Trzydzieści lat minęło: rozmowa z Markiem Piechockim, prezesem LPP

Hello, welcome. 30 years, quite a time, and it passed like one day. We'll probably find out soon.

Listen, I think with dreams, it's hardest for young people because then we want to enjoy life and have fun. As he said, wanting to be a scooter rider is about having fun. In my times, there were significantly fewer opportunities, and we wanted to have a good life. If you think about what Marcin said, he wasn't thinking about his professional future but about the here and now. As for my professional dreams, I certainly didn't have them. I had trouble deciding what to do in life when it came to the decision to go to university and what to study. But to be honest, looking at my children now, I have four, and I think each of them has the same problem. It was the same for me back then, and it hasn't changed much because it's a difficult decision when you're 19. I didn't know exactly what I wanted to become, and besides, in life, it changes many times.

Very pragmatic. I come from a very small town, Kościerzyna, and when I didn't know what to study, the first thought was that I seemed to have more competencies in technical subjects, like mathematics and physics, so it had to be closer to a polytechnic. My mother told me that in a town like Kościerzyna, there was and will be construction, so civil engineering seemed the safest to find a job always. So I went into civil engineering. Despite appearances, after the first year, I knew I probably wouldn't work in that profession. The choice was very pragmatic but also based on lack of knowledge. On the other hand, looking at many people I meet, few work in their chosen profession. School isn't just a place where we have to declare ourselves for life. Looking at me as a civil engineer who is de facto involved in fashion, art, or sales organization, it's far from what I learned at lectures at the polytechnic. But I think for many it's like that. Look at Marcin himself: he studied electronics and telecommunications, worked for a few years in banking, IT systems management worldwide, and ended up in the family business. True, studies don't determine our future but certainly shape us. I think your studies might have helped you when planning new LPP buildings, you probably had more knowledge than others. It's not so much the substantive knowledge that helps; when it comes to construction investments, it does help because you remember something. But studies are important for another reason: not for the substantive knowledge we learn, but for how much we learn to learn, to get to know new things, how open we are, how we handle problems, how we prepare and formulate our thoughts precisely in some form of presentation, and that's largely what studies are for. Technical professions teach us to calculate, predict, other professions, like artists, designers, learn something else, but I think studies aren't necessarily the most important thing for delivering substantive knowledge; they teach us to learn, to specify our thoughts, to choose what to reject or accept, and that's probably more important because skills are developed throughout life, while with substantive knowledge, we forget certain things and have to refresh them, and we can always catch up with Google, Wikipedia, etc., where we can find information in seconds. So I'm convinced that studies teach something completely different than what's written in the title, like civil engineer or mathematician. Here, key is critical analysis and the ability to search for information.

Those were different times. Consider that studying at the beginning of the eighties was a bit different, even in terms of perspectives. The prospects for what you could do later weren't as broad as for young people today. So it ended with thinking that I would land in some construction company in Kościerzyna, as an engineer, and that didn't seem like a big success. Because I didn't want to join the party, I didn't have such connections. In those times, if someone wanted to achieve something, they had to join. But on the other hand, it survived 1989, everything was thrown off, and it turned out that it could be done completely differently. That was the chance I probably got and I used it.

What I think is that during my second year of studies, I realized that I was only studying to not feel worse than others, to obtain education, to write that I have higher education, that I'm an engineer or master engineer, to not feel mentally or morally worse than others. And it was probably good that I did it because I learned something else in the process, as we said, a different approach to solving problems. But I knew I wouldn't work as a civil engineer from the second year of studies because I felt that I could earn much more having my own small business. During the summer vacation after the second year, I opened a vegetable stand. Listen, I did various things. Before All Saints' Day and during the vacation, I had this vegetable stand because my mother had one too. I saw that it could be a nice business, that you could live better from it, not necessarily looking at having very little money. Young people must realize that in the eighties in Poland, people earned about 20 dollars a month, so when someone went abroad, they just called it window shopping. We wanted to go, walk around, look, dream, and that was all we could afford. But if someone had a private business, which couldn't have too many, that person probably could earn not 20, maybe 200 or 500 dollars a month, depending on how well the business was run, allowing for a much better life. So after the second year, I realized that I wouldn't work as a civil engineer but would have some private business, it could be a vegetable stand, a flower shop, or anything else, but it would be something different.

