$WCN Waste Connections Q3 2025 Earnings Conference Call

Okay, thank you operator and good morning. I would like to welcome everyone to this conference call to discuss our third quarter results and to provide some thoughts about the remainder of the year and the setup for 2026. I'm joined this morning by Maryann Whitney, our CFO, and several other members of our senior management. As noted in our release, superior execution drove better than expected financial results in the third quarter, bolstered by continued improvement in operating trends. Another quarterly step down in employee turnover and new record low safety incident rates together with strong pricing execution and retention drove adjusted EBITDA margins of 33.8%, reflecting underlying solid waste margin expansion of approximately 80 basis points in the period. I'm extremely pleased by our team's efforts to overcome incremental commodity headwinds and ongoing uncertainty in the economy in Q3 to achieve the results above expectations. Assuming continuing trends and without further headwinds, we remain well positioned to deliver our full-year 2025 outlook as provided in July. Before we get into much more detail, let me turn the call over to Maryann for our forward-looking disclaimer and other housekeeping items.

Okay. Thank you, Maryann. We are extremely pleased to deliver third quarter results above expectations, demonstrating the durability of solid waste regardless of the economic environment. Q3 revenue growth was led by 6.3% core solid waste price with reported volume slightly better than expected down 2.7%. We delivered margins of 33.8%, up 100 basis points year-over-year excluding the impact of commodities and our decision to close Chiquita Canyon Landfill as of January 1st. Set another way, normalizing for these factors puts our Q3 margins at 34.7%. Without the benefit of any contribution from positive volumes, as we've said, we remain well positioned to enjoy the upside from any pickup in volumes from the broader economy, given our asset position and market selection strategy. As anticipated, we continue to advance that strategy through acquisition activity, which has continued at an above average pace, resulting in approximately $300 million in annualized revenues either closed or under definitive agreement year to date with more expected in Q4 and by early 2026. We've had some fantastic M&A wins, including two of the largest private companies in Florida, one of which we closed during Q3 with the other signed and expected to close in Q4. Moreover, our operating performance, free cash flow, and balance sheet continue to provide the capacity for outsized acquisition activity and expanded return of capital to shareholders. To that end, our board of directors authorized an 11.1% increase to our regular quarterly cash dividend, our 15th consecutive annual double-digit increase since the initiation of our dividend in 2010. Additionally, as noted on our last call, we've been in the market buying back shares as we take an opportunistic approach to share repurchases and look to capitalize when we see compelling dislocations across the market or within our sector. To date, we bought back approximately 2.4 million shares or almost 1% of shares outstanding pursuant to our normal course issuer bid which we renewed in August providing for annual repurchases of up to 5% of shares outstanding. Along with executing our growth strategy, we've also shown significant progress towards achievement of our long-term aspirational sustainability related targets as highlighted in our recently released 2025 sustainability report. In fact, we've already achieved several of our initial targets, including emissions reductions, safety performance, and recycling and well-being well ahead of our expectations. And we continue to challenge ourselves for further progress as we demonstrate that sustainability is integral to our long-term value creation and part of our corporate culture. Most notably, with multi-year reductions of 19% in emissions, our results demonstrate that outsized growth is compatible with the achievement of our long-term aspirational ESG targets. This improvement also applies to employee engagement where we've seen ongoing reductions during 2025 in voluntary turnover and safety related metrics. In Q3, voluntary turnover was down for the 12th consecutive quarter for a total reduction of over 55% from the peak in late 2022 and early 2023. Similarly, safety incident rates have shown continuous multi-year improvement, now down over 25% to new historic lows for the company. Cornerstone of our operating philosophy is that the people are our strongest differentiator. So, we're excited to see that the level of employee engagement has never been stronger. And as we've maintained would be the case two years ago, we're seeing the benefits of higher employee retention and engagement in our financial results, as evidenced by our 80 basis points of underlying margin expansion in the quarter with more to come given record safety levels and nearly three years of progress. What may be even more compelling is the opportunity ahead as we harness that engagement to leverage technology in new and unprecedented ways while adhering to the fundamentals that have driven our growth and success. Along with human capital as a differentiator, we're excited to recognize the benefits of using technology to accelerate and expand the reach of our leaders. To that end, we're making long-term investments in technology and infrastructure to maximize their impact and position the company for continued margin expansion. These investments target productivity and efficiency gains as we look to further digitize and automate operations, enhance forecasting through data analytics, and improve service delivery, all while enabling a greater focus on the customer experience. We are already seeing positive outcomes including improved pricing retention as we expand the utilization of data analytics across multiple platforms. We look to build upon these efforts as we deploy additional applications and expand our efforts in 2026 and 2027. Now before we look ahead I'd like to pass the call to Maryann to review more in depth the financial highlights of the third quarter.

