Prime Minister Nabbanja on service delivery and fight against graft | CITIZEN VOICES

Thank you so much, Emmanuel. First of all, good evening, Ugandans. I hope you are okay wherever you are. Thank you for the work you are doing for yourselves and for the country. First of all, allow me to say I am very fine, very vulnerable. Yes, I want to inform your guidance that I'm only grateful to God for the opportunity to serve the country, and also thank government and through the president for the opportunity. Because I know some critics may look at me as somebody who is not grounded, but the fact is I'm not new. I started from the ground. I started as a councilor, a district councilor. I'm a business woman, you didn't know that. And of course, I have served as a minister, I served as a treasurer, I served as a commissioner of parliament, and now prime minister. So I think throughout I have been gathering expert experience, and I want to inform you, Garner, that I know my role. Of course, this is constitutional: coordinating government ministries like you have put it, and of course monitoring, supervision, evaluation. By the way, I did a master's degree in monitoring and evaluation. So the critics, I think, are not really being fair here. How would you judge me in just a short way? By the way, these days they have even kept quiet, if you have been following properly. And some people are saying they are doing that because they think they see you as a woman, being the first female prime minister in the country, the first female prime minister of the country, and somebody from a humble background. And I, of course, because of the way I do my things, hands-on. And of course, our Ugandans are yearning for service delivery, supervision. They are used to people who sit in offices and write reports, sometimes the reports which are not related to what was on the ground. And that's why you are now seeing ministers moving up and down. We are coordinated, by the way. The other time, remember I was in Kassanda? Yes, and you phoned for me, I would not cover up. I would not cover up when we found that the materials and the items we are going to give our people were not standard. Outrightly, for me, I will not cover up for graft. I will not cover up for anybody. The other day we were in Nakasongola and we found that there is a road or a bridge that is supposed to be constructed by Omega as a company since 2018. They have failed to complete the bridge. Billions of shillings have been paid. I caused the meeting, we went through. Why was this man not delivering? So the phone before that, in two days I asked the ministers to go back and establish the truth. You saw what was happening on TV. I remember I saw something on your TV. Yes, I also saw the Kassanda incident. So in essence, ministers are now more proactive because you as a leader, you're going to the ground. I am leading by example. This business of sitting in our offices so that the reports can find us here without us seeing what is happening, it is not my style of work. And members of parliament together with the local leaders have appreciated this. And that's why you are also seeing members of parliament moving down. We also agreed with the parliamentary leadership, the commission of parliament, that members of parliament should be also given time to go and monitor. That's why you have seen, because I'm a commissioner of parliament also, being a prime minister it's constitutional. That's why you are seeing them now talk about YOGA, which was not the case before. We would start the parliament until maybe unless when you are a member of parliament, we would decide by yourself, let me go to monitor this and this. Ministers are moving on ground. This is the norm and it will not stop. Like you have said, I will not get tired.

I think corruption can be fought on two fronts. One, by punishing the culprits through the rightful procedures, through the investigative arm of government. You know we have IGG, we have the State House Anti-Corruption Unit, and many others, Auditor General and many others. We can also do preventive. How? By directly supervising all of us: the local leaders, the members of parliament, the ministers. And that is proactive. If we can prevent, for me I feel I should not really do post-mortem. It's better to prevent than doing post-mortem. You know these are the MDAs and the government agencies. They do post-mortem audits. You saw what I did. I did not wait for post-mortem. And two, I want us to also be a little more active so that whoever takes the money of government, of the city. That's why now, for example, remember the system I brought, the police I brought of cash relief for the vulnerable people. Those people of Gulu who did not know that this was a trap, they wouldn't answer. So was it a trap? We'll come to that question. No, they would answer definitely because they are known. Wasn't a trap indeed. I remember coming here and telling them, my brothers and sisters, this one is not the usual one. Because they used it because it was, of course I know they are fighting it. Even you people of this station, you went to Gulu and saw the first beneficiary. I remember watching here, somebody see you is called who are moving for business. Exactly, there was lots of publicity in regard to that. Now, if that man is there, that's why for me after getting data, the data was coming from responsible officers, the town clerks. Those are not small people. They would go, get the data, get the people, the vulnerable people, put them on the data in the data bank, and then transfer that data to Ministry of Gender. From Ministry of Gender they would transfer that data to Post Bank. That's why it was very easy for me to get requests and I read on table.

