Most people confuse management and leadership. If you can inspire 120,000 people with a vision, you can accomplish a whole lot more than if you're going through a checklist every day.
Since its inaugural flight a century ago, United Airlines has defined commercial air travel with a history of firsts, spanning everything from the modern airliner and flight attendants to computerized flight planning. Today, United connects more people to more destinations than any carrier on the planet. But it isn't just about growth. United is focused on improving the travel experience for all passengers. Behind this vision, CEO Scott Kirby has spent his career thinking differently about what it means to run and lead an airline. When the industry was impacted by Covid, United invested for growth and emerged stronger. Even as corporate boards began confronting deglobalization, Kirby leaned into international expansion. And now, as many leaders view AI as a way to cut headcount, Kirby sees technology as a way to improve human interactions, not replace them. As Morgan Stanley's Lead North American Airlines analyst, I wanted to learn more about how Kirby makes decisions in an industry that faces constant uncertainty. So, I traveled to United's headquarters in Chicago, where I sat down with Kirby on the day United turned 100 and got a close look at Kirby's approach to leadership, and his custom Sambas.
Thank you, Scott, for having me here today on the actual 100th anniversary of United.
Congratulations. Yeah. Today's the day 100 years. Happy birthday.
Thank you. And how do you like the shoes? Hundred-year anniversary Sambas.
You graduated from the US Air Force Academy. Did you originally aspire to fly professionally? And what prompted you to go a different direction?
I went to the Air Force Academy, intending to be a pilot and then an astronaut. And while there, you get to fly. And I was out in an F4 dogfighting, aerial, broke the sound barrier. And at the end of it, the pilot told me to close my eyes and fly straight and level by feel. And I was at a 30 degree left bank and he said, 'Use the instruments.' And I did, and I felt like I was going to fly out of the seat to the right. And he laughed at me and said, 'You're never going to be a fighter pilot, you're going to be a cargo pilot.' And at that moment I decided, I'm sure you're right about the first one, but you are dead wrong about the second one. So I didn't go to pilot training.
You may not be a fighter pilot, but you operate in an environment of near-constant volatility. So, how do you handle the daily realities of this environment we are in right now?
You're trying to figure out on the fly what's going to happen, trying to look over the horizon, trying to read extensively. I've done that my whole life. I read three hours a day on average. But I'm genuinely curious. And when you do that, you can connect dots I think that other people can't connect and don't see. This has happened, you know, a lot of times in my career to try to see things and how to take advantage of stuff when I have a view that is different than the consensus view.
How do you carve out the space and time to think long-term with everything going on?
I'm really good at time management and I don't waste time in my personal life, professional life. I'm not on social media. What a time suck. I don't really watch TV. Another time suck. But in business, less than four hours of meetings a day on my calendar is my rule. It gives you time to think, gives you time to read. It gives me time to just call people and ask questions. But also I have a great team. I feel like if I am trying to micromanage, I've done something wrong.
You're known as a highly data-driven leader. So, as data has become more pervasive, has your approach to leadership changed as well?
I don't think it's changed so much because of data. In fact, I probably use data less explicitly the further I go in my career. I could tell you pretty close what it's been for the last 30 days. I know about the operation. I know what we've done. I know what each of the other airlines have done, but I really use that more to paint the palette of thinking about other, bigger decisions. And I draw a big distinction between management and leadership. Management is about compliance. It's about running the checklist. How many people showed up for work on time. But leadership is different. It's about inspiration and vision. And compliance is really important. You need people to do that. But leadership is more rare. The further you move up anywhere in your career, the more your job indexes from management functions to leadership functions.
Is that your leadership vision? Did you have a mentor? How did you kind of frame that?
I've learned a lot more from watching people make mistakes, and I've learned a lot more of the positive examples from reading. Winston Churchill's top of my list of heroes, like what would Winston Churchill do in a situation like this. Abraham Lincoln is another one. But I also learn from myself too, like mistakes that I've made. Like when you make a mistake, to thine own self be true. What a great line. When you screw something up, I don't mind making a mistake. I hate making a mistake twice.
What are the feedback systems that you have to maybe see some of the things that you're not seeing?
I have spent a lot of time out talking with people. I have the easiest job of anyone at United because I have only really one responsibility: create a company that our employees are proud of. And so I look for that pride, and I spend a lot of time out in the operation. Every week I'm out, either virtually or in person, talking to groups of new captains and talking to groups of new pursers at United. And you can tell if people feel proud of the company. People want to be on a winning team and winning is contagious.
Can you give us an example of an instance where the data pointed one way, but your gut or instinct kind of said do something different?
Covid. Oh, sure. When Covid started, the data to me pointed to like, this is a global pandemic. And it was hard for me to understand why no one else knew it. We were just a couple of weeks ahead of the globe. But we went off and raised $2 billion at 3% interest two days before the NBA walked off the court and it would have been impossible. And we shrunk more than everyone else quickly. But then during Covid, the data got wrong. All the experts believed that air travel demand would never recover. And all the surveys, if you did surveys, people said they were never going to fly again. And so, literally every global long-haul airline in the world except United, permanently retired part of their global long-haul widebody fleet and shrunk. And we looked at that and said, 'I just think that's the wrong decision.' Instead, we did the biggest aircraft orders in history during Covid.
If you were not the CEO, what job would you like to have and why would you be good at it?
