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Daniel Barel
CEO & Co-Founder, REE Automotive

Building a Better World Through By-Wire ft. Daniel Barel of REE Automotive

🎥 May 01, 2023 📺 AutoVision News Radio ⏱ 19m 👁 31 views
If the "future of mobility" were an equation written on the marker board in a university math class, REE Automotive would solve it with creativity, ingenuity, and sincerity. Co-founder Daniel Barel and the REE team are more than familiar with the drawing board as they pursue a collective vision of building the ultimate customer-centric vehicle. In this episode of AutoVision News Radio, Daniel takes Carl through the company's latest innovations - the REEcorner and REE platform - from a design and engineering perspective. Daniel opens up about his life, sharing his business philosophies of al...
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About Daniel Barel

Daniel Barel, co-founder and CEO of REE Automotive, has stated that the company achieved FMVSS and EPA certification for its by-wire technology, which he described as a first for the industry. In the third quarter of 2024, Barel reported that the company more than doubled its reservation value from $60 million to nearly $140 million and improved liquidity by 47%. He announced a $45 million investment led by its largest shareholder, M Investments, and Modison, which he said would likely be the last dilutive capital raise in the near future. Barel has reaffirmed the company's target of reaching bill-of-material break-even in the second half of 2025 on production of a few hundred vehicles, and has stated that REE is targeting cumulative sales of approximately 6,000 trucks by the end of 2026, representing about 1% of the medium-duty market. Barel has described REE's by-wire technology as removing mechanical connections between drive, steer, and brake components, and has said the company aims to serve as a foundational technology provider for other OEMs, likening the approach to "Intel inside" for automotive. He has noted that the company is working with three undisclosed automakers interested in its technology and has partnerships with fleets including Penske and U-Haul. Barel has also discussed the company's capital-light assembly strategy, which he said involves integration centers costing a few million dollars rather than billions, and has emphasized that the company is focused on collaboration rather than competition within the industry.

Source: AI-verified profile updated from Daniel Barel's recent appearances. Browse all interviews →

Transcript (21 segments)
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Carl Anthony0:01
My name is Carl Anthony and I work in the automotive industry in Detroit. Sometimes that work encompasses future vehicle technology and that's what we talk about here for the most part. Anyway, this is Autovision News Radio.
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Daniel Barel0:18
Previously, I founded a few companies before in different areas and it has always been the same. It's always an uphill battle. It's always challenging regardless of business that it is. You just have to, you know, wake up in the morning, keep on fighting a good fight.
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Carl Anthony0:36
Daniel Barel is a visionary leader dedicated to revolutionizing transportation and forging a sustainable future for generations to come. He co-founded REE Automotive in 2013, where he currently serves as the chief executive officer. With a notable track record as a successful entrepreneur, Daniel founded several startups in years past that made significant contributions to industries such as data management, consulting, and social networking. When it comes to Daniel's leadership at REE, which you will see spelled as REE in all caps on the NASDAQ, the focus is on creating innovative technologies that prioritize sustainability, efficiency, and a lower cost of ownership. With REE as a name, you can follow that with any number of suitable words: reinvent, redesign, reimagine, and each is at the core of REE Automotive. From ADAS to electrification, this is Autovision News Radio with Carl Anthony in Detroit, Michigan. Daniel holds a Bachelor of Arts in Economics and Business Administration from the Hebrew University in Jerusalem. Growing up in the desert forever shaped Daniel. It's in simple things like how he's not too fond of rain, but it's also in incredibly profound things. When you meet and talk to Daniel and hear his story, you begin to better understand REE from a technology and innovation perspective, but also the company's long-term vision.
