Prysmian Capital Markets Day 2025

The opportunities are unprecedented. The cleaner, safer, interconnected and smarter world is within reach, but this needs a leader beneath your feet, behind your walls, across the seas, setting the standard, breaking records, making this new world happen faster, more reliable and affordable, more efficient, responsible, and ambitious about what we can achieve together. Powered by 33,000 people who know exactly what delivery and expectation means, we are always right beside you. This unique know-how is Prismian.

Dear guests, welcome to Prismian's Capital Markets Day and allow us to introduce on stage our CEO Massimo Battaini.

From when the sun rises, we are the one-stop shop with our synergistic portfolio. We are building the future from high voltage transmission solutions to the power grid electrification and digital solutions. With undisputed technological leadership such as complete transmission solutions boosting operating efficiency and cost saving, unleashing new service standards and boosting connectivity in the digital world, we are maximizing innovation and sustainability to drive growth. And we've been investing to meet demand, increasing our capacity and making the largest acquisition in our history so we can bring the new products and solutions with the highest quality, efficiency, and lowest environmental impact that is helping to connect and decarbonize our planet until long after the sun sets.

At Prismian, we are connecting our planet. We are driving the progress of new forms of energy, meeting growing demand with the best solutions in a rapidly evolving world. We are guaranteeing energy security, helping to reduce the cost of the energy transition while protecting future generations. These are the projects at the forefront of technology innovation and human achievement that are making our planet safer and our society more prosperous and greener. We are the undisputed leaders with a portfolio spanning 60 major projects in 25 countries. Our extensive reach and proven track record mean that no challenge is too great. From the largest advanced marine vessel fleet on the planet to the most sophisticated tools and the deepest expertise in the industry, our innovation is unrivaled. We are always available, monitoring 24/7 to ensure that these investments are in safe hands and that no challenge is too great. From land to sea, Prismian is pushing the boundaries of what can be achieved. From the longest ever interconnector world record cable installation to the highest voltage and most efficient transmission systems, and we're not going to stop. And at the same time, we are thinking about the impact we have on our planet to keep what we love safe. Because these projects are our shared legacy, our investment in tomorrow, and we're accelerating because tomorrow is coming today.

A passion born of the spirit of racing, carried in the hearts of enthusiasts everywhere, that defies time, age, language, and culture, that unites young and old, individuals and team, employees and owners in a lifelong sense of belonging. How do you capture the constant desire to push boundaries, master new technologies, adapt and evolve, to blend tradition and innovation yet still stay true to your DNA? How do you capture the essence of what must be lived to be understood? For this is the essence of what it means to be Ferrari: to epitomize the power of lifelong passion, to do what others only dare to dream, to audaciously redefine the limits of possible.

Thanks for having me here. Nice being with all of you. I was given a few questions, actually I had a million of questions that everybody wanted to ask you, and I chose some official ones and then some personal ones. That's the better ones, the best ones. Okay, you want me to start on the best one? No, let me start on the official one. So what does it mean innovation in Ferrari? What makes Ferrari unique in terms of innovation? I think that innovation is the only thing that each company in this world has to pursue to manage with the uncertainty of the future. I have the luck to work in a company that makes innovation at the center of what we do. I've been working more or less 30 years in my life on innovation, and this morning I was chatting with our IR responsible. Many people have many different definitions. For me, the definition of innovation is very simple: innovation is the way to go from know-how to money. That's it. I mean, you can find any definition in business review, strategy, no. That's it for us. Innovation is important. We do this kind of innovation: innovation of product, innovation of process, innovation in management, innovation of system. So without innovation, I think Ferrari, Prismian, many many other companies cannot have a sustainable future.

Definitely. I mean, as I said, I have been before I was working at a company making chips, so fiber to the home, you were a client. There is only one thing really that can keep alive a company: this innovation. And I have to say that I made a phone call before I going to take some share in Italy by anyway. It's not as simple, especially for you. I mean, we are in a cable business or B2B business, but you sell cars to private customers. It's not simple, I believe, to conjugate or to integrate innovation with luxury, because you consider your brand a luxury brand. So I think your engineers come into a great clash every time when they invent something that makes innovation relevant. By the end of the day, you have to sell a product that looks real, some heritage and those things.