And that happened during my leadership? Where were we? Because, well, you know the other time, I don't think people who work in Prime Minister's office are small people, are they? They are not. Actually, they were interdicted. There are some questions which are said for defeating. If that has been happening, it's going to change. It's going to change. Of course, we have built a team. You see the ministers now, all of them moving out. It is because we have a team. We have a team. You have seen the president, the way he has been addressing the nation. We now have built a team and the mass political muscle. And I believe we only need you people like you, we need the press, we need you, we need the civil society, the churches, we also need Ugandans. So that everybody now, because we cannot fight graft alone in the offices and ministries, we also need local people, we need local councils. That's why wherever I have been, I make sure that the following day or after three days I have meetings. I have met the leaders of Kassanda and we have made some progress. I have met the leaders of Nakasongola, I have met the leaders of Gulamboli, I have met the leaders of Kakumiro, I have met a number of leaders, leaders of Lira. You see what I'm talking about. We cannot, even if we struggle this side of Kampala without involving the local leaders, because service delivery is done at local level. And therefore we want to involve everybody. That's why I'm here. I'm now also recruiting you. So it is not, you cannot fight this alone. We also have to recruit parents, that's true, such that when they are bringing up their children, they incorporate the morals, the fabric that is supposed to be, you know, that will help this nation to move forward. The religious leaders, you have seen me having meetings with religious leaders. It is everybody. Mine is just to coordinate. I cannot deceive you that I will fight it alone. You and me have a role to play.

I, you have been following all my trips. Have I ever been alone? I have been moving with a number of ministers. What does that mean? I have been moving with local leaders. What does that mean? Is that micro management? A prime minister is a coordinator of all government programs and ministries. We have a technical arm of government. You cannot be alone and do everything. So those critics, I know they are very unfair. They are gender insensitive. It is because I'm a woman, and they are used to women who are always in the kitchen. So yes, it must be sincere to you. Because I believe the few days I've been in that office as a prime minister, there are a number of achievements we have made. So typical patriarchal sentiments, of course, that a woman should be in her place. Because remember the other day I was in parliament, my brother Semuju, you know the attorney, says he has been, you know, his attorneys. Yeah, but he's supposed to keep government ministers on their toes, that's why. But you also have to respect. We have children. Definitely we have children. I'm not a small woman, I'm a big woman. I have children, I have graduates at home. My children are lawyers. Oh yes. So somebody standing on the floor of parliament to really start belittling me is real. And colorful. Did he give it to you? Of course, when somebody says you cannot even manage a company of garbage, how do you feel? And I think that should stop. Yes, I am a woman. He has his daughters, he has his mother, he has his other people who are women. And I believe he should give me chance, and the others who are like him should give us an opportunity so that women can also do something. For me, I just want to praise the president for choosing me, for choosing many women. And we are ready to serve, and we have started serving. And I can see there is light at the end of the tunnel.

Yes, I believe I'm a fisherman, bearing in mind my history. There is nothing I have not seen in this country. I have risen from nowhere, you know. My background is such that people could not even believe I can rise up to this level. And to me, I think I know what service delivery means. I know that somebody down there in the villages can be there and have something to eat. That's why the other time I came up with the other strategy of cash relief, because first of all I knew that some of the money gets lost through middlemen. And that did not go well with some people. And being sincere to you, we shall work. The fishermen will really help this government to move to some level.