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Daniel Barel2:09
You grow a little bit more on the rough side in the desert, if you know what I mean. And you know, because Israel is, the Middle East is a rough neighborhood. I had to, you know, join the army for quite a few years when I was 18 and I served for about, you know, in different ways about 15 years all in all. And during my tenure in that, you see a lot and of course it has its toll, but it also teaches you quite a lot. And I think the two things that I've learned by seeing so many things is one, honestly, everything is possible. Everything is possible. Just plan it right. Make sure you plan and prepare properly and everything is possible. And second, never stop. Never ever stop until you hit your goal. And I think those are the two things that growing up I've been taking with me ever since. Also today at REE, everything is possible. The amount of times we've heard that what we're doing is impossible. It won't work. You can't do it. It's never been done before. Nobody was able. But we kept on trying. We hit the walls. We went not through the door, through the windows, not through the chimney, you know, and all that. But at the end of the day, we never stopped and we got to where we got today. So yeah, I think that's what we see today.
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Carl Anthony3:38
If I look backwards, I am told from some of my other friends who are from Israel that when I visit, I have to try the hummus there. Any thoughts on the hummus or some of the best foods around where you are?
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Daniel Barel3:51
Well, the Israeli hummus is, you can get in a very heated debate on which is the best, you know. I mean, there are quite a few camps there and you better choose carefully. So, I'd avoid the mess of stating what is my favorite here, but I can definitely share with you later the absolute best for us in Israel. And if you're there, I'll be more than happy to take you.
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Carl Anthony4:19
And as an automotive technology company, REE is focused on helping its customers build any size or shape of electric vehicle on their modular REE platforms. REE platforms are future-proofed, autonomous-capable, and are designed to reduce the time to market for fleets looking to electrify.
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Daniel Barel4:39
What we've done with REE is we wanted to create something. We're just two months shy of 10 years old. You know, people tend to forget these days that 10 years ago, electric vehicles were not a matter of when. They were literally a very big matter of if, right? And many thought that that's just a phase. We decided to create some sort of a technology capability company that would accelerate the shift through electric vehicles. We spent a lot of time thinking what it means and we came up with a strategy saying that we need to be something very agile. We need to be something that completes and does not compete with others in order to accelerate that. And we have to have a very unique and very advanced technology. And with that, we created what we call today the REEcorner. We've taken what makes airplanes fly and drones fly for the past 50, 60 years and put it into cars. So, we've taken all the drive shafts and couplings and gears and all that of the vehicle and put wires instead and connected them to a set of computers and said, 'Hey, this is how you drive the vehicle now.' And you might ask yourself, 'That's great, right? Why the hell would you want to do that?' It opens so much capabilities and opportunities for automakers like us in the industry. And just simply put, we can build today vehicles much faster and much more customer-oriented than anybody else out there. And we're doing it because we just basically put our corners, our wheels anywhere we want in space and build a car around them or a truck around them or a bus around them in any size, shape or form. And that level of flexibility is very unique to REE. So REE is not an OEM and is not a tier one. It's something new. We're a tech company in the automotive world and we're designing, manufacturing, and selling vehicles in the commercial segment.
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Carl Anthony6:52
At this point, the REEcorner Daniel referenced packs critical vehicle components into a single compact module positioned between the chassis and the wheel. In addition to the performance benefits, REE customers have complete design freedom for their intended applications because the corners, just by their nature, automatically lend themselves to a completely flat platform which is advantageous when you want to build a vehicle that prioritizes space, be it for cargo or passengers. I will leave a link in the show notes to a demonstration video on the REEcorner from REE's YouTube channel. It's really amazing to see it in the video and if you love engineering or machines in general, give it a watch. And after seeing the video, Daniel helped me further understand the fundamental design characteristics of the REEcorner.
