Alexis Ohanian on paid leave: No one should have to chose between their newborn and their career

Well, Alexis, great to be on here and chatting with you. It's complicated because the United States is a country that talks about family values as a priority. Both parties do. I think culturally, the country talks a lot about valuing family and it being the bedrock of society. I think the talk is finally running out for more and more Americans who realize that we are owed this opportunity. When a new life comes into our family, that is the most crucial time for both parents to be able to be there and be a part of it. No parent should have to choose between being with their newborn and their partner or saving their career. I was lucky because I ran the company and took full advantage of the policy we had at Reddit. But so many Americans, especially so many men, don't have the opportunity for parental leave or paternity leave, and that needs to change. I think the government now has a chance to step up and give the people what we want.

Sure. I've been working with Government Care to advocate for parental leave since 2019. We first introduced this pledge for paternity leave. We had thousands of parents sign, we brought their stories to Congress. I mean, we literally went to Congress, met with members of the House and the Senate, not just me but also other dads who either had or didn't have the opportunity to get paternity leave themselves, and brought those stories. It made a heck of a difference. In the wake of that, we actually got 12 weeks of paid family leave for all federal employees signed into law. That was the start of some momentum that will hopefully culminate this year as we get this not just for federal employees but for all Americans.

Yeah, we need to dispel that myth. Part of that is from type A business leaders like myself showing that actually no, what's most important is to make sure that the home front, the castle, is secure and sound before you can even consider doing your best work. I know for all of my employees, I push them, especially the men, to take this time, because that's what's going to ultimately change the culture. You're right, parents, men and women, must feel empowered to take leave. This needs to get normalized. Certainly women bear the higher brunt of this today in the workplace, but it shouldn't be a liability just to have a uterus in America. It should be something that every new parent sees an opportunity to take, even and especially the men. I think the way this changes is more and more men normalizing it, more and more men talking about it. What excites me is that this new generation of male CEOs in particular that we invest in and back at 776 are more motivated and more aware than ever about not only providing this for their employees but then taking advantage of it and talking about it. Look, how many of us have been on Zoom calls in the last couple of years and had our kids barge in, or maybe not always on live television like that guy on the BBC. But even that normalization makes a difference. No one of us who has a child can really say that there is a gulf or barrier between work and life. It blurs. This is the most crucial moment in welcoming a new member to the family. We need every American to have access to paid leave.

It is vital. Offering paid leave has become table stakes in the tech industry where the talent war is the most fierce. My founding partner here at 776, Scale and Holloway, she was our head of people and culture at Reddit and created that policy that I ended up taking. We know now for anyone trying to attract the best and the brightest and retain them, you need to have this policy. That's great for companies that have millions, hundreds of millions of dollars to invest in their employees. Small businesses, though, are such a crucial part of the economy. They don't have access necessarily to those kinds of dollars. That's why a federal policy is so important because it's going to lead to healthier outcomes for all. I want to say this: I see none of this to your personal story. I want every American to have the option. At the end of the day, it's not to prescribe you have to take the time. More importantly, it's to give the peace of mind and the flexibility. I've had employees who have had their third kid and they say, 'You know what, Alexis, to be honest, we got this. I'll take a few weeks off and then we'll be fine.' But I still push them to say, 'At least consider taking off every Friday after that and work a four-day work week, or whatever works for you and your family, but you can use this time flexibly.' Just that little bit of difference gives your family more freedom, gives your partner a day of support. It gives you optionality. No one's going to miss you if you take that one day out of the week. It's changing the mindset around it being this binary thing. I think this will accomplish that. That's exactly how I thought actually until I got presented with building our paid leave strategy, and I was like, 'Okay, this makes a lot of sense.' At the end of the day, I don't think there's a single one of us in this country who wants an American to have to choose between their kid and their partner and a paycheck. To be put in that place is not something I think any American should want, because families really are the bedrock, and we deserve to make sure everyone has that opportunity.

I'm going to give you a giant no comment on that one. I will say, in the wake of my resignation last June, I was really heartened to see the company respond by banning 3,000 hate communities, by honoring my request to be replaced by a Black director. Those changes aren't just good for society, they're good for business, they're good for the bottom line. Seeing the company's revenue growth since then as a result makes me so happy. I can't comment on any IPO plans. I do think at the end of the day, we've reached a new era in the last year as more and more people realize the power of community. I just want to see it live up to the best of what community can do. I'm optimistic to see that happen.

There's a lot there. With regard to your observation about the Teflon company, I do think regulators are at an inherent disadvantage when they don't understand the technology that they seek to regulate. We saw it again recently with a senator or congressman asking about Finsta accounts as though they were a product. That makes the rounds in tech. Those are fake Instagram accounts that anyone can create, used as an alternate account not under your real name. There is such a gulf between the folks who understand the technology and the folks who are regulating it in almost all cases, which presents a really big challenge because well-intentioned regulation can have really unintended consequences that don't actually solve the problem. At the risk of sounding cynical, I just don't know what will actually change from a regulatory enforcement standpoint. I do think the greatest leverage is from the market. We're already backing companies that are principally opposed to the sort of culture that Instagram has created, companies like Dispo where the goal is you take a photo and then you go back to living in the moment because you can't see it until the next day. It's not about taking 100 perfect photos to Photoshop and make it look amazing just to impress a bunch of strangers who don't actually care. I do think that momentum is actually going to end up moving a lot faster. With regard to Zuck, I think it comes down to the shareholders voting. I don't know. One thing I would like to see broadly is that it disappoints me when leaders lead by reacting as opposed to making hard decisions and actually leading from the front lines, as opposed to just being reactive to press cycles or outcry. It is hard. We're in territory that I don't think any of us expected. I started Reddit in 2005, things got started in 2003. We were building things that we thought we would like and other college kids like us would like. The reality is it's having much bigger implications on far more people than we ever expected. Part of that comes with responsibility. That's the part that I think every one of us is a bit fed up with, seeing leaders react instead of lead and actually make hard choices, accepting the reality of what an impact these platforms have.

Thank you, Alexis. Appreciate it.