Former chairman of MGM Television, Independent
Mark Burnett on 'The Voice' and 'The Bible'
Mark Burnett chats about 'The Voice' and 'The Bible' with Gold Derby editor Tom O'Neil.
About Mark Burnett
Mark Burnett, who has been diagnosed with stage three Parkinson's disease, has spoken publicly about his health and his development of a dietary supplement he markets through the website mybrainrestore.com. Burnett has stated that he was born at Camp Lejeune, North Carolina, and that he believes contaminated water there caused his Parkinson's. He has said that after his diagnosis, he researched a natural product that had been used in mouse studies to clear neurological disease, and that he began taking it himself. Burnett has claimed that his tremors stopped, that he was able to run a marathon, and that his Alzheimer's test results improved. He has described the supplement as being based on an ingredient from ancient Chinese medicine and said it targets the glymphatic system, a waste-clearing pathway in the brain discovered in 2012. In addition to his health-related work, Burnett has continued to produce content focused on project management and mindset, branding himself as "The Ambidextrous Project Manager." He has appeared on podcasts discussing the value of building long-term business relationships over short-term deals, and has given talks on overcoming adversity and leading with resilience. Burnett has also promoted his book and offered free PDF downloads and discount codes for his supplement, stating that the product takes six months to a year to show results. He has said that 10% of his buyers have been doctors, which he described as validating.
Transcript (46 segments)
✨ AI-enhanced transcript with speaker attribution
T
Tom O'Neil0:11
Mark Burnett, last year you broke into the Emmy race impressively with that nomination for The Voice for Best Reality Show and for Host. And this year you're not only back with The Voice as a strong contender again, but you're over in that movie/mini category area with The Bible. And as I was telling your wife yesterday, Roma Downey, I think anyone's a fool to bet that you will not be nominated. That's how convinced I am you're a lock there for a nomination. How are you feeling about that race?
M
Mark Burnett0:38
Well, that would be absolutely incredible to be recognized by our peers in our own Academy. It would be just a blessing. All we could do is do the best we could do, and we worked very, very hard for three and a half, four years on this. And obviously very gratified that almost 100 million people in America watched it. It'd be great if the Academy recognized it.
T
Tom O'Neil1:06
It also is very significant in terms of your career, isn't it? This is your first crossover into scripted drama, right?
M
Mark Burnett1:13
Yes, it is. Yes, first series I've made. I've made a couple of pilots before, but the first series.
T
Tom O'Neil1:18
So now I hear from Roma yesterday you have more ambitious plans. You'll do the feature film The Jesus, three-hour Resurrection future film. But that you're also planning other things beyond this, right?
M
Mark Burnett1:26
Yeah, yeah, we are. In fact, we locked the movie last night. The running time came in at 2 hours 13 minutes, which is significant for me. And yes, we're also working on a follow-up series and a few other things around this space. We love God. We love telling stories in this space and have a great time doing it.
T
Tom O'Neil1:52
Is this your penance for reality TV? I have to ask a cheeky question here, Mark. You know, some people say reality TV is the devil's work. Is this your way to buy your way into heaven? Say, all right, God, I gave you that, but come on, I'm giving you this too. Is this a bargain?
M
Mark Burnett2:05
No. I try and be in heaven every single day, and you can too. You can too. It's not when you die, it's every day.
T
Tom O'Neil2:14
That's a good attitude. I'm working on that. But you know how crazy these Emmys are, Mark. Going back to the year 2001, Survivor becomes this international phenomenon of pop culture. The Emmys at this point did not yet have a category for reality TV, so they put you off in this non-fiction category, which you won. And then the Academy said, all right, now we gotta get hip here, we got to have reality TV slots. Then they created that. And then this odd thing happened where Survivor couldn't even get nominated. And then even more odd, Jeff Probst couldn't seem to lose as host. I mean, there is a kind of peculiarity with show business awards that you just have to accept and, I guess, go with.
M
Mark Burnett2:58
Right. Different types of award shows. I mean, having... I've also produced the Emmys, as you know. And yeah, so I've got a Sports Emmy, I've got a Daytime Emmy, I've got a Primetime Emmy, maybe another daytime... I've got four, actually. And you know, it's up to the Academy. It's whatever the Academy is feeling in their different committees. On the other hand, there's other awards like People's Choice Awards, MTV Movie Awards, which are public voting. So there are all different kinds of award shows. And in this case, it's up to the Academy and what they feel their members liked on any given year.