Thank you, Maryann. As we have described, we are pleased with our year-to-date results, which not only highlight the strength and resilience of our business, but provide momentum for next year. Although we do not provide our formal outlook for 2026 until February, we are able to provide a high-level framework assuming no change in the current economic environment. On that basis, we should be positioned for the following. Mid-single-digit revenue growth in 2026 from price, organic growth in solid waste and approximately 1% revenue carryover from 2025 acquisition activity to date partially offset by continued headwinds related to commodities. Looking at margins, we remain well positioned for above average underlying solid waste margin expansion with offsets expected from margin dilutive impacts from acquisitions and commodities. These combined impacts suggest adjusted EBITDA margin expansion in what we would consider a normalized range. And depending on the timing of capital expenditures and other outlays, the conversion of adjusted EBITDA to adjusted free cash flow should improve relative to 2025. These aforementioned amounts will be positively impacted by the pace and magnitude of ongoing acquisition activity in Q4 and will grow during 2026 as we complete additional M&A. To the extent that we see improvements in commodities and RECs values, those impacts would also be additive to these preliminary thoughts. We look forward to having better visibility on the tone of the economy, including any government shutdown or tariff related implications when we provide our formal outlook in February. We're most grateful and extremely proud of the dedication of our over 25,000 employees and the local leadership teams responsible for the consistency of operational execution. We're excited to leverage their effectiveness and provide multi-year opportunities to accelerate growth through our investments in technology. We're also proud to welcome Jason Craft, a long-tenured local, divisional, and regional Waste Connections leader to the role of Chief Operating Officer during the quarter. Jason's strong operational background and business acumen make him an ideal addition to the senior leadership team. We will continue to focus on operational excellence and stay true to our culture while also welcoming new and innovative ways to drive value creation and as we say, win from within. We appreciate your time today. I will now turn this call over to the operator to open up the lines for your questions. Operator,

Yes. Yeah, good morning Tyler. We can hear you.

Yes. Yeah, Tyler. So, first off, there is no incremental RNG revenue of any amount materially in the balance of '25 guidance or in the '26 first look. Okay. No, nothing there. Because most of our projects are timed to come online at some point during the fourth quarter. So there could be a de minimis amount maybe a couple months in '26. So that benefit's really not till '27 in revenue, EBITDA, and margin. And we originally thought we'd spend between $100 and $150 million in capex on RNG in '25. That number is now probably between $75 and $125 million. So maybe stepping down about $25 to $35 million. So there could be $25 to $50 million of green capex roll over into '26.

That's exactly right. You have it exactly right. Right now, we believe commodities, if they stayed where they are, about a 20 to 25 basis point dilutive impact on a year-to-year basis and M&A, call that 10 to 15. So, you're somewhere between 30 and 40 that you're overcoming and so that puts you in that 20 to 40 normalized, which tells you what the underlying is doing.

Yeah, sure. Well, obviously we are mostly talking about two things. We're mostly talking about data aggregation amongst historically disparate systems and apps which are now being aggregated and can speak to each other and provide data analytics that we really haven't had to this degree. And then the utilization and overlay in multiple areas of AI to analyze that data and help us in areas of pricing, customer engagement, route optimization, maintenance, projectability, and a variety of other things. We laid out in late '24 sort of a three-year I would call it total digitization of the organization by the end of '27. So we are now call that one-third through that. We focused heavily on pricing and budgeting forecasting and planning through the use of AI and data aggregation in '25. For '26 we will be doing the same on sort of route optimization as we've mentioned, working to sort of what I'd call Waze for garbage if you will from a routing, a real-time routing standpoint rather than a static routing, as well as a dramatically enhanced mobile application and a complete revamp of our maintenance software and its integration to our operating system. And then there are additional plans for '27. So, I think it's too early to know exactly what that does margin-wise. It's obviously they are all a margin lift and continuing to help us with outsized margin expansion but I can tell you the first two to three things that we have done in late '24 and '25 there's been a very, very rapid payback on those investments and we were surprised at the magnitude of the impacts, favorably surprised. So I would tell you that looking out, as you said maybe over a half decade or four to five year period we should continue to see those and I'd say those impacts are more in the two to three year period we should see most of the benefit from.