Well, first of all, I would like to say that the challenge we have, and I don't want to make it easier, is the challenge that any market leader has. A leader, a company is a leader if and only if he's able to dare when the people are not daring anymore. I don't think they deserve to be called a leader. I believe it. So what I want to say is that it was 1947 when our founder, after let's say 61 years after Benz got out with the tricycle, more or less, and this started to make what a combustion engine. Why? Because that was the only propulsion that was available. The roads were not even existing. Okay, now we go fast forward, we go 2015, 2010, the people start to talk about electric cars and people are scared. But why are people scared? Because each one of us is scared about three things: whatever is diverse, whatever is new, and whatever is about the future. So change, it's change. I mean, maybe it's a matter of you know preservation, but I think the reality is that today we are talking about electrons, we are talking about digital solution. 20 years ago when I was, you remember the bubble 2001, the bubble of, we do remember it, okay? Yes, I was making chips and we were making a lot of things, and the people tell this market is faded. Not at all true. So what I want to say is that yes, electric car is posing some challenge, but this is nothing with the challenge that someone else had 78 years ago when there were no roads and when he was doing something that other people were already doing. So we want to be a leader, okay? Yes, then we have two days, we may do some mistake, and so what? We will recover. I mean, the problem is not to do a mistake, to make a mistake, to say correctly in English, the problem is to recover. So we are making something, a car that will be unveiled in Q4 this year that will be unique, something unique because we will not just put, let me say, four wheels with a battery and an engine like other people do for cost reason on the mass market. We are doing something that is exciting, that is making the experience unique when you drive it. So there will be still the sound, there will be something, I don't let me say, there will be some, let's say, when you enter a Ferrari, you interact with Ferrari with eyes, with ears, and with the full body. So you have to wait a little bit. So this is luxury, you have to wait.

I was in F50, end of '90s. I was here living here on the West Coast, I was in San Francisco. I had some friends, one of them got an F50. F50 is a car, 12 cylinder, done in 1995. And yes, it was a pretty experience, unique experience. I mean, this was you know, it was just before the dot-com bubble. Love it. Yeah, I remember now we were in Silicon Valley when we heard on the radio the radio that was there the situation. So it was a unique experience because you don't, when you are in Ferrari, you don't go from one place to another. It's a full body experience. Yeah, I mean, I go usually on track every month on ice or regular roads, winding roads. But it's you, there was a sentence here: you can understand only if you live the passion. It's difficult to describe, also because not big mother tongue, I may miss a lot of adjectives, but it's unique. So you have to try.

We have different kind of clients. Let's say there are some people that buy the cars because they want to try it. Some people that buy our car because they want to show. Okay, we have the luxury to have, let me say, a lot of our clients are buying the car because they want to live it, not because they want to show. Other brands they go more in this direction, but our brand is more, I would say, culturally relevant. Okay, having said that, which are the dimensions that we exploit to develop a Ferrari? One: performance. Two: design. Three: driving thrills. Four: sustainability. Sustainability is fundamental. And when you talk about driving thrills, there is the linear acceleration, there is the lateral acceleration, there is the braking, there is the sound, there is the gearbox, there are many dimensions, and we are considering all of these. And the last one is sustainability. I remember when I got in the company, people were, there were only few people believing in it. Now if you come in Ferrari, everyone can tell you what is the carbon footprint of each material we buy. So 1 kilo of aluminum, 10 kilo of CO2. 1 kilo of steel, 1 kilo of CO2. We have all these things. The people know that. We changed mindset. We this year '25 we cut by a factor three the CO2 emission scope one, scope two. We cut a factor three versus four years ago. And you know what is the capex we put on the table? Only the capex for solar panel that is in the range of 10 million euro. Only the ideas of our people. We throw away, we save 5% of the aluminum because we throw away less and we buy less. Capex zero. Sustainability becomes a sustainable goal but also something that makes the company more efficient, more cost effective. If you come in our company, you find solar panel, fine, you find fuel cell, hydrogen ready, you find that the latest generation, let's say, building that has been that got the LEED certification, is the only industrial plant in the world with a LEED certification that usually is given to building, you know, not for industrial use. So we believe in it, we make it, and I'm sure we'll get there.

I will come to see. Just tell me. I like a lot those boats with a long cable. Grazia.