T
Tom O'Neil3:37
You've also produced award shows as you mentioned, you've done the Emmys, you've done the MTV Awards. What's it like to be on that side of the event? Because there's a lot of pressure to come in on time, but also to deliver a really good show. And if you miss, you can get crucified.
M
Mark Burnett3:56
Right. That's a nice pun. Yeah, I've done so much live TV. Coming in on time is something we do. You know, even this week, we've been live for three hours this week already. The previous week, we did three hours on Sunday of Survivor, then five hours of The Voice that week, then another two hours with The Price is Right on the following Sunday. So it's live, live, live all the time. So coming in on time is just a job as a professional. Making a show great is the challenge. And I loved producing the Emmys a couple of years ago. I loved having Andy Samberg on stage. And you know, making a lot of short films. Had Charlie Sheen there. I had good fun. It was a really fun Emmys and highly rated.
T
Tom O'Neil4:45
Now they just announced that Neil Patrick Harris is the host of this year's. What do you think of that? He's almost the perfect host in a way, isn't he? Because he gets that ringmaster job he's got to do, but he also knows how to perform.
M
Mark Burnett4:59
Neil Patrick Harris is incredible. He's a very good friend of mine. I love him. And he is the perfect host for the Emmys on CBS. And I'm sure he'll get great ratings. He is wonderful.
T
Tom O'Neil5:17
You mentioned the Daytime Emmys, you've won a couple for doing Martha's Martha Stewart Show over the past few years. How many TV shows do you produce? Do you even know?
M
Mark Burnett5:28
You mean have I... or right now?
T
Tom O'Neil5:31
Right now. Right now, how many are you producing right now?
M
Mark Burnett5:33
In this last season: Celebrity Apprentice Sundays, which is in the 10 PM time slot. Mondays, The Voice, which wins Mondays. Tuesdays, The Voice, which wins Tuesdays. Wednesdays, 8:00, Survivor, which ended the season beating American Idol in the demo. Wow, which is a really, really big deal to me. And people kept saying, do you think Idol should be worried about The Voice? I said, no, I think Idol should be worried about Survivor. Fridays, we have Shark Tank, which is I think everybody's favorite show, it's undefeated on Fridays. And of course, within this same season, we did five Sundays with 10 hours on The Bible, which also came in number one. So we've had a very good 12 months in fun and also with the viewers and ratings.
T
Tom O'Neil6:28
Now, if you were forced by God, by the government, by some force to actually star as a contestant in one of your reality TV shows, and only one, which one would it be?
M
Mark Burnett6:40
Survivor.
T
Tom O'Neil6:41
Why?
M
Mark Burnett6:43
Oh, because I would really love nothing more than to be dropped off on an island for eight weeks. I love to be in jungles, on mountains and deserts. I love to be in jungles. I'm really, really comfortable in that environment. That's why I started making Survivor in the first place. It's my kind of thing. And my kids have grown up going to Survivor, hanging out in those jungles. Roma also. So that's our thing.
T
Tom O'Neil7:14
But you're on an island, Mark, with a lot of crazy people, and you can't get off. That's the problem. What if you're on there with the wrong crazy people? In other words, it's very easy for us to look at others as being crazy. Maybe I'm crazy, you know.
M
Mark Burnett7:29
I spend every morning looking back on what I could have done better yesterday. And that's the good thing, we always get second chances. And I think that's what it takes to win Survivor: be aware of what you're giving off, be aware of yesterday's actions and actions from a minute ago, and the ability to know that and change it. Because people always give you second chances. It's being able to moderate your behavior. We all make mistakes. Survivor is a political game. Survivor is a game where the winner wins a million dollars because they are granted that million by the very people they kicked off.
T
Tom O'Neil8:11
And what about The Voice? What do you think the magic formula is there for its success? Because it was very successful right away.
M
Mark Burnett8:20
The Voice is young America's music show. It's the four superstar, current music stars whose day job isn't being on The Voice; their day job is making music and touring. It's fun. And the music on the show is all current music. And we adapted into social media. We didn't try and tell the audience to do it our way. We met the audience where they were. So it's a television show with an incredible social media presence with Twitter and Facebook. You can vote by buying on iTunes. It met the audience where they were. It's fun. There's great chemistry. And clearly, all those people who said to me, you should not be doing a music show, there's already too many, and you'll never be Idol or X Factor, we clearly proved them wrong.
