think today we closed around 421, I think, on something like that. But what we're suggesting is that if we're able to trade down to that 410 area in the next few days, which if you're going to get any more momentum, usually the way this works, Casey, they sell, they sell, they sell. They tend to have three days of selling and then whatever they've done, they're done, right? So if we're going to see this 410 area, give or take, probably going to see it the next couple of days or we're not going to see it at all. And if we don't see it at all, that's extremely interesting information. If we do see it, that's extremely interesting information because to me that's where, like, if you need to buy physical corn as a livestock producer or as an ethanol producer, to me, you know, you've been given this last-ditch negative bearish piece of information, the last bit of the last negative catalyst at the market and trade for probably quite some time.

Everybody who was hanging on for dear life probably will sell today if they haven't already done so, or will sell tomorrow. I mean, it's the nature of human nature. When you finally give up on the last piece of information you thought was going to be positive and it's not, then that's your low. Like when everybody is sold, that's your low. So I think we were at a, at least on corn. This is specifically on corn, Casey. I did not expect a positive soybean report and we didn't get one. I was not expecting a positive wheat report and we didn't get one. So I want to be very, very clear that I was not expecting those two markets to see anything good in this report and they did not see it. I'm just flabbergasted that the USDA can possibly with a straight face put out that kind of information when I think it's pretty obvious by anyone that is a reasonable purveyor of what is taking place can understand and suggest that that's not likely going to be the right number. And so that's where we're at. The market is what it is. It's extremely unfortunate short-term for producers.

But eventually the market will get the fundamentals right. And I do believe that we're going to be entering a much more interesting series of weather events going forward that's going to start to shift the focus on endless supply to something that might be a little less. And so that's where we're at. I guess the last thing I would say is this: for those that correctly predicted the USDA report, good job. But that's not important. It really is not important. What's really important is if the USDA is wrong and what others have been saying, including myself, are right, then selling now is absolutely the wrong thing to do. And that's really the most important decision to make: is selling today, tomorrow, the next day the right thing to do based upon this piece of information? At the end of the day, that's really the decision. If you didn't sell before the report, you can't go back.

And I don't believe, and we've made these recommendations on your show many, many times before when we've been in these dire times, these times of no hope, no future. It's never going up again. And I don't think this is a very good time to be selling corn unless you absolutely, positively don't have a choice but to sell right now. And if you have to sell, then I don't know what else to say. But if you have a decision to make, selling now, in my opinion, with what I'm seeing going forward, is not in your best interest. And I believe in the next three months and the next six months and the next nine months, anyone that sells post this report, I believe will feel as silly as the bulls feel right now. And that's where I stand.

Our website is hackettadvisors.com. We also have a Twitter page at Fairex11, LinkedIn page. In fact, we just posted actually a Twitter of one of your interviews, Casey, that we just did that was really, really outstanding. And I would highly encourage everyone to listen to that if they haven't already done so.

Sounds good, Casey. Thanks so much.