Wow, thank you, Massimo. It's a pleasure to join you on stage. And what a nice surprise having Mr. Vigna here. Loved his vignettes. My favorite one: how to make money. That's what I tell my team because they're dreaming always. So again, hey, thank you all for being here. And it's my pleasure to spend some time here talking about innovation and a little bit about the future. So as I reflect on our company's innovation journey, it absolutely exemplifies what Massimo said: the strength and unmatched global presence, our talent, and finally technological leadership leading to innovation and sustainability to being strong business growth drivers. Now, the best evidence for this is seen in the growth of our new product and solutions vitality. We define this as a portion of our revenues coming from the previous three-year time frame. We started the journey in 2007 with a laser focus on our product performance and cost control, which by the way remains to date in our DNA because the past is important. Now from there, we have grown to an industry-leading 24% with a major acceleration coming from the last three years. Now how exactly did we achieve this growth? We achieved this growth by starting with a foundation of seven R&D centers with a very Eurocentric footprint. Since then, we have built a global footprint of 27 R&D centers worldwide, close to our factories and most importantly close to all our customers. We started with 400 inspired professionals with expertise in energy cables and grew threefold. Today our global R&D team has more than 1,100 professionals, engineers, scientists, world-class experts in all four business units. And the result, we're really pleased with it. We were able to get 4 billion euros of revenues in 2024 from innovations that did not exist 3 years ago. Please think about that. What is our aspiration? We're not done in Prismian, you're never done. We want to be at 30% by 2028. Now when we do that, we're going to be world class, will be among the top innovative companies, 5% across all industry verticals. And you may ask how are we exactly going to do that? For me, it all starts with our customers. We are closer to our customers, or at least we aim to be closer to our customers than any competition. We take every opportunity to see our products in use across their entire life cycle, and that gives us precious ideas to come up with solutions to do two things: one, make our customers' lives easier, and two, expand the application spaces we play in. And that's the role of a market leader. Now this relentless external focus has really helped us set this trajectory to go from being a cable manufacturer to a solution provider. And we're fortunate that we also get to play a meaningful role in the evolution of electrical and digital infrastructures of our communities. Now the interesting part, I want to take you all on an R&D tour in a Ferrari, a sneak preview behind the scenes on exactly what is fueling this desire to be a solution provider and our pipeline of future solutions. The tour is going to have these four stops. Let's start with the first one: our core technologies. Our core technologies are the building blocks of our business. When we get these right, we set the company up for long-term commercial success. And here I'm excited to share that we're investing in groundbreaking technology platforms in not one but all four business units: the world's smallest optical fiber for the next generation telecom networks, to a very innovative hollow core fiber technology that we announced last week, a partnership with Relativity Networks which is going to help with the deployment of AI data centers in a much quicker way. The most firest stringent solutions to EPAT, Massimo mentioned that EPAT is the industry's first low impact cabling solution, and our customers have come to love it in the last three years, and we appreciate that. Next up is a personal favorite, an exciting one: we're going to talk about systems. Systems for our transmission business unit where we expect the fastest growth over the next four years. These systems are what allow us to provide turnkey projects and services to our customers. Here, as Massimo said, we're the undisputed technological leader in high voltage and submarine cable systems. We are the only player who has two extra high voltage DC technologies, including our proprietary P-Laser technology. These technologies can push over 2 GW of power, that is enough power for 1.5 million homes. And by the way, these technologies are very relevant to us moneywise as well because they account for 2/3 of the 20 billion euro backlog that Massimo mentioned. Going on to the next one, it's even interesting: our ultra high depth. We are the only ones in the industry who have a synthetic armor technology and the vessels that can help us install cabling systems up to 3,000 meters. We just shattered the world record last year with a successful sea trial of the Tyrrhenian Link at 2,150 meters. Next up, you know, we're fortunate to have a very advanced fleet of our vessels, and these help us actually extend the energy transition across many geographies. We're not done yet. Last month, if you've noticed, we also announced our latest innovation in this area. We are the only player now in the industry to have a full suite of medium voltage inter-array and export high voltage cables with dynamic conditions for the acceleration of floating wind. This innovation will expand the space of offshore wind into deeper seas in Europe, especially like the Mediterranean Sea as well as the North Seas. So again, the engineer in me loves to talk about these innovations, but I think it's better if we actually hear from a customer who's equally excited, if not more than me. So let's hear from Amprion.

The development of our grid is an important part of the German energy transition. Besides the common goal of a carbon neutral future, it is part of the backbone of the social and economical welfare of Europe. Amprion itself is becoming more sustainable as a company. We set ourselves clear objectives and methods and track their implementation. We both, Amprion and Prismian, are accelerating in the same direction, delivering the energy transition in Germany and Europe. Prismian is known for leadership in engineering expertise and a relationship which is based on exchange and finding solutions. Prismian is the sole player in the market who's able to offer two different technologies for 525 kV HVDC cables. For our project A-Nord, we chose the P-Laser technology due to a combination of reasons. The most important one is a higher performance in terms of the operation at high temperatures. The application of P-Laser technology also for submarine cable systems could help to overcome challenges we see in the offshore business. We are not just talking about technological aspects, we also talking about the execution of these whole systems. We do all possible together. Communication and collaboration are the key factors of the success. We have a high level of trust between our teams and the management because future is our mission, and I'm proud to be part of it.