T
Tom O'Neil9:16
The one complaint against the Emmys that I find valid, and by the way the Emmys find this critique valid too, is that they have not yet solved the problem of how to properly acknowledge reality television. You have a form of television which dominates primetime, at least 50% of primetime, and they only have, what, three categories at the Emmys. They have Reality Program, Competition Program, and Host. So I think they should have two more. I think they should have an Emmy for Best Reality Judge. And when I ask some people what they think of that idea, they go, interesting, and I hear a lot of split yes and no. But when I pose my other idea, which is Contestant, everyone shouts me down and goes no, Tom, that's a terrible idea. I think there should be Emmy categories for both. What do you think?
M
Mark Burnett10:09
Here's how... as a person, if you're honest with yourself, you can change. Right? So when I'm not producing the Emmys, I'm the biggest, loudest complainer of why wouldn't there be more categories for reality TV. Because reality TV dominates ratings. It's way more than half the top 10 of TV shows. So morally, it should have half the awards on the Emmy, right? Morally. However, the minute I produced the Emmys, I didn't want that. Because the Emmys is a primetime variety show, it's an award show and a variety show. And people want to see stars. People don't want to see reality show contestants. They want to see bona fide TV stars. So the minute I produced it, I was like, no, no, no, no, no, more reality categories. So it depends on what hat I'm wearing. When I'm not producing it, yeah, yeah, yeah, give it more awards. If I'm producing it and I want ratings, no, I want more stars.
T
Tom O'Neil11:04
But you could shove them off on the Creative Arts. That's why they have the Creative Arts the week before, so they can get rid of the less glamorous or less star-studded categories. Meanwhile, they still put some there. They put the guest acting categories, for example. The challenge, as I hear it from producers of the Emmys, is that the particular problem there is that you have to honor the Guild's request to include writing in a drama series, directing in TV movies/miniseries. You end up with more than 25 categories that you have to accommodate in a three-hour show, which leaves you very little time in between to do much else.
M
Mark Burnett11:41
Well, those categories go the same way. For the reason as a well-known successful reality show producer, I'm saying when I'm producing it, I don't want more of those categories because I know what makes a good primetime show. Similarly, truly, I think the categories where the winners are not famous, recognizable faces, it doesn't make great TV. So really, the show would be a lot better with a lot less categories. And I think everyone would agree with that.
T
Tom O'Neil12:10
Yes.
M
Mark Burnett12:12
If you look at what I did with the MTV Movie Awards, you know, cut down to only maybe nine awards in two hours. And then the People's Choice Awards, which one time had 35 awards, I think, now we're down to like 15 awards on the People's Choice. I do it year after year. People want to be entertained. And you know the politics involved of what gets on. So really, by the same token, if there's going to be all these different writing and categories which are non-star related awards, then you might as well include way more reality categories, because reality gets the ratings. More people watch reality than watch scripted, there's no question about that. But in my opinion, when I produce the Emmys, I'd much rather have more scripted stars on screen. It makes a better TV show.
T
Tom O'Neil13:06
Okay, but to address your point about the actual moral obligation the Emmys have to do their job, which is to honor the best TV, and just in terms of justice, those categories should exist. I think so. I understand what your point is about the telecast, but what about the Creative Arts or the off-air awards there? They should do it. Do you agree with the premise that they should have more reality awards there? You don't have to have them on the main ceremony.
M
Mark Burnett13:32
Okay, different subject. Yes, clearly it's a moral obligation to have way more reality categories if you want to reflect what people are watching. That's the truth. And what should those categories be? I don't know. But I mean, there's so many different shows. It just needs to be reflective. I mean, you need to divide up the ratings and the hours of TV. The percentages should be based upon what people are watching. I mean, let's face it, name a drama that's beating Duck Dynasty. You can't name one, right? So therefore, that's what people are watching. So the way I said to you about The Voice, we adapted into what the viewers are, how they're consuming, how they're feeling, how they're living their TV entertainment live. So that meant Twitter and Facebook and all the social media. We adapted into that. Well, clearly, an award show about television needs to adapt into what the viewers are doing. Not the primetime telecast. The primetime telecast should be all about stars. But there are two different things going on. There's the Emmys in general, who give out awards which are just based upon reflecting what's on television during the year and what was the best. And then there's a separate thing, which is a primetime telecast.
T
Tom O'Neil15:06
Are there any changes in general that you would like to make if you were named King of the Emmys tomorrow? About the show, about the TV Academy, about... because I know you've been active at the Academy.
M
Mark Burnett15:16
Yeah. Nobody's naming me king of anything, let alone... I'm lucky I've ever won an Emmy Award, trust me. I've got a pretty big mouth, so I'm not exactly the favorite child over there. No, but you're asking me, and one thing about me is I have opinions. And you ask me direct questions, and I've given you direct answers. But my main skill set is not being a politician, obviously. My skill set is ratings on primetime television. So I think it's fair enough to say that I'm pretty good at that. And what would make the Emmys higher rated would make it more entertaining.
