Executive Director, Brown–Forman
Old Forester's State of the Union with Campbell Brown, President of Old Forester - Episode 201
Campbell Brown, President and Managing Director of Old Forester is back on the show. If you've been a long time listener, you may have remembered him back on Episode 98. As the President of Old Forester, he oversees a lot of the brands momentum and strategy. We get his take on bourbon tariffs with international expansion along with his hope for future movie partnerships. Anyone interested in a business background, you're going to find this one entertaining.
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About Campbell Brown
Campbell Brown, a fifth-generation member of the Brown family and executive at Brown-Forman, has spoken extensively about the company's history and his role in overseeing its whiskey brands. He has described the company's founding principle, established by his great-great-grandfather George Garvin Brown, of selling Old Forester exclusively by the bottle with the label "nothing better in the market," which Brown said holds the family and employees accountable for product quality. Brown has discussed the company's investment in a new distillery in Louisville, which he described as a risky but worthwhile project given the brand's history, and noted that the oldest barrels produced there are just over two years old, with no rush to release them. He has also commented on the broader bourbon industry, stating that the growth and innovation in the category are "explosive" and that the presence of new competitors is "great for our industry" as it revives creativity. In addition to his work at Brown-Forman, Brown has been an advocate for charter schools. In a 2014 speech, he criticized the teachers union for supporting a state law that he said gives tenured teachers protections "no other public employee has," citing an article about teachers who kept their jobs after being found guilty of sexual misconduct. He argued that the issue is about political leadership, stating that "this is a test of who they are" and that "there is no middle ground" when it comes to children's futures. Brown has also participated in public discussions about news and media, having previously worked as a journalist at CNN and NBC News before joining Facebook as head of news partnerships, where he said his team works to "reduce the amount of false news misinformation on the platform while also trying to elevate and get more visibility for reliable sources of news and information."
Transcript (25 segments)
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Kenny0:11
I mean, if it did come down to a physical battle, I would put my money on Jackie.
This is episode 201 of Bourbon Pursuit. I'm one of your hosts, Kenny. Let's go through a little bit of news. But really, the big news this week—and maybe you were living under a rock, you weren't looking at social media or any of the news articles that came out—but Marianne Eaves, the master distiller of Castle & Key, the one that was renowned as being the first female master distiller since Prohibition, in a joint press release has announced her resignation from the distillery with mixed emotions. And various news articles were referring to it as the former Old Taylor distillery. So make sure you go check that out and check out her past and everything that she had built, because we started this podcast pretty much the same time she was coming online with Castle & Key. So we wish Marianne all the best in her future opportunities and endeavors, and we look forward to having her back on the show once again.
This didn't get much publicity, but I was part of media day at Churchill Downs during Derby week, and Fred along with I—we got to hear Chris Morris and Elizabeth McCall talk about Woodford Batch Proof. We didn't really know all the details about it, but come to find out it's going to be a new product line extension and will only be released once per year at the beginning of spring, which happens to be around Derby time. So if you're looking for a higher proof version of Woodford and it's going to be different every single year, go check out the Woodford Batch Proof.
Our News Pursuit series, episodes 10 and 11, are now on sale to our Patreon community first. We've been talking about episode 10 for a while. We're super excited to release it because this is a five-year bourbon from Finger Lakes Distilling. This distillery is getting crazy good accolades. We featured them back on the Empire Rye episode, and they get good reviews from pretty much everywhere. Eric Leiber of Bourbonr as well as Aaron Goldfarb of Hacking Whiskey sold a barrel of their ice wine finished bourbon in 48 hours. Michael Veach recently reviewed this one as well. It's a short barrel—and who doesn't love short barrels? Only 112 bottles were in this barrel, and it is the second highest proof we have released thus far, coming in at 114.3. It's also ten years old, so it's got that good middle-of-the-road age to it. As usual, first access is to our Patreon community, so make sure you're checking your emails to get your password for access.
We're excited to have Campbell Brown back on the show. If you've been a longtime listener, you may have remembered him being a part of the Legend Series partnership that we have with the Kentucky Derby Museum. That was back on episode 98. As the president of Old Forester, he oversees a lot of the brand's momentum and strategy with anyone interested in a business background.
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Fred Minich4:21
I'm Fred Minich, and this is Above the Char. When I walked into the Brown-Forman office to interview Chris Morris, I sat down in a nice leather chair. The PR person's office was surrounded with fish photos and family photos. It felt very friendly. Then in walked a young woman I had never met before. She was tall, blond hair, very pretty, and she extended her hand and said, 'Hi, I'm Marianne Eaves. It's so nice to meet you.' Chris looked at me and said, 'Marianne is in her early 20s and having the opportunity to become the master distiller for one of the greatest bourbon brands on the market.' At the time, I thought to myself, I never met her. Why does this young woman know? Despite my background in covering women and whiskey and writing the book Whiskey Women, I had only just met Marianne. I felt like she needed to prove herself a little bit before I could officially think that she was capable of being a master distiller. I talked to her, and what I learned from her within 30 minutes was that she was one of the top of her class of something. She was an engineer and she chose to go into bourbon versus making ethanol or something else because bourbon was her passion.
When she announced her departure from Brown-Forman for a new distillery that would be starting up at the old Taylor facility, which is actually near Woodford Reserve, I was kind of stuck. Because who, after all, would leave the opportunity to become the master distiller of Woodford Reserve? Then I got to know Marianne even more. She has an entrepreneurial spirit. She wanted to do her own thing. She wanted to be a part of something new.