And Noah, I would just add that the expectation of still 150 to 200 basis point price-cost spread is directionally how you should think of that and our confidence level of achieving that I think has improved with the utilization of the AI tool that we've been working on for the past year plus. So if we have a lower gross price and a higher net price with lower customer churn we believe that can ultimately pull 50 to 100 basis points out of that reported volume number meaning improving it. Because right now we're getting a tradeoff of probably up to a point for up to about 100 to 150 basis points more that we're pushing price. So as we can pull that down and offset that churn, that layers for us in the organic growth number as well.

Well, of course, Noah, we need to get through this year so we know the timing of capex. We've talked about taking advantage of bonus depreciation by potentially adding capex as we exit '25 for fleet and equipment. You should expect us to be looking at that. That'll inform our thinking about '26. As we said, the green capex will inform it and ultimately what we guide to for EBITDA. All of those things will together inform our thinking about what the moving pieces are for '26.

Sure. I'll take a crack at this for you. So yeah, we would tell you that overall the mitigation and treatment of the reaction or what we call the ETLF is actually going about as we expected or maybe in ways even a little better. We continue to make progress on the removal of the leachate from the landfill that is being generated by the reaction and that amount continues to drop quarter to quarter. We peaked at handling over 400,000 gallons a day. And we are now handling about 220 to 240,000 gallons a day in real time. And at that 220 to 240,000 gallons a day, we are reducing the level of leachate within the landfill itself. Which tells us that we are on the back side of the reaction curve because we're now effectively outrunning the reaction generation whereas a year ago the reaction generation was outrunning us. So those are some very good signs. We have completely capped with about 42 acres of synthetic liner the reaction area. We have voluntarily agreed to cap an additional 50 acres over the next 3 years preventatively and at the request of agencies and we agree with that. And we are complete drilling of all of the extraction wells and implementing all of the submersible pumps to remove the liquid. So and we have dropped by over 95% the registered odor complaints that are monitored through local agencies and the state of California Air Board. So I would tell you that the reaction handling is going as expected or even better on that front. At this point the outlays are running somewhat ahead of our expectations because we've taken additional steps to decrease the impacted area and accelerated some of those steps on our leachate treatment activities. We continue to believe and expect these efforts and that others that we're pursuing will result in decreasing outlays given the progress that we've made. So that's really the reaction front and then you have the sort of the whole separately regulatory compliance and litigation that comes along with this type of an event. And of course, we're not going to comment on litigation because we are in a public forum, but I just tell you that that's probably expected as you would expect in something like this. So that's really the update on where we're at.

Yeah. Well, we're not yet prepared to outline that. What we will obviously do so in February when we give our full guidance, but what I can tell you is that as we said, we're somewhat ahead at this point right now this year. We don't necessarily view that negatively. We have no reason to expect as we sit here today that the total outlay that we have outlined when we originally took an impairment and a charge when we closed the site for our post-closure has any material change to the totals.

Sure, Chris. So of course we're not giving guidance and these were broad strokes but at a very high level a way to think about it since as you know we think in terms of price, organic growth and as I mentioned earlier we think in terms of how much price we need and whether or not we're seeing incremental headwinds from inflation or we're seeing any easing and given the fact that as we've talked about the underlying margin expansion we've enjoyed because of the self-help measures and the fact that trends aren't getting worse based on what we're seeing right now. One could envision that the pieces would have price that's not as positive as it was in the current environment and there might be volumes that are not as negative and the net impact of those two would get you to be approaching the kind of numbers we're talking about and then you layer on the M&A with some offsets. And so I'd say that's a way to think about the building blocks. And of course we'll have better information and insights in February when we actually give our guidance. And Chris, I would tell you that look, we have said that our costs this year have been running. Of course, they were higher at the beginning of the year, coming down throughout the year. We point to labor because that's the largest cost item. As we exit the year, we're approaching going below 4% in labor. It was 4.1% in Q3. And our other costs are running just below that. So we believe that next year that labor number runs closer to the mid-3s, maybe 3.5%. So, again, we've talked about maintaining the type of spread we've had this year in price. So, assuming that is what continues in the cost, I think you can get yourself pretty close.

