CEO (Coffee Operating Unit / future Global Coffee Co.) & Executive Director, JDE Peet's (Coffee Operating Unit of Keurig Dr Pepper / future Global Coffee Co.)
MasterClass with Rafael Oliveira, President International of Kraft Heinz
New MasterClass episode with Mark Thompson, World's #1 CEO Coach and Rafael Oliveira, President International of Kraft Heinz. In this episode, we discuss the challenges facing business during this time and how companies can even grow during COVID-19.
About Rafa Oliveira
Rafael Oliveira, President International of Kraft Heinz at the time of the appearances, discussed the company's partnership with musician Ed Sheeran to launch a hot sauce brand called Tingly Ted's. He stated that Sheeran had the idea for the sauce and the brand name, and that Kraft Heinz developed the product as "sauces experts" while Sheeran owns the brand. Oliveira also commented on the global cost of living crisis, saying that challenges such as ingredient costs, supply chain disruptions, and labor uncertainty are "happening across the globe" and that the company aims to "balance to do the best thing for our consumers on the long term." In a 2020 interview, Oliveira reflected on the early stages of the COVID-19 pandemic, stating that he initially thought it would be contained like SARS and that he "could have probably gained a couple of weeks" if he had acted on his early knowledge of the virus's spread. He also discussed his management approach, emphasizing the importance of understanding each team member individually to motivate them effectively, and contrasted this with his experience in investment banking, where he said "most of the people care more about money."
Transcript (20 segments)
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Interviewer0:11
What do you wish you knew about the planning for something like this that you know today? Many of us are learning at a breakneck pace. You've been at this for a couple of months doing it at scale. You moved from business continuity to thinking about the permanent new normal. What do you wish you knew at the beginning that's becoming evident?
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Rafa Oliveira0:45
In the beginning, we all thought it might be like SARS, contained to China and Hong Kong. There was denial about how connected the world was. Looking back, my company reacted very fast, but I could have gained a couple of weeks if I had seen from the start that it would definitely spread. I even knew from colleagues in China in January, but I didn't act on it. I wish I had taken it more seriously quicker, prepared more, and stocked up more. I was with Jim Kim of the World Bank who warned us about the coming pandemic, and I sold some stocks then. But actually, the markets recovered, so in hindsight, doing nothing worked too.
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Interviewer3:53
Tell me about the dynamics of the people. I've seen an arc in any crisis: first everyone rallies with adrenaline, then it turns from a sprint to an 800-meter dash. What have you been observing with your team and what have you been learning about what they need from you as a leader?
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Rafa Oliveira4:33
A couple things. First, connectivity is even more important. Before, you bump into people in the office and make quick decisions. Now, everything requires a phone call or video call, so we need extra effort. I commit to calling 10 to 20 people each week that I don't talk to daily—just a quick check-in. That connectivity reverberates exponentially. The second thing has been a positive surprise: giving autonomy to people and trusting them to make the right call drives speed. For example, we launched a direct-to-consumer product in the UK for emergency workers in just two weeks. Normally that would have taken months of analysis. The crisis forced us to delegate, and people often come up with something better than I thought.
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Interviewer8:53
It's interesting how the crisis turned a trend into a mega-trend and operationalized delegation and empowerment. Take us a little bit around the world in terms of the places you've served and how you connect with culture, people, and markets.
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Rafa Oliveira9:43
We just launched a new purpose for the company: 'making life delicious.' It made me reflect on what makes my life delicious—living in many countries, experiencing different cultures, how they do business, how they give a card, what yes or no means. I've lived on almost every continent except Africa. You learn how speed and decision-making vary. Some cultures need strong direction, others prefer debate, others will challenge everything. But the universal thing is that people enjoy having autonomy, once they get used to it. The fulfillment of ownership and empowerment is really rewarding, and the results have been great.
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Interviewer11:57
When you parachute into a new place, there's a set of issues and relationships to address. What's been a major pivot you've had to go through in one of these places? How have you approached having impact quickly?
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Rafa Oliveira12:45
The critical thing is to understand the dynamics of the country or region. For example, when I started doing business in China, I learned that signing the contract is when the negotiation really starts—it's the opposite of the West. In Japan, decisions take longer because they dive into every tiny detail until they reach consensus. You have to respect these cultural dynamics and not impose your own way. It's a learning journey to accept that different ways all lead to success.
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Interviewer15:04
When you arrive in a new culture, how do you onboard your boss and stakeholders? How do you stay connected and get the authority you need while far from headquarters?
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Rafa Oliveira15:48
Communication is critical. I've learned to understand what type of communication works for each person. Some prefer WhatsApp, others SMS, others email, some a phone call. For example, my CEO boss likes to see things quickly on WhatsApp; my general counsel is an SMS person. You have to adapt. I first try to agree on preferences, but often you learn over time by testing. It's like international geography applied to an office: different people need different channels.
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Interviewer18:49
That's a profound point. It might seem obvious but it's not practiced. You're seeking to understand what someone values and needs before seeking to be understood, almost as if speaking a different language.
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Rafa Oliveira19:57
It's different now because we're giving presentations online and can't read the audience. Yesterday I spoke to 1,000 people internally and had no idea if it landed. So I rely on a few trusted people to get feedback afterwards. It's harder to immediately feel understood, but again, it's about seeking what they're looking for.
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Interviewer21:21
We did a national study with Gallup and Fortune asking people if they feel valued and understood. The ratings were B's and C's. Then we asked how well they think they understand what others value, and that number was much lower. There's a wonderful and tragic irony. You put some people just to sing a song but don't understand what song they're trying to sing.
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Rafa Oliveira23:23
Yes, exactly. That's what you do at scale as an international executive. I spend a lot of time thinking about how the message will be perceived. I repeat it in different forms—video, email, written—because some people get it one way and not another. And if it doesn't land, it's my problem; I need to do it again.
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Interviewer25:01
For an early manager, what skills should they develop beyond communication? What key traits would you advise them to focus on?
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Rafa Oliveira25:54
Managing more people means you become less of a doer and more of a coach. That transition isn't always obvious. When I ran a country, I knew the business well and had most answers. But as you scale, you can't have all the answers. You have to trust people to have them and ask the right questions. The acceptance of saying 'I don't know' is crucial. It takes time, but if you embrace it, you become a better coach. Even with the Board of Directors, it's okay to say you don't know something.
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Interviewer29:43
That's a critical change. I've seen executives start very directive, then as complexity increases they must become collaborators. There's irony in being attracted to confident people, but sometimes that confidence doesn't translate to the best leadership. How do you balance ambition and hubris with the capacity to listen and engage?
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Rafa Oliveira31:07
I haven't found a perfect formula. It depends on the situation. When I took over the struggling Australia/New Zealand business, I needed to be more decisive. Later, in Europe, the business was in better shape so I could be more of a coach. I now divide decisions into three types: 'go ahead,' 'no,' and 'I would do it this way but it's your decision.' It takes time for people to get used to that empowerment. The biggest learning is to understand each person individually. What motivates them? Money, title, pride in product, managing people? If you can understand that, you can motivate them effectively.
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Interviewer36:59
I guess that's why you've been so successful—you connect with people from different parts of the planet. You make a wonderfully rare presentation of being empathetic and understanding what people need. Thank you very much for having me.
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Rafa Oliveira37:53
Thank you. Thank you. Take care.