The fact is the economy is doing badly. It's a reality not only here in Uganda but globally. And therefore, government is coming up with a number of responses. Yes. Remember the other time when our people were almost lacking what to eat, the strategy we brought, yes, please. That's one. Two, in order for us to mitigate this, we also think we should vaccinate. We should vaccinate everybody so that we first of all secure the life of our people, like many other economies have done. Then we also, that's why we had to open. We did not open it because we had grown on top of everything. We still had 80%, do you remember? Yes, please. 80% of our people are still struggling with the problem. But because we thought we needed, and of course we have sensitized our people, we have to live with COVID. Sensitization has always been on its peak, remember. Through the Ministry of Health, the number of interventions that we have made, continuous testing, including testing those people who come from other countries into here. But most importantly, remember we want to see people back on their feet. The big companies, remember we have the bank, the development bank. They are those who have advised to go to gather the woman, yes, to go and get support from those banks. On the other hand, we are also looking at, in fact tomorrow I have a meeting, the national task force meeting, so that we can prepare our people and see how best do we have our children back to school, how best do we have these other measures that would keep our children without getting infected. That's why you are seeing us now vaccinating our teachers. That is not enough. We are also introducing the parish model. The parish model will help us to go to the parish as a country. Those people that have not been benefiting this time around, we feel they will benefit. The only challenge we had was the budget. Remember we had the budget cuts so that we can have some other responses, quick resources to cover the pandemic. We had to buy oxygen cylinders, we had to look after the sick, those who were in our isolation centers, those who were critical, who needed oxygen. Remember. So we had to prepare all that, and therefore there was a budget cut. But that's not enough. We are targeting now to see that all Ugandans can benefit from the parish model. The parish model definitely will also absorb other people who have not been in the money economy. We are going to put 100 million per parish in the next financial year. This financial year was not easy because of the pandemic, because of budget cuts. But even then, we are starting with 14 million point five per parish. So next financial year we are putting 100 million per parish. And this money will be used by our people. So that those people who go and benefit can also now start small projects. They can go farming. If say for example you borrow like five million at parish, if everybody borrows 5 million per parish, those will be 20 people. 20. Yes, those would be 20. Now if each person borrows 1 million, those will be 100 people. 100 people per parish. You can use, what can you use with a million? Let me give you as a fisherwoman. In one million, if say for example you did the piggery, each piglet costs approximately 100, between 100 and 120. If you look after that piglet, a piglet can give you over 15 piglets after one year or after six months, depending on how you look after your pig. And each piglet costs 100. In just six months, one person will be having almost 1.5 million. If you buy say for example five piglets and leave the balance to look after the piglets, that means how much you will have? 500. 1.5 times 5, that would be 7.5 in six months.

I want to assure you that some of the programs and projects that we have been carrying out have been far from the people. The YOGA program is at constituency level, but that one is targeting the other group of people, you know, the business people, the salon, the boda boda riders, those ones. And this one is now targeting the very last person. It is targeting the farmers. It is, I believe, those people who are doing our day-to-day activities. And of course, I believe people will now have chance to choose what to do, but technically guided. Technically guided. The enterprise somebody will come with will be technically guided because the parish will be manned by the sub-county and the district technical team as overseers. We have also set a committee. Usually we have a committee at district level that approves, but this time the parish with the parish leaders will be the ones to approve the beneficiaries. And of course the parish leaders come from villages. We have identified the chairman LC2 as the head of that committee. The secretary will be the parish chief, and the parish chiefs are usually diploma holders, that is the qualification. Perhaps I think, yes, the parish chief. Yes, we have been having a problem, some parishes don't have parish chiefs. So we already have sent money to the districts to recruit parish chiefs. Let me take this opportunity now that this is a national TV and everybody is watching, we already sent money to recruit parish chiefs in districts. And therefore we are requesting the district service commissions across the country to recruit parish chiefs because the project is on now. Then we also identified a woman leader at parish level, and that is the chairperson of women council at parish level. Each parish has that person. They use council chairperson. The other issue of youth can also be taken care of. The PWD will be on that committee, and then an opinion leader. A total of seven people will man that committee. And we have put a small budget for them to sit at least every month to identify the beneficiaries. So that now people don't say, "Ah, the one who got NADS money is the same who gets YOGA, is the same who gets what." So this time it's the local leaders. And we are saying the local leaders this time around, please try to make sure that everybody benefits from this program.

The Office of the Prime Minister has got technical people who support the decisions that I make. Secondly, we had three consecutive meetings, three, remember because I was seeing them aired here, with the national task force. We sat as a national team. This decision is not mine. It's for the national government. Even cabinet, it's not my personal decision. Okay, we agreed as cabinet. Yeah, because you take collective responsibility. I have grace. It's not personal. Yes, please. Now after agreeing that really if somebody is given 100,000, that money can push somebody. One, look what's the choice a person makes. Yesterday, but when I saw some old woman instead of buying food for her, she had kaunga, she bought iron sheets. And that is a big choice somebody made. Secondly, we cut costs. You know the people, the suppliers who give us, the suppliers with a profit, so that profit was an additive or an additional, it added some more kilograms of posho if one was to buy posho. And of course those middlemen are not happy. They are still fighting up today. This was a successful program by all standards. One, if we had to go through the procurement process, you know the process, how long it takes. You know the process. Yes, but this time round it's protracted. We spent only three weeks, two weeks in fact. The third one people had demand on the account. Definitely. We, of course you know that the data was coming like I already told you, the data was coming from the town clerks. The only challenge we had was at data entry and collection. But by and large, this was a successful program. To me, I counted it at almost 97% successful. Yes, it could have had glitches.