I love Claus's passion about the future and being part of the future together. Now the next stop in our tour is going to be sensing. We live in a digital age where our customers expect not only greener products and solutions but also smarter ones. And in this area, we actually offer a complete suite of advanced electronic and optical sensing solutions through our EOS unit. Now these solutions actually help our customers in many ways: operational excellence, preventive maintenance, intrusion detection that's getting a lot of airtime now in Europe like Massimo said, and finally energy management which is becoming very important even here. Shortly, we're going to be announcing a breakthrough. For the first time, our team has come up with a solution, an integrated monitoring platform with distributed acoustic and temperature sensing which can monitor lengths over 1,000 kilometers. And when this is available in the marketplace, it's not only going to be a game changer for us but for the whole industry. The final step: services. As Massimo gave a heads up, the combination of Encore and Channel now has really boosted for us this fourth area of services suite. We are able to now bundle cables, accessories, connectivity, and monitoring systems to make our customers give a complete solution. We're also able to address another very important growing need: labor shortage. With pre-terminated cables, connectorized solutions both in the energy as well as the digital space. Now for those of you who will join us at McKinney tomorrow, you're in for some nice surprises. You're going to see some brilliant examples of advanced packaging solutions that not only cut the carbon footprint but also reduce the labor intensity on a job site. Now these services are extremely vital for large-scale construction sites such as the data centers boom as well as the reshoring of manufacturing that's happening in North America. Again, here I'd like for all of us to hear from a customer, a very important customer, Wesco, on how we are partnering together to win in this space.

Wesco serves seven key end markets: utility, construction, network infrastructure and broadband, security, industrial OEM, and data centers. Across each of these markets, there are secular trends driving growth including AI-driven data centers, increased power generation, electrification, grid hardening, need for 24/7 security, and IoT automation. You know, of particular significance is the growth we're experiencing with our large hyperscale data center customers. Last quarter, our Wesco data center solutions business grew 70% year-over-year. You know, as companies, we share similar outlook on the growth opportunity across multiple end markets, supported by a product innovation, sustainability focus, and Wesco's ability to provide supply chain solutions to our joint customers. You know, during my 11 years at Wesco, I've seen Prismian's willingness to invest where the market is, and your most recent acquisition of Encore for $4.2 billion, largest in your company's history, is a testament of your commitment to the North American market. It's a combination of Prismian's broad product portfolio and Wesco's ability to offer highly technical and complex services. You know, for our hyperscale customers, speed and accuracy are key, with schedules that are constantly changing. Wesco and Prismian have partnered together to meet the needs of these highly demanding customers through supply chain agility. Together, we're also investing in systems and solutions, leveraging generative AI to better understand customer demand patterns and working together to deliver the product at the right time and at the right place.

So there you heard from two of our important customers. By the way, Claus will be joining us tomorrow at McKinney if some of you would like to get a little bit more flavor from him in person. Again, our customers appreciate several things here: communication, collaboration, speed, and accuracy of our services and solutions. We're fortunate they trust us. Our journey of innovation and sustainability, and talking about sustainability, to share a little bit more about our sustainability efforts, it's my pleasure to invite my dear colleague Christina Beulko on stage.

Thank you, thank you very much, Serini. And good day to everyone. It's very exciting to return after one year and a half to share remarkable milestones, breaking news, and to set new ambitious targets also in sustainability for both short and long term. I need to steal you the point: sustainability is an important driver of our innovation strategy, but most of all it's the heartbeat of everything we do. And innovation fuels our sustainability goals, and both are the twin engines accelerating our growth since they are the source of competitive advantage allowing us to keep our leadership in the space. The concept of sustainability keeps evolving and goes far beyond the carbon footprint. Our stakeholders, customers, investors, communities, they ask us, they help us to think bigger, to anticipate future needs, and to unlock growth opportunities which combine performance with security, resilience with nature protection. And as leader in our space, we believe that our responsibility goes beyond our direct business perimeter and is to leave a positive impact, a long-lasting impact, a net gain on the ecosystems and the communities where we operate. Many of you are already familiar with our sustainability strategy. We updated it at the previous capital markets day, so today I will focus on what's new, where we are raising the bar, which new chapters we are adding to our sustainability roadmap. So we will spotlight climate and biodiversity while reaffirming all our commitment to the previously announced targets. Let's start with climate, which is where we are taking the boldest step. At Prismian, we believe that becoming bigger implies bigger responsibility. Our carbon footprint over the last few years materially increased, but so has our ambition. Our scope one and scope two baseline now exceed a million tons, a million 43,000 tons, showing a 20% increase in the last four years, accelerated in the last two to take into account of course the acquisition of Anchor Wire but also our own capacity expansions. Think about our investments: Leonardo da Vinci, Alessandro Volta, Mona. But despite this material growth, we stick to the same ambition, which is to decarbonize 90% of our 107 plants and 27 R&D centers by 2035, being aligned with the 1.5 degree trajectory as validated by Science Based Target initiative. So you may ask how this is possible. How can you stick to the same ambition despite this relevant growth? And the first answer is because we're innovative. We are not only innovative in the way in which we launch solutions, but we are also innovative in the way in which we tackle decarbonization. So since we have the pleasure to have Serini with us today, can I ask you how innovation is backing decarbonization and what is making Prismian unique?