Don't get me wrong, there were women in the past who actually were doing master distiller work, but they did not take the title. I think when you put that title on your card, you get a little bit of a target on your back. After her departure, you saw that target getting pelted. There were people making fun of her for how she is on social media, saying things like, 'Who will take selfies now at the distillery?' There were people pointing out the fact that her bourbon had not yet hit the market. How can she call herself a master distiller? I've got to tell you, all of that disappointed me greatly because it happens to all of us. We don't know the reasons. It could be personal, it could be professional. There could have been conflict there. She may have not gotten along with her bosses. Who here has not been in a position where they were working for someone they couldn't stand? I don't know the reasons why Marianne left, but she did not deserve the vitriolic comments that she got from people on social media. Not a single one of them. But I also know Marianne rises above it all because at the end of the day, she's a very talented young woman and she can do whatever she wants, including being the first master distiller in Kentucky whiskey history.
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Kenny9:12
The whole team here today recording at, I guess you could say, the Old Forester studio. We were actually in the Old Forester distilling tasting room, seeing a pretty cool behind-the-scenes kitchen-esque cocktail mixing area. This is going to be a fun episode. Our guest today was actually somebody that, unbeknownst to him, he was on the show before from the Legend Series that the Kentucky Derby Museum hosted. It's probably my favorite of the Legend Series I've done because he did a lot of grunt work that a lot of people in bourbon royalty wouldn't do. He's one of those people I like bringing to the forefront and telling his story because he's done a lot to help people like us.
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Ryan10:26
You say grunt work. I also know that at some point he was the SoCo ambassador at one point, right? So that's a little grunt work.
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Kenny10:33
By SoCo we mean Southern Comfort. It was a brilliant brand at one time. It was a part of the Brown-Forman family, of course they sold it to Sazerac. I think we should ask him about what that was like for him, because he did have such an emotional connection to it.
And he also came out with the President's Choice... Before we started recording, they offered us a drink and Ryan kind of piqued his interest. So tell everybody what we're drinking.
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Ryan11:19
Jackie was in the cabinet picking some selections, and she said, 'I have some President's Choice barrel.' She kind of whispered, 'Campbell,' like, 'No, no.' I was like, 'I heard that.' But as you can see, I think this episode will be a lot juicier than the Legend Series because we've been here boozing all day in the research lab. Just kidding. Responsibly, of course.
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Kenny11:45
With that, let's go ahead and shoot. Our guest today is Campbell Brown. Campbell is the President and Managing Director of Old Forester for Brown-Forman. Campbell, welcome to the show.
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Campbell Brown11:54
Good to be here. Thank you.
K
Kenny12:11
You're from originally Montreal?
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Campbell Brown12:14
I was born here in Louisville. I turned five in Montreal. I grew up there. Wikipedia, my research... Come on, we get it right. Somebody update the Wikipedia page before I have to.
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Kenny12:29
I also want to give anybody that's from out of town—Fred had already hinted at it too—the name Brown and what that means to the city of Louisville. You've got the Brown Hotel, the Brown Theatre, the James Graham Brown Cancer Center. You've got all different Browns. You've got the Hot Brown. Kind of talk about the Brown influence just in Louisville.
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Campbell Brown13:10
We had family in Kentucky involved in the state from a political standpoint, a commercial standpoint, a philanthropic standpoint. It's our home. I think we're so proud that the city's been really quite good to our family and to this business. I was born here in '67, spent my early years here, but growing up in Montreal it was all a little bit foreign. I remember coming back here in the summers for a couple weeks and just remembering how incredibly hot it was.
You'd see these animals you just don't see in Westmount in Montreal. And then eating lima beans—I was never into lima beans until I got here. Frankly, I don't think I was into lima beans until about ten years ago. That's really an acquired taste.
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Kenny14:38
I expect a royalty check from Paducah after this.
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Campbell Brown14:43
Our family has been... My oldest child was born in Annapolis, my youngest was born here in Louisville. It's great raising a family here. I like what's happening in the city and I want to be part of it. Most people that have been part of this city for a lifetime—we talk about our high schools and when we went to school—there's a reason for that. We all have these strong emotional connections that go back to childhood. People come in and out of the city. I was out of here for six or seven years, always knowing that I was going to be coming back. It's a unique place, and I think we've been fortunate that we got into the right business at the right time.
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Fred Minich16:10
Campbell mentioned politics. They've had a lot of people in high places there. But to me, the Brown family is really about philanthropy. If it was not for the Brown family, we wouldn't be talking about Whiskey Row today. They essentially saved Whiskey Row where we are right now. When Louisville was crumbling from an arts perspective, the Brown family kind of held it up. You go around our museums here, and you'll see Brown at the top of every one of the donors. They are a very important family for our community.
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Kenny16:50
I guess what Fred said—the Browns are one of the most famous families in the city. Is there pressure to live up to the Brown name?
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Campbell Brown17:12
I don't know if it's pressure. I think many of us have different jobs and do different things. There's a bias towards staying engaged, staying interested, understanding the issues and opportunities of the city, and figuring out ways we can help—like anybody would in our own individual ways—to find solutions and empower people and ideas. Frankly, there are so many people in this city doing that. There's individual after individual looking because it's a city that's fairly manageable in size. It gives individuals an opportunity to make things happen that would be much harder to do even in a Nashville, certainly in New York or Miami. There's still an economy of scale that allows a good idea or a strong individual to make something powerful happen.