Sure. So Chris, we've talked over the past couple of years about the fact that that dollar of investment had grown and the fact that we'd seen the cost creep and the delays on these projects and that has continued and it's contributed to the expectations that those don't come online till late '26 or early '27. The other major factor driving that equation is what REC values are. And of course that one-for-one was in an environment of $250 to $300 RECs and if we're sitting at $225 and have been below that that certainly alters our expectations and you could see the one-for-one moving closer to two-for-one depending on what those ultimate values are.

I think that was specifically related

to a comeback on workers comp. Episodically we get a credit and so that can cause some lumpiness quarter to quarter. All of our regions are seeing improvement in safety. And to your question about when we see the benefit of risk management cuts, you know, again, given the nature of the lagging nature and the fact that it's, you know, statistically driven or actuarily driven and claim development periods impact or influence how long it takes to see, we'd always be cautious about putting too fine a point on it, but even in our overall program costs, I'm optimistic that there's some benefits in '26 versus '25. I think the key thing to take away, Kevin, is that, you know, we had talked about 100 basis points of margin expansion and we're driving the kind of results you've seen in spite of the fact that it's not just that we haven't gotten the risk benefit, but it continues to be a headwind of 20 to 30 basis points in the quarter. So it gives you an idea of what unlocking it could do as we look ahead.

Yeah. Good recollection on that, Kevin. In fact, there were six idle assets when we closed the transaction, you know, two and a quarter years ago or two and a half years ago now. We have in the course of 2025 invested in and opened two of those six, and that is actually something that helped us in Q3 at one of those facilities. Again, these are smaller facilities and smaller contributions but they certainly were positive to volumes and our performance in Q3 and will be in Q4. We're going to assess each of the remaining four over, we reassess all the time. You know, it isn't as much in Canada because it's a production-based business. It isn't as much the price of crude although that is influential with no question. It's where there is new drilling activity and its proximity to facilities that you might have shuttered. So as activity moves amongst formations from time to time and it moves much slower in Canada because they have much longer life wells, that will really affect when we open those additional facilities.

Yeah. You are right. In fact, they have opened two additional zones. And we have permits in both. Kevin, to answer your question, they opened those October 1. So, we're, you know, two and a half weeks into it. It's going fairly well. And again, I would say about as expected. We didn't mention this in our commentary but in the fourth quarter we will be closing the largest, closing on the largest remaining transfer station in the Queens market that we have actually had under definitive agreement since back in April and May. And there's a complex regulatory process to get through in New York and we have gotten through that process and gotten approval to close on that transfer station and that really gives us one more leg in this jigsaw puzzle of how the franchise business comes together in New York City. So we're looking forward, we will have that open here, well we will have it under ownership here in the fourth quarter. So we're making good progress. It's a scramble when they open these zones. But we are very, very well positioned for that with the magnitude and size of our sales force and our operating footprint there. So I'd say that continues to play out about as expected and we look forward to them rolling out the remaining zones over '26 and '27.

Yeah, Jim. I mean first off I would tell you that we are really not seeing, and it's a good question because up until I would tell you probably about mid this year there was still some supply chain delay but that has really eased and in fact we are in the market currently buying additional fleet that we're pulling into '25 because of availability of it and our desire to not only obtain it but to take advantage of bonus depreciation with the change in tax law. So no, we're really not, so I wouldn't want to use that as a reason we couldn't deliver on getting all of our vehicles. As far as tariffs, you know, we are hearing from manufacturers that there's probably somewhere in the neighborhood of a 3,000 up to about a 7,500 per truck impact because it affects different components of both the chassis and the bodies separately. So I would tell you that that is relatively diminutive in the total scheme of things but there is some very small impact at this point in time in '26 going forward from the manufacturers.

No, there's no significant chunky, you know, contract and in fact in Q4, you know, the chunkier one that's been impacting this year about 20 basis points that actually expired or anniversaries and so it eases that shedding a little bit.