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Daniel Barel7:42
So the REEcorner is basically your motor, steering, your braking, and the entire control in the corner of a vehicle times four. Okay? So, think about each of your corners, which essentially is where the wheel is, having a motor, steering system, a braking system, and a control system for that corner. And that allows you to be able to drive, steer, and brake each of those units separately. It's interesting because the technology is allowing us to have each corner independent. For example, if the corner needs to turn, the corner can decide whether it's going to use the steering actuator, it's going to use torque vectoring or any other means of making the vehicle turn per corner. And of course, that later on will be aggregated to the REEcenter, which is the central computing system. But each of those corners is fully independent. Not only that, it is built from the bottom up with full redundancy. One might say, 'Yeah, but what happens if you lose steering?' We have redundancy within the steering itself. So for example, our steering has six phases and two motors within them, different power loops, but even if that unit completely fries, the other three can take over. So the driver is far safer and far more in control of the vehicle itself. Right now, the corner mechanically is built out of two parts. Simply put, the outbound and the inbound section. The outbound section is what everybody would see if they look under the truck, which is industry standard. You'll see an industry standard suspension, brake caliper, nothing special there, which is important for the service and maintenance in a very ordinary way. And the inbound part, which is once we install it, is going directly inside of our chassis, a very complete and flat chassis and fully protected, is the by-wire system. This is where all the wits is, right? This is where the actuators are. This is where the control, the ECUs and everything is placed and that is proprietary to us.
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Carl Anthony10:02
Over the course of my years in automotive, a good majority of that time has been spent around trucks. Specifically, the F-150 when I worked at Sioux Falls in sales, the Ram 1500 when I was on the auto show circuit with FCA. This is before Stellantis, and then the Colorado, Silverado, and Silverado HD when I was a product specialist on Chevy's national truck team. Granted, these are different trucks from what REE specializes in, but as I was going through my training with Ford, GM, and FCA, you see how the high-strength steel frame that underpins the truck means everything because the truck's capability will spread outward from there. In other words, the platform matters. Hence, the importance of the REE platform. It's where the REEcorners live and it's the foundation for REE's customers to build the vehicle they need. REE platforms include the P7 EV strip chassis for commercial vehicles classes 3 to 5, the P7 box truck for class 3 last-mile segments, and the P7 chassis cab, a class 4 solution for urban environments with increased cargo space, optimized aerodynamics, and a lower step-in height for the driver. Similar to my experience with trucks, the REE platform is a catalyst for capability. And that capability can come in many different ways depending on the application. Maybe it's the overall payload. You just need more or better maneuverability for a busy city or increased durability because the vehicle in question will encounter rougher roads. Whatever the reason, the REE platform is central to the company's ethos.
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Daniel Barel11:45
If you take your phone and turn it around, that's how the REE platform looks like. Unified, flat from end to end. What's important about that is that you can utilize the full dimensions of that vehicle. You can build any type of body you want on top of that, any internal design of it. And because each REEcorner is independent, we can build the chassis and the platform around those corners relatively freely. So it can take different shapes, different length, different width, different payloads to that. Essentially, it hosts the corners and the battery. That's all. It's a big battery pack. It's completely flat. And if you can make the vehicle lower and more accessible, I mean, that's huge health-wise and also, you know, business-wise, they can deliver more packages faster. Also, because everything is confined within the REEcorners, the REE platform is essentially a battery pack, meaning you can build that battery pack in any size and capacity you want. So it can be longer, it can be shorter, it can be wider. And that modularity is very characteristic of REE and the REE platform with that ability to take different shapes and sizes based upon the same corners.
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Carl Anthony12:59
Joining the REEcorner and the REE platform is the company's X-by-Wire technology.
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Daniel Barel13:07
As we said before, we brought it in from aviation. But remember, a plane is being operated or flown by a very high-skill professional. We had to create a system which is easier to control but much safer. So what we've done is we created an array of ECUs. We basically have five ECUs, computers, one in each corner and a central one that connects them. And what's interesting about the X-by-Wire technology is that we're the only company today that actually has vehicles on the road, to the best of my knowledge, that are fully by-wire. It's not just steer-by-wire. It's not only drive-by-wire, it's everything. Steer, drive, brake, and full control by-wire. And that is important for three reasons. One, it allows the vehicle to operate better and safer than traditionally because the REEcenter can make decisions very fast. Calculating the grip on each of the wheels, calculating the angle, calculating the speed, weather conditions, etc., can yield much better vehicle dynamics. Period. Second, by yielding better vehicle dynamics, we can actually reduce significantly the wear and tear of that vehicle. And last but not least, it is of course ideal for autonomous vehicles, right? Autonomous vehicles have to run by-wire. And by being the only truly by-wire company out there, it allows us to be very relevant for autonomous driving today and in the future.