Absolutely, Christina. So for those of you who joined us in Naples for last capital market day and are back here, what's the big difference? We've really taken out a significant portion of our scope one and scope two emissions. And how do we do that? One word, maybe two words: sulfur hexafluoride. So sulfur hexafluoride, or SF6, is a mouthful. All I can say is it is the most carbon-intensive gas regulated by the Kyoto Protocol. To give you an idea, 1 kilogram of sulfur hexafluoride is equivalent to 22,800 kg of CO2. And we use sulfur hexafluoride for several decades in our factories for testing high voltage cables and accessories. So Christina, what we ended up doing was putting together a very accelerated innovation roadmap, and in a matter of two years we eliminated sulfur hexafluoride from our footprint. Nada. There you go.

Fantastic. Proud of what you're doing, also because it counts more than half of the reduction we recorded in scope one and scope two in 2024 versus 2019: 20% out of 36%. So this is what is making Prismian unique. But we also going after the basics. So we exploit all the energy efficiency actions from LED lighting to heat pumps, from fossil fuels to biofuels, to the onsite renewable generations, solar panels, to offsite PPAs. We pull every lever to make this happen and to get some cost savings as well. But this is just scope one and two, and this is not enough. If you look at where we generate the vast majority of our impact, it's for sure scope three. And you know, there are two components here: upstream how we source, and downstream. Over 90%, 94% of the impact of our emissions is related to the downstream part. These are the emissions related to the use of our solutions once in the hands of our customers. And the main reason here is the expected lifespan of the cable. Once a cable is installed, it is expected to last on average 35 to 40 years, in our case much longer than that. So if we look at where we are here, our baseline is 236 million tons. You can clearly appreciate the difference versus the million tons in scope one and scope two. At the end of 2024, we were able to cut by 57%, almost 60%, scope three downstream versus the baseline, which is amazing. And you may ask how this is possible. We are outpacing scope one and scope two. And the main reason here, the first answer, is grid decarbonization. So in 2024, the grid was greener than it was in 2019, our baseline. So the energy powering our cables was greener thanks to the global investment in renewable generation that we contributed to develop. This is one of the reasons why we keep saying sustainability is what we do at Prismian. My colleagues would say there can't be energy transition without transmission. But you may challenge us and you can say, okay, this is the grid effect, and I know you very well, so what Prismian is directly doing to cut downstream emissions? So if we strip out the grid effect, at the end of 2024 we were able to cut by 21% scope three downstream emissions, and this is the pure effect of our innovative solutions. So Serini, can you share with us an example of Prismian unique solutions that help us to cut downstream emissions but also our customers' emissions?

Another one of my personal favorites: E3X technology. Since we're in the US, let's talk about overhead line transmission, because overhead line transmission has been identified right now as one of the most important factors.

To improve the grid resilience of the US grid, over 70% of the overhead conductors today are more than 60-70 years old. Here we came up with a very elegant yet simple innovation: E3X technology. It's classified as an advanced conductor technology. The idea is you have a high-MWVD coating, a highly functionalized coating that you put on the outside of an overhead conductor, and when you do that, you can benefit two ways: either you push more power, 25-30% more power, or you actually save the same amount in losses. We've gone a step further now. We've developed a set of robots which can actually be put on the existing infrastructure. We're talking about 600,000 miles in our country here where this upgrade can be done without reconductoring or bringing the lines down. So this is a very good example, Christina, of how we are combining innovation, sustainability for business impact. We also won an award twice. We won the Edison Innovation Award, which are called the Oscars of innovation, twice for this.

So I should have brought you a recycled copper statue today. No, thank you very much.