Toby, we think in terms of providing the service to our customers and so it's really a function of the mix of markets where as you can appreciate on the west coast where we've always had a high amount of diversion and therefore recycling and that's a great model for that business. And then off of the west coast in places where really we've always taken kind of a slow-moving approach to get critical mass and then build out our own recycling facilities. Again, it's all based on meeting the customer's needs and then we think about derisking it to the extent we can. That's why you've seen us build our own recycling facilities in certain markets and it's really coincided with the incremental technology in these facilities and so that's made it a better business and partnering with a nationwide broker to get better pricing through volumes. So we've approached it as how do we mitigate the overall impacts, make it a better underlying business and then communicate to you all what the sensitivity is with movement in commodity values because we've always maintained particularly given the fact that the recycled commodities running through our facilities come off of our own trucks. It really has to start with pricing it appropriately at the street. And so that's what we focus on. And last thing I'd say Toby is with regard to that is if you think about our growth algorithm where we have predominantly price-led organic growth, obviously if that's the case your percentage of commodities will naturally drop over time mathematically unless your M&A is materially outpacing in a year your price organic growth and it has been running about the same or maybe a little under. So I think over time it is much more likely that the percentage of things that are linked to a commodity that has some market volatility continues to drop as a percentage of revenue in generalities.

Yeah. Well I would characterize it in this way. We have, originally when we went down this path, we said, 'Hey, there's about 100 basis points of margin expansion that can be unlocked over a two to three-year period as we achieve our turnover reduction goals.' And we said that that doesn't show up in just one line item. It sort of shows up in seven or eight at, you know, 10 to 15 basis points per line item. And that has happened. We are about two-thirds through, I'd call it 65 to 70 basis points of that unlock has been achieved. Now here is the thing we've actually achieved 130 basis points because we've overcome the margin headwinds of things that have affected against us such as drops in commodities, rents as we've talked about and increases in risk or from prior period severity. So, we've still got another third to go to get that at 100, but that would actually put it at closer to about 160 to 170 is what we would have achieved through that. So, you know, we believe you'll see the vast majority of that finish out over the course of '26. And then, you know, if there is, to use your word, additional give back because there was some labor softening, that would be determined. But I will tell you that look, you're always in the market to hire the best quality people and even in a time of labor softening best quality people in this economy have opportunities. So I wouldn't think of that not flexing downward. I would just think of it as being more stabilized.

Yes, thanks. Nothing to do with Chiquita. It's a one-off. I mean it's just a timing difference in commissioning a disposal well and some incremental costs in the meantime.

Yeah. Well, I mean you are correct, Mike. We have closed some of those deals. We closed a very nice-sized, a large company in South Florida in Q3. We have signed and will close in the next few weeks another nice company in Central Florida. So some of those were ones we were referring to. We're also referring to this large transfer station in New York that we have under definitive agreement since May. And as I mentioned earlier in a question asked, we will be closing that in this quarter as well. And there always are deals of various sizes that are under constant discussion and negotiation. I would characterize the M&A environment as continuing to be very strong, very robust. We've already done sort of about two times a normalized year through three quarters and we'll continue at a strong pace in Q4. So this is going to end up being more than double average year. And we're not really seeing any material change to that in any way as we head into '26. I think if and when and hopefully soon the economy turns as interest rates continue to pull down throughout and private owners get a little more lift in their sales that helps accelerate M&A activity. So the catalysts that drive things are going the right direction not the wrong direction.

Yeah. Well, first off, to answer your question, I think we're only in the second inning of a nine-inning game as far as deployment. So, very, very early in doing so. We have deployed this to about a seventh of our P&Ls so far and that will grow to about half to 75% throughout '26. So I think you'll continue to see improvement in that '26 and into '27 before you really start to see all of the impact. And really look, the ultimate objective, I think, and I don't think we're any different than any of the other large public companies, is how do you achieve your price increase objectives with the least customer churn by type of customer by geography. And so instead of being, I'm going to call it more uniform with if everybody's getting a 7% increase in a certain market, does somebody get 1.9 and somebody get 10.4 based on individual customer specifics of sort of an algorithmic stack of what we believe causes customer price acceptance or rejection or negotiation. And so I think ultimately this takes pressure off volume tradeoff between price and volume. And you're going to begin seeing that in '26 and continue to see it as we go forward. And I think it allows us to achieve with less customer rollback and defection our price increase objectives. So I think it's a little too early to say what else that means but if it accomplishes that objective alone we'd be extremely satisfied and the early indication from, you know, a 17th of the company's locations is very positive. It's a 30 to 40% reduction in churn on similar price increases. So that's pretty significant.