T
Tom O'Neil15:59
Do you believe there's a bias against broadcast TV at the Emmys? In the old days, of course it was the opposite. It was hard for cable to break through. And then last year, we saw something really shocking happen, which was for the first time ever in the history of the award, all of the contenders for Best Drama Series were cable or basic cable and HBO, etc. There were no broadcast shows in there, not even The Good Wife. And there's a trend in general at the Emmys to be more art house, the same way we see at the Oscars they like more art house films. And now that you're producing so successfully in both for NBC with The Voice and CBS with Survivor and your other shows, so you have this major place in broadcast television, but you're now succeeding in cable with The Bible on the History Channel, etc. Is there anything to be said about this cable versus broadcast conflict at the Emmys?
M
Mark Burnett16:56
Well, what I believe is that people do not watch channels. People watch shows. So people are very capable with their remote control and their DVRs and their computers to watch what they want to watch, when they want to watch it. People are absolutely not brand loyal to any channels. They are show loyal. And all the Emmys should do is reflect what the viewers are watching. And then within those categories, they have opinions. They're committees. And hopefully the committees are reflective of the volume of production and consumption of that production. So, and I don't know... I'm not on any committees. No one would ask my opinion, for sure. And you know, probably it doesn't matter what I think at all.
T
Tom O'Neil18:03
It does. You're a veteran of these things. Let me ask you this. I think all Hollywood would like to know your answer on this. The Oscars have taken such a beating in recent years with hosts. I thought Seth MacFarlane was fantastic this past year. I'm in the minority there, but of course he took a lot of lumps. However you measure it, so as you look forward to the Oscars in the future, do you have advice for Neil Meron, Craig Zadan, and Don Mischer about host over there? Who are the people out there in Hollywood that should host the Oscars, or the other major award shows, that we're not thinking of? Who should we be asking to do this job?
M
Mark Burnett18:40
Well, first of all, I think Ricky Gervais is brilliant. You know, Seth MacFarlane is brilliant. And that is, to me, in my opinion, the greatest kind of host. Because they are very funny, they're very current. And you're supposed to be watching an entertaining telecast. It's not about watching insiders pat each other on the back. That's why big stars sell ratings. And you need a funny host. And I thought Seth was brilliant. So you may be asking the completely wrong person. I mean, I think Seth Meyers would be brilliant. You know, I think... so many people. I mean, you can see where my brain's at.
T
Tom O'Neil19:31
Well, do you think Ricky Gervais would do it? Ricky is a reader of Gold Derby, we could send this video. So if you had to speak to Ricky right now, if they offer him the host job, should he do it or no?
M
Mark Burnett19:44
I've got one thing to say to Ricky, and it's an inside joke: chim chiminy, chim chiminy, chim chim cheroo. We're good friends, and he knows I love him. And he'd be brilliant. He'd be totally brilliant. I mean, he's the only guy... by the way, he's a very close friend. Him and Jane. Me and Roma ran into each other at a show in New York recently. And he said to us, hey guys, you know, congratulations on The Bible results. Have you heard about my new show? I said no, what is it? He said, oh, it's called The Atheist. That's so Ricky. Oh, you hang out with him too long or you go to hell with him. You gotta watch that guy. I'm only going one place, and that's every day heaven. You know, but he's a really close friend of ours. Different views, but he's really, really funny. You know, I've been ripped on Family Guy, so you know I also love Seth. I mean, this, you know, also anybody that does Saturday Night Live... this is my vibe of what I think is funny. I think very good for primetime TV. But I just want to be clear what I'm saying to you. There's two different things going. There's honoring within your own peer group, the Academy, and that's completely valid. And then it's making a primetime TV show. They're not necessarily congruent.
T
Tom O'Neil21:02
Okay, well, we'll wrap it up there. Thank you very much, Mark. Good luck on these many, many fronts that you're competing at the Emmys. It should be a good year for you.
M
Mark Burnett21:10
Yep.
T
Tom O'Neil21:12
And as you said, it'd be lovely if The Bible got nominated, but that's certainly in the hands of God. I think you're pretty sure of the nomination, but you may need some divine intervention to win, considering you're up against those HBO things like Behind the Candelabra, etc. That's going to be tough. But we'll worry about that after mid-July when you get the first nomination. Thank you so much for taking the time to talk to me.
M
Mark Burnett21:35
Same beard. Thank you, Mark. Crazy hair, crazy beard and everything. You look great.