Listen, it was even more shocking because in the meantime, I studied in Germany in 1985-87. I brought back some money, which was a lot for those times, about 20,000 marks, and on the market in Kościerzyna, I bought a townhouse for 3,500 German marks. It's amazing that in this townhouse, there is a Reserved store now, so history has come full circle. But then I went to the town hall in Kościerzyna and said, 'Ladies and gentlemen, I would like to open here a small shop of about 20 square meters, because the rest was rented by state offices from the owner, and you couldn't terminate those state shops. But there was such a local in this whole building, 20 meters, I would like to open a shop.' 'What would you like to sell?' Because at those times, flower trade was very profitable. 'I would like to open a flower shop.' 'But we already have one flower shop on the market, we need another one.' 'So what could I open?' 'A clothing store, but only a small one, 20 meters.' So it was a bit of a coincidence. And the second coincidence is that later I went to Turkey, and in Turkey, during vacation, I saw that it was possible, or others were doing it too. Many people in those times did it, buying Turkish sweaters or other Turkish clothing and reselling them. I realized that either I had a better eye or I was better at it. When I bought about 10 Turkish sweaters, I sold them in five minutes. I thought, I'll go again quickly next week during vacation, and that's how it started quite seriously. Later, I brought sweaters by car, then in large quantities, and in the next season, I passed that small shop to one of my friends, and I started with a partner to continue this international trade, so to speak.

I met him even earlier, in 1985, during studies in Germany, and he returned a bit earlier than me. I came back a bit later, staying longer. When he returned to Poland, we somehow contacted each other again and started thinking that we would travel together. At those times, a private trip included the possibility of trading to cover the trip's cost. So we bought goods somewhere, in Turkey or India, which after selling in Poland brought such profits that the trip cost was covered. On such trips, we later realized that it could be a business, not just covering the trip cost but providing nice income.

Well, at the very beginning in 1989-90, we imported them as ready-made garments. We went to suppliers, pointed out what we wanted. But in the early nineties, more and more of these goods appeared smuggled, and we felt that we had to differentiate, to have something different from your competitor because if you have the same, he will lower the price, and you'll compete on price. So we started, and at that time, one element was our first presence in China. I first flew to China in 1991, and the Chinese didn't have such ready-made goods; they were like, place an order, tell us what you want, what color, and so on. So I started with these first designs, Beata Pieska also participated in the first year in designing the first sweatshirts and jackets, various things. These were the first steps in designing, because to place an order, you had to wait, open a letter of credit, and then in three months, they delivered the patterns you invented. The advantage was that you got what you had invented or seen, and it was different, and nobody had the same on the market. So we started producing under our own brand. We sold them to various wholesalers in Poland; at that time, there were many clothing wholesalers, and they distributed to various small shops. Some bought and sold at markets, fairs. That's how trade looked in the early nineties; there weren't many shops yet, especially specialized ones like Reserved. We created everything in 1998. In the meantime, we supplied prepared goods to hypermarkets; we were one of the larger suppliers. We were learning all these things step by step. New sewing in those times, I spent a lot of time in China myself, practically 200 to 250 days a year for a few years, sitting in factories at the end of the production line, checking the quality of things, learning from old technologists. As a civil engineer, I had no idea about clothing or how to make it, but your technical sense helped, though in a different field. But you need some imagination to understand how it's sewn. I think that's also from the polytechnic, at least for me, with a great willingness to learn, plus a different approach to solving problems. So when I had a problem, like how to make a good shirt, I knew I had to buy a shirt from the best manufacturers I knew in Poland at that time, like Wólczanka. I tried to take apart five Wólczanka shirts into tiny details, to see what fabric, what collar, how thick, whether one or two layers, where the cut is curved, and so on. Listen, colleagues, I went to China and said, 'How do you do this? Show me. I would like very similar, please, with the same quality. The difference is that I choose the materials, the pattern, color, etc., but for the technology, I wanted it done as well as possible.'

In the beginning, it was a passion; I was just collecting a few such things from the years, like you said, '95 or something. I see a guy walking and think, 'Is this still from a year ago?' Impossible. It might be a really good product if it lasted so many years. In the meantime, people started expecting cheaper things and changing them more often, a social expectation to which we simply adapted. But on the other hand, I see a growing trend towards buying less but better quality. Look at what's happening with the quality of Reserved products but in all industries, I see this trend going in the opposite direction: things are better quality, but unfortunately, they are also more expensive. Something for something.