Yeah, sure. I'm happy to give you an update. So, Arrowhead has continued to progress. We are now hitting about 7,500 tons a day in Q3 at Arrowhead. Recalling that when we acquired the site in August of '23, so two years ago this quarter, it was about 2,500 to 2,700 tons a day. So, we've made substantial progress there. I will also tell you that we have laid the foundation for incremental continued improvement in '26 and '27 in that we have built out incremental track at our landfill and when I say we have, actually Norfolk Southern has done it for us of course with our capital and they've also done that at our Newark loading facility outside of New York City. Those two things were crucial for them to begin running a unit train for us, dedicated unit train multiple days a week and that is actually scheduled to begin in the mid to late fourth quarter of this year. That will be very helpful to us. That will reduce transit times by potentially up to 25 to 30%. And that helps the overall cost structure for Norfolk Southern, but also for us because it requires less rail car capital from us as we expand because you're getting more turns on your existing rail cars. So, those are all good things. Yes, and the pending UP Norfolk Southern merger, we, first off we have a very long-term contract with Norfolk Southern that will have no effect on or should have no effect from the merger. So we're not concerned about that. And UP really does not pull in the lane segments that we are operating in. And Norfolk Southern is the predominant rail there. So we really expect no material impact from their proposed merger.

Yeah, I would tell you that really we are tracking about as expected. We remain very confident in our ability to get the expansion. There's sort of a two-step process, well, there's a three-step process with the biggest one being a local host agreement approval and we have achieved that. There was also a legal challenge by some township group there and that has been effectively thwarted by the higher court in New York here in the last, it's been stayed is a better way to say it maybe than thwarted. We believe it's a good indication it will be thwarted but it's been stayed. So that's positive. And then there is a final technical demonstration through the state DOC and that is ongoing. So we again remain confident that we're on track to obtain it.

Well, first off, Stephanie, thank you for asking how we're doing. Thankfully, we're doing all right. I appreciate that. And as far as our pipeline, there is nothing in the pipeline that is anything but traditional solid waste deals. That is what is in the pipeline. That is what you will see closing in Q4. That is what you will see closing in '26. And we are not looking at something that is outside of our sort of core arena and do not believe there's any need to do so at this point in time.

Sure. I appreciate it, Tony. Look, with regard to PFAS, obviously things will continue to be codified through the federal government and we as an industry and us as a company will react to that. I can tell you that we have been working on this for the better part of three years. We've narrowed down to two to three technologies, all of which are working and performing very well. We have bought portable units at multiple of our landfills, effectively utilizing what I would call sort of a solidification and stabilization of the PFAS from a leachate and removing it before you do anything with the leachate and taking that PFAS which is now in a solid form and disposing of that properly. So we're very confident in our ability to comply with it. We're confident in our ability to pass those appropriate costs on in our rate increases to our customers and to demonstrate to publicly owned and privately owned wastewater treatment plants that the leachate is below a level from a PFAS standpoint of any federal regulation. So it is not a needle mover in any direction for us on a real revenue opportunity or a real expense creep at this point in time. So we remain confident in that. Plastics, obviously one of the national companies has done a great job with their, I think now two polymer centers they've opened and plan to open a third. What I would say is those have been opened in relatively large urban markets where that company has a very nice position and I think it makes tremendous sense. And I think they're demonstrating that it makes good sense there financially and sustainability-wise. We are looking at some similar things, not a polymer center but some similar plastic separation treatment technologies that could make sense, we're not prepared to say that they do but we are moving down a road testing some of them. So I would stay tuned on that. As you may know right now plastics have been falling. But the demand and the EPR requirements that are moving on through certain of the states, you're going to need to address plastics. We as a company and us as an industry to help those states comply with their EPR legislation. So it'll be a continued developing area.

Okay. Thank you, operator. Well, if there are no further questions, on behalf of our entire management team, we appreciate your listening to and interest in our call today. Maryanne and Joe Box are available today to answer any direct questions that we did not cover that we are allowed to answer under Regulation FD, regulation G, and applicable securities laws in Canada. Thank you again, and we look forward to connecting with you at upcoming investor conferences or on our next earnings call.