What are you trying to use right now? Right on your book, the view out there is yes. For instance, and let me tell you, we are going to definitely pay back this money. But instead of prioritizing the purchase of vehicles for the highest paid civil servant, which one for members of parliament who receive a vehicle, and some of them are ministers who have also received a vehicle, why if we really are a government that listens to the voice of the ordinary people, why couldn't we prioritize the most vulnerable person and postpone? There's even, I think, you are asking a question as if you don't know that governments have three arms of government. The legislature, that is parliament. Parliament has got its own budget, and they prioritize their budgets and needs depending on the season, on what they are going to do. So parliament had already prioritized before our lockdown to buy cars for the new members of parliament. You were aware some of the members of parliament were coming on a boda boda, and you expect them to go and monitor government programs and projects? They are, you know the roles of members of parliament. Okay, one of them is oversight. Yes. Oversight does not mean sitting in the chairs and getting ministers and civil servants and asking them questions. They also have to go and see what is happening. Some of the members of parliament, you know their background. And I believe parliament, that was their priority: members of parliament to have their car. And the money by the time we went into a lockdown, it was already on the account of parliament. And I don't want you to ask me more questions asking me those directed to my, okay. So members of parliament definitely have a right to move. Some people were saying why couldn't they move on a boda boda? Can you move on a boda boda and go to Kakuro? You need transport. Yes. Perhaps government could give them loans. But I will not stick to that.

The most critical challenge is COVID-19. It's a big challenge. We want to save every life in Uganda. Of course Ugandans are also responsible, but it's a big challenge. It's not only in Uganda, it's global. The other challenge I see now in the country are these panga-holding people, yes, in Masaka. And of course you know the reasons because I've been seeing a lot of things on TV.

We don't know. But of course, let me mention a few. I'm told some of the issues are because of land. People are fighting over some pieces of land. That's one. Two, thugs, these village thugs. Three, there are those unknown motives of those people, we don't know yet. But of course we shall get to know. Some people say intelligence is telling us are politically motivated. Politically motivated. And they want to take away the lives of all the people. Some are politically. I'll stop there. I will not go.

No, you know some people think these are acts being instigated by, you know, I'm giving you a compound of reasons. One is thuggery. You know some people in the villages think because of the other actions that are being taken by the other people, other thugs are also taking advantage. And you understand what I'm talking about. Thugs in the villages, they cut the other man. The other day, if this one knows that that one has some money, that person now also under the cover of the insecurity that is there, somebody goes also to do something. Others have, you know, the relationships that have gone bad because they know they are men who are wielding pangas and cutting and killing people. So those are also there. They are taking advantage. And some of them have been arrested, by the way. I want to thank our security agencies who have helped us to go on top of this. It will end. I am talking as a feminist of this country. I have a lot of trust in our security agencies. This will end. It will come to an end. We shall go over this. But I wanted to also mobilize our citizens in that area, Masaka and many other parts, because you may think it is only in Masaka when they are planning to go in other areas. That, let us all be on alert. Yes. The village security committees should be functional and revitalized. Revitalize. You can see now we have really deployed both uniformed and non-uniformed police officers and other security agencies. And by the way, I want to request our people in Masaka, including members of parliament, whether you're in opposition or not, you need to go down and help us mobilize our people so that they know that together we can go over this.

I gave you a number. How does that fit within the ambit of what you said that these are politically motivated killings? You have been following. I don't want to go in details. You have been following. And that is what I have told you. Okay.

This is not a characteristic. Like you can see security people running over these people because they come at night. And secondly, you realize that since 24th of August, we heavily deployed in Masaka. And I believe that the people are aware that mobilizing security also needs a cost. We have to mobilize the resources. Of course, that's why I want to mobilize leaders that it's good for us to prevent these events to happen in our areas than waiting for them to come.

That's a tough question. I don't believe, I don't want to be remembered for the words I said like now. I want to be remembered for actions. For service delivery. For actions, you know what I'm talking about. And as a first female Ugandan prime minister who struggled together with the president and other leaders to succeed and make Ugandans receive services. I want to be remembered for those actions that we shall have taken as a government.