Listen, you know, I look at it this way. As I see this history, we had to change constantly because the company grew. The saying at LPP is that the only constant thing is change. We all repeat it. But why? Because I had to change with the company; my scope of duties changed. As I told you, at the beginning, I traveled somewhere, sat in the factory, negotiated as a buyer with suppliers, but later, when the supplier or the company contracted with them for shirts, sweaters, or something, I just went to the factory, sat there like an inspector, checking if the factory was good enough, and so on. That's why I spent so many days in China. But later, with growth, I had to change my areas of interest or responsibility, and it changed in a circle. That's why for many people who have worked at the company longer, their scope of duties also changes. Like, for example, the older employees who joined the company in 1991, they were two people responsible for receiving goods. Sales were invisible. But if you think that in the warehouses in Pruszcz, there are about 1,500 people, conveyor belts moving hundreds of millions of pieces a year, I think 450 million this year, then it had to change too. It's not just that I changed my areas, but many people working at LPP also changed their duties. Think of many such people, like Michał Laskowski, who started working as a sales assistant to earn money for studies, and today he manages all Sinsay sales. But along the way, if you ask what Michał did, he did many things: regional director, presenter, really in many places. So I also had to be in many places. At first, I was a clerk and quality inspector, later responsible for larger areas, but probably the most important thing is that we try to delegate duties, and we have many people who willingly accept and perform them well. That's the strength of the company, I think. Even if I had 24 hours a day, I couldn't handle it all. For me, what's most important now? I've been a bit involved in the jubilee recently. Of course, the boss's duties are always there, but it's sometimes a pleasant duty because where things are going well and under control, we actually need to leave and go where there are new areas or problems. And right now, it's clear that e-commerce is a new and strong area. If you think that today it has a share of 25% or more, it's a very important area. We see it as a future area, and as the head of this company, I want to be aware of what's happening there. I want to know because the colleagues are doing very well: Michał at Sinsay, Radek Perka, Krystian Krauze in the shop, they all do very well. Sometimes I support them in certain decisions or encourage even more intensive development in this direction, which is where it's going. And I want to explore this path with them.

It's really joy, and on the other hand, I think it's a nice thing. I didn't discover this; there were consultants in the nineties who came from the United States as part of aid to developing countries. And one day, I saw one of these consultants with a watch and said, 'You have a beautiful watch,' and so on, because then having a Swiss watch was something. He said, 'Listen, this isn't just a watch; it's a gift from my boss for 10 years,' and so on. Then I thought, damn, maybe I should do something for those who did something for me. In 2003, I think, after ten years, or maybe then for the first time, we gave watches. I'm proud of that because that photo shows new employees, alongside photos where they now have 25 years, and the same people are still working. I'm proud of that in a way, although it costs the company a lot. There were years when we spent half a million zlotys on watches because about 120 to 130 people meet every year. But I think it's worth it because these people have been with us for 10 years, put in a lot of energy, heart, thoughts, and I assume also a lot of their personal time, not just professional. It's a nice moment to say, 'Hey, listen, thank you for these 10 years.' It's a kind of symbol. I hand them this watch with thanks, and we have a nice evening. Everyone comes, we rent a nice hotel, they have fun, and in the evening, I leave so they can enjoy themselves more.

Listen, what I would like is for us to continuously maintain this growth phase. And for now, it seems to be going well. Note that this year we estimate revenues will be 14 billion, and next year significantly more, because this wave of growth offers development opportunities for many people. This wave causes that all those who are assistants today will be buyers tomorrow, product managers, and perhaps directors in a moment, that the company's growth creates something where people working less can also develop professionally. I think that's what I wish for most, for this to last as long as possible. For the next few years, it seems we have so many challenges and growth opportunities that we're discovering together, that it seems the company will develop even more intensively than in the last few years. So that's my dream, for this to last indefinitely, but looking at the next few years, it seems that will be satisfied, so I think it's good. The challenges facing the company in the coming years are these growth challenges on the e-commerce side. We see very large development, and on one hand, we must meet customer expectations who are changing their shopping place from physical or mixing physical and online; it's not clear where, but we must constantly follow and run after it. That's certainly a big challenge. And on the other hand, climate change is a very big challenge: monitoring all these factories, ensuring the carbon footprint is as small as possible. It's completely new for you; as a developing country, Poland would have thought long about catching up with Europe, but today we must think about catching up in terms of social responsibility standards, for the environment, for what happens around us. And I think it's happening; I have no complexes or shame in this regard because, for example, one of our biggest competitors, a Swedish one, still sends its promotional packages in plastic, while we've been doing it in cardboard for two years. That means we can do it more efficiently, quickly, and effectively, caring for the environment. We can be pioneers, and I have the impression that we can implement these projects quickly.