And can you share, I know that we have few other options, can you share with us another example of innovation which goes also beyond Scope 3 and which allows us to avoid emissions, the so-called Scope 4?

Since we're in New York, I'd like to talk about something which is more specific to New York. Just a piece of trivia for all of you in the audience: New York is home to the world's largest underground distribution network. Right under our feet is 100,000 miles of power cables and 300,000 underground vaults or manholes where these cables are spliced together. Now, Con Edison, which is a utility that manages this whole network, a very important customer to us, they came to us two years ago and shared that the single biggest concern or source of failure they have in the network is poor workmanship. We're dreaming big together with Con Edison, Exelon, and the US Department of Energy to come up with the world's first fully automated splicing machine, which will reduce the network failures from over 85% to 5%. Again, this is a great example of using automation technology to reduce not only Scope 3 but also Scope 4 emissions, and the most important part of all, we're hitting human safety with this innovation. We're aiming to save lives.

Absolutely, this is amazing. Thank you, thank you very much, Serini. So let's complement the view of Scope 3 and move upstream. This is how we source. Here our baseline is 13 million tons, 5% of the overall emissions to value chain, so less impactful than downstream but more in our control. We are working, partnering with our suppliers to decarbonize the value chain and introducing new standards into the system through recycled copper, low-carbon aluminum, biobased material, recycled polyethylene. And this is because the vast majority of the carbon footprint of the product is at the design phase. So Serini, how innovative we are here and how we are helping to push the standards of the value chain. I was very pleased to hear Mr. Vigna share similar examples of what is happening in Ferrari. So yes, there's a lot of appetite right now across the value chain, and here the only point I'd like to highlight is I spoke a lot about customers, customers, but our approach to open innovation and collaboration extends both ways in the value chain, and each of these examples have been joint technology developments we've executed with some of our strategic suppliers.

Everything from recycled copper, low-carbon aluminum that eliminates the carbon footprint of aluminum 75-80%, recycled polyethylene, and more recently biobased materials. Now biobased materials have a negative carbon footprint. It's like you're sucking CO2 from the atmosphere. Incredible. So we've got our engineers, our manufacturing facilities using all of these to reduce our carbon footprint.

This is amazing. Thank you, thank you very much, Serini. So if we add everything up, it's clear that we are accelerating. So we are accelerating our decarbonization journey, and so we are able now to move forward the trajectory we were following for Scope 3 from the well below 2 degree trajectory to the 1.5. We are following the same trajectory for Scope 1, Scope 2, and Scope 3. So today we are proud to announce that by 2035 we will decarbonize 90% of Scope 1, Scope 2, and Scope 3, which implies that we are bringing forward our net zero year from 2050 to 2035. We are bringing forward net zero by 15 years. We will be net zero by the next decade, and this represents a new standard in our space. But this is climate and circular economy. And then I told you before, we are adding new chapters to our sustainability strategy because it's never enough, and we are introducing a new dimension which is biodiversity. Our relationship with biodiversity is not new. For decades, Prysmian has been a pioneer not only in connecting the world through cutting edge technologies but in doing so with the utmost respect for the ecosystem, from land to submarine installation, which is where our biodiversity impact is mainly concentrated. We have always followed a do-not-harm approach, making sure that we were minimizing any disruption and protecting the overall ecosystem. But today we are taking a leap forward, and we are moving from a do-not-harm approach to a net gain approach, and we are committing to be net gain on the most critical areas by 2035. Why? Because we are responsible, of course, but because also biodiversity is becoming a source of competitive advantage and is one of the most frequent questions I received from you in the last couple of years. If you take the most recent tenders in specific countries, especially EGL1, EGL2, but also EGL3 and EGL4, they all have biodiversity KPIs in the tenders. And since we are the leader in our space, we don't only want to meet requirements, we want to introduce new standards and we want to push the industry forward.

Absolutely, Chris. We've got our plates full here. So thank you very much for your attention. Thank you very much for your support. And I have now the pleasure to call to the stage our Group CFO, Francesco Fancini, who will talk about value creation from the financial standpoint.