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Carl Anthony14:39
Daniel referenced a famous quote by Henry Ford to illustrate the contrast between two historically significant inflection points in the automotive industry. The first being the formation of the assembly line and mass production. But now we're approaching another historically significant inflection point with electrification. And although we can understand in hindsight Ford's desire to hold on to the Model T for as long as he did, that mentality is likely not the best strategy today.
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Daniel Barel15:08
By-wire technology, I think we've not even started to scratch the surface. There is so much to do. Having said that, as a young EV company, I don't know if 10 years is young, but I like to think about it as young. You know, that's young. Thank you for that. I think focus is key. Focus in the development on the product side, mainly listening very carefully to the voice of the customer. We've been spending a lot of time with our customers, years. Sometimes the voice of the customer in EVs is very interesting because some of our customers know exactly what they want. Some just want something better than what they have, but they can't articulate it. So, our product team have developed the capability to, you know, sit down with the customer and translate their desire, their wishes, their need into engineering. I think the days of 'you can get it in any color you want as long as it's black' Henry Ford are over, at least for now, right? You know, the customer voice is very strong and the customer now only leads the product development and the proper product that they want to use. And I think we should listen to them. All of us, I think, should listen very carefully to what our customers want and then go and build it.
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Carl Anthony16:37
When we examine REE, we see complimentary innovations. The corner, the platform, X-by-Wire, each one supports and benefits the other so that REE can deliver on its customer-centric approach. Or put another way, REE is more concerned with completing rather than competing.
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Daniel Barel16:55
I think that if you want to be a major player in the industry, you don't have to do everything. You shouldn't do everything. You should concentrate on what you do very, very well. Your core. And you should make it very appealing and very easy relatively to others to join you in your test. And this is where we came with the complete, not compete. So for example, REE is a sub-brand. You will not see a REE vehicle. You will see a 'powered by REE' vehicle, like an Intel inside, right? You can have any different computer you want. You can have any brand, any shape, any design, but it has a small sticker says 'Intel inside', right? Same with us. So we complete, we don't compete with other OEMs. They can say, 'Hey, you can use the REEcorners for everything you want.' That's done. We're not also competing with our partners in manufacturing. We're an assembler by choice. We chose not to be a manufacturer. We only assemble sub-assemblies, which means that the units, the parts that we get from our suppliers are already pre-assembled. So, we actually create more value for them as well. We're also working through dealers. That's important for us not to go above their head and go directly to the market. What we're basically trying to do on every aspect almost, I think that you'd see at REE, is that we're trying to complete others and for them to complete us. We are trying to work with almost everybody in the industry.
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Carl Anthony18:24
As REE celebrates its 10th anniversary in 2023, I asked Daniel what he would like to see and accomplish in the next decade before REE turns 20.
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Daniel Barel18:34
One of the people I respect and admire says, 'Better is before us.' And I think that's what we want to see. We want to see that 10 years from now, that we've made a dent in the universe and the by-wire technology, powered by REE, is a market standard. But that has been only the beginning and better is before us and we would be reaching new heights and new capabilities, whether it be passenger vehicles and not commercial, whether it be autonomous. I want to make sure that we are part of those parties who lead it.
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Carl Anthony19:20
For more information on REE Automotive including the REEcorner and REE platform, see the links in the show notes. Autovision News Radio is available on Spotify, Apple Podcast, Podbean, and more. In Detroit, alongside Daniel Barel, I'm Carl Anthony, Autovision News Radio.