I think everyone must have a moment to disconnect from work, not just to think about something else, but it actually develops you. If someone worked only 16 hours focused on work, I think it would also be bad. I wouldn't want TVP to have a place because I feel that whoever doesn't develop, doesn't have other interests or something that lets the mind rest from thinking about sales growth or something else. I personally like classical music, travel, and also hard rock. As a young man, I listened to Czerwone Gitary, Guns N' Roses, Aerosmith, very hard stuff. Later, I came to jazz, and for over ten years, I've been listening to classical music. It's Beethoven, Bach, more serious pieces, but also. On the other hand, I try to take care of physical culture. In winter, I always go skiing at least once, sometimes during the Christmas break. In summer, when it's cycling, it's nice. I like cycling. I told you that unfortunately this year it was bad with cycling because my wife bought one and it turned out someone broke it. But I don't run, even now 40 minutes, so it's some explanation that I maintain physical condition. It's about balancing between body and head so that the body serves the head for some time. I also like photography. I like taking pictures; the best time is when traveling. Sometimes I get back into photography, sometimes leave it for half a year or a year, but when I go on vacation, I like to take two cameras and walk through city alleys, photographing people, how they behave, what they do. It's a kind of relaxation for me because then I don't think at all about whether we're selling more or less, what next business to develop, but just look at beautiful compositions, and it detaches thoughts from the business.

I like Sopot for its destroyed architecture; it's very original and intriguing. Sopot had the luck that Gdańsk, next to Warsaw, was one of the more destroyed places. If you go on YouTube or anywhere and see Gdańsk after World War II, most of these townhouses were completely destroyed. You can see by looking at individual ones that survived because they show details, reliefs, various external forms, and it's clear that after the war, they didn't want to rebuild carefully; they just rebuilt quickly. After the war, it looks terrible. But Sopot was practically not destroyed at all, maybe 10% destroyed Sopot, and it looks nice when you walk through some alleys and see how it functioned in Gdańsk. There's the Old Town, which is nicer in a way, starting to echo more, not as destroyed. In the old part of Wrzeszcz, there are a few townhouses that are still nice and function. There's also beautiful nature, but more from houses or townhouses functioning near Jaśkowa Dolina, so not many. But I prefer the city more than pure nature in terms of going out; I always like when I travel to places where people live, or in China, I stayed for a weekend, I liked going to a vegetable market or somewhere where people trade, shop on Saturday or Sunday; it's interesting because you observe normal people, how they behave, what they do. And when you go to countries that are not as organized, like Georgia, I was at vegetable markets; it's beautiful, and sometimes we talk about healthy food, ecological food. In Georgia, I have the impression that there's only healthy food, ecological food. Try their tomatoes and cucumbers; the smell is completely different from what we have here. I understand that. I like southern cultures: Italy, Spain, and their morning coffee, how they nicely set the tone for the start of the day, and I also try to incorporate that into my private life and be inspired by it.

Those are two different things you're asking: those who have their own business and those who manage teams. For those who have or plan their own business, they must be prepared that they will work significantly longer at the beginning than they imagined, and it will cost them significantly more in time, energy, and thoughts than they think. Because as I tell you, today you can't afford to rest your mind and say you won't deal with this or that. Believe me, at the beginning of businesses, it was 24 hours a day just to survive, so others wouldn't eat you up, because you have to carve out your piece. So for those who want to start their own business, be prepared for a tougher beginning than they thought. Not to discourage, because many new businesses are constantly being created, many are finding a path and developing, but you need to be prepared for great sacrifice and to give your whole self. Not motivation, you have to give your all, so to speak, and it hurts. As I say, at the beginning, spending 250 days a year there, when I returned, I spent time in such places, like villages, and looked at European food, McDonald's, to rejoice having a hamburger, sacrifice. But back to the topic: sacrifice and commitment are one thing. For managing a team, I think it's important to listen to people and give people the opportunity to develop within your team. Because each of us, regardless of where we are, at what position, is some kind of leader, whether it's the head of the entire company, a brand, a department, or a 6-person team. We are all leaders, and it's important that this leader gives the opportunity and chance for development to his partners with whom he creates this small enterprise, regardless of what it is: a product team or any other team. That's one of the most important things: to give others the opportunity for self-realization, because only then can you create great things. I believe that by giving the opportunity for self-realization to many people who work directly with me, I consider it the source of the company's strength in these relationships. We must give these people a chance as leaders or bosses, and encourage their development. Sometimes, people don't believe in themselves, and you have to say, 'Don't be afraid, you can do it. I believe in you.' I've been working at the company for 4 years; if someone had told me at the beginning of my journey that I would be doing projects like I am now, I wouldn't have believed it, but I'm doing it, including this interview with the president. So listen, believe in yourselves. It's really worth it.

Listen, I believe there will be more and more of these 10-year anniversaries. The tradition will continue. Thank you for that. This company exists because of you; I didn't develop it alone. It's all those who led it forward with me. Thank you.

Goodbye.