Thank you, Christina, and good day to all of you attending in presence and also a special thanks to all the investors and our Prysmian colleagues who are following us from remote. It's really special to be here with you today. It's special because as Christina and Serini told us, here in New York City or in US, we are making such a big difference to our customers, to the communities through our solutions. So back to my role, here is to guide you on how we convert all the opportunities that my colleagues explained into value creation for our shareholders. And in order to do that, let me start from our long history of delivery of results. Delivery in the period from 2007 to 2024, including Enkor on a pro forma basis, our EBITDA grew by a factor of 4 times. In the same period, our free cash flow grew even faster by a factor of 5 times. And what is even more important, in the last two years, 2023 and 2024, this growth picked up speed, accelerated. You see that our EBITDA in '23 and '24 grew at a CAGR of 20%, now our free cash flow at an even faster CAGR of 35%. Specifically, our free cash flow in the last two years, '23 and '24, compared to the targets that we had set at the last Capital Market Day, exceeded these targets by approximately 1 billion euro.

You certainly remember that at the last Capital Market Day we introduced a new financial target, EPS growth, earnings per share growth, and you remember that at that time we set an objective in terms of CAGR for the period 2022-2027 of a CAGR greater than 10%. Now I'm really pleased to show you that in the first two years of this period, '23 and '24, we overachieved this target and we achieved an EPS growth, diluted EPS growth, of 15%, definitely above the level that we had set at that time. These were our past achievements, our past results. I want to now move into our future growth and into our future financial targets. And in order to do that, I want to start with our investment plan, the new investment plan for the period 2025-2028, four years. It's a total investment plan of 2.66 billion for the four years, including 0.5 billion related to the latest acquisitions, to the latest changes in perimeter of Enkor and just signed the Channel acquisition. This definitely marks a growth compared to our historical level of CapEx. You see here, we took a reference period of 2020-2023 when our yearly average CapEx amounted to approximately 400 million, and this is now rising to 650 million. This well reflects very clearly the positive discontinuity which is happening in our industry, driven by the secular drivers of electrification, energy transition, and digital transformation.

Well, how does this investment plan compare with a plan that we were showing at the last Capital Market Day in Naples in October 2023? Here it is. Referring to the last investment plan presented in Napoli, and taking as a reference the period 2024-2027, it is basically in line, taking into account of course the new investments coming from the acquisitions. So you see it's in line at 2.1 billion if we take out from the 2.66 billion the 0.5 billion related to the new acquisitions. And well, this definitely means a reinforcement of our capital efficiency. It definitely means that a stable level of CapEx is associated with upgraded financial targets, which is very important. And I believe that this is particularly evident for instance in our transmission segment, where as Massimo showed us, we have significantly upgraded our financial ambitions.

Massimo anticipated our main financial targets. I want to now zoom deeper into the four key financial targets, starting from the growth of our adjusted EBITDA and focusing on the period 2025-2028. Adjusted EBITDA is growing from the midpoint of our '25 guidance at 2.3 billion up to 3.05 billion euro as anticipated, a growth of 750 million euro, including, as you clearly see, the contribution coming from the just signed acquisition of Channel, 150 million euro including synergies for 2028. A significant portion of this growth definitely stems from the transmission business. Here we are deploying our capacity expansion both in manufacturing and installation, and this will drive a high double-digit growth, taking our revenues not far, pretty close to the level of 5 billion euro in 2028, and our EBITDA margin pretty close to the level of 20%. Also the other segments are giving a significant contribution to the growth of our EBITDA in the period, starting obviously from digital solutions, and not only because of the just signed acquisition of Channel, also because of the organic growth that we want to pursue in the market. Specifically in US for power grid and electrification, the key points are: Power Grid, definitely pursue the mid-single-digit organic growth coming from the market, both from US and European market, and leveraging on the capacity expansion that we have done in the past and that, as explained, we'll do also in the future. And for electrification, specifically for industrial and construction space in North America, the key point is to achieve our run-rate level of synergies at 140 million euro, adding approximately 75-80 million euro on top of the synergies which are already embedded in our 2025 guidance.

Financial target number two, equally important: free cash flow. Our ambition here is to move from the 1 billion midpoint of our guidance in 2025 up to a midpoint of our '28 financial target of 1.6 billion, maintaining the cash conversion rate, so the conversion of EBITDA into free cash flow, above the level of 50%, a very high level. Let me underline here that our 1.6 billion target 2028 assumes a normalization in the dynamics of working capital related to our transmission business. That's important. It means that for 2028 we realistically expect that the cash inflows coming from customer down payments will basically offset the working capital growth driven by the project execution accelerations and the very strong revenue growth. And this differs very much from the situation that we have enjoyed in 2024, where our 1 billion free cash flow was definitely boosted strongly boosted by a decrease of working capital associated with large down payments from our customers. And as such, this makes, in my opinion, the target for 2028 quite sustainable also for the period beyond 2028.

Financial target number three: growth of earnings per share, of diluted earnings per share. Massimo anticipated. We target a growth, a CAGR between 15 and 19% in the period 2024-2028. That's obviously consistent with our EBITDA range, with a 2028 EBITDA range. And we made the exercise here to recalculate and adjust the diluted EPS in order to exclude the amortization of intangible assets related to the past purchase price allocations related to our past acquisitions, Draka and General Cable, and then Enkor in particular. And that's interesting because it sets a target range 2028 between 4.6 and 5.2 euro per share, with midpoint which is substantially five, very close to five.

Financial target number four: return on capital employed. Well, the numbers here are not really comparable to the ones, to the targets that we set in Naples for the simple reason that since then our net invested capital grew massively by approximately 5 billion euro on the back of the acquisition of Enkor and just signed acquisition of Channel. Still we set also in this case an ambitious target moving from 16% in 2024 to a midpoint of 21% in 2028, an increase of 500 basis points.

I want to move now to our capital allocation priorities and I want to show you how a robust and strong free cash flow generation over the period '25-'28 allows us to combine equally important, equally valuable goals: the goals of growth, organic and inorganic, and the goal of further strengthening our financial structure. But let me start from this cumulative cash generation. We anticipate a cash generation for the four years at approximately 5 billion euro. This compares with the 3.2 billion that we set at the last Capital Market Day in Naples, but that one was a five-year period of time. This is four-year period, so from 3.2 to 5 billion with one year less, and I definitely think that this is obviously ending at a much higher scale and a definitely higher level of cash generation.

Back to the capital allocation priorities. Number one: continuing our policy of steadily increasing the dividend per share, the DPS. We want to allocate here in the period approximately 1.1 billion, growing our DPS at a CAGR of 12% and allocating approximately 1.1 billion. Number two: reducing our net debt by approximately 1.3 billion in order to achieve a run rate in terms of financial leverage, in terms of ratio net debt on EBITDA between 1 and 1.5 times, thus further improving our credit merit and further strengthening our financial structure. Last, we'll be left with a flexibility on our balance sheet for approximately 2.6 billion, actually 2.1 billion if we take out from this 2.66 billion 500 million approximately of positive free cash flow effects coming from the application of IFRS 16. And this flexibility of 2.1 billion, mainly there from 2027, will allow us to address further growth, organic growth, so further acquisitions, or in case no attractive acquisition were there, which may always happen, to improve, to enhance the cash remuneration of our shareholders. But let me highlight here how the timeline is very important. The leverage reduction of debt comes first. Of course we come from a very large acquisition, in particular Enkor in 2024, and this will, the leverage will take place in 2025 and 2026, and this will trigger the financial flexibility that I'm talking about mainly from 2027. So in a nutshell, this is how a strong cash generation meets our ambitions in terms of organic, inorganic growth and also improvement of the shareholder cash remuneration.

I thank you very much for your attention. I hope I was able to convey to you my confidence on these targets. And I'm now happy to invite back to the stage our CEO, Massimo Battaini, for the final remarks.

I have one important moment again together. I will welcome on stage Francesco Gori, our Chairman of the Board, for one more good news.

The good news is that the morning is over. It's been an intense morning. I think very interesting, and I want to thank all of you and all the people that is following us via streaming for being with us today in New York. I want to thank Massimo, also on behalf of the Board of Directors, and his team for the hard work and the excellent presentation that I think was very interesting for us all, including the Board, because reviewing the full story with all the participation, including Benedetto Vigna and intervention and the customers, it's been very interesting. So that is for today. The last news or information is the following: 2025 marks a very important moment in the life of Prysmian because it is the 20th year from when Prysmian was born. And 20 years, I think that have been spent in delivering results, improving the company size, the company footprint worldwide, and growing up talents that allow the company to reach the targets that today Massimo showed you. Everybody. So 20 years of leadership that we are now accelerating, and there is no time like now to look forward to the future. Thank you.

Thank you. I'll go to the last. Francesco, it's time for Q&A. It's time, it's time for your questions. Definitely it's time for your questions. You were looking forward. I see Danielle already raising hands. So we will take questions from people attending here, but we also have the opportunity to take questions coming from the web, of course. Let's start from you, Daniel. You should get the mic.

Thank you so much. I just have two questions. It sounds like the big message is sort of pivoting more towards service. When we think about service, lots of the capital goods companies that we cover do significantly higher profitabilities in service than they do in product, sometimes two times or more. But you guys, sort of Power Grid slightly down the margins, Electrification Sustainable, it's not on the Transmission bridge, I guess it's all on the Digital Solutions. So can you help us understand over the long run what that pivoting for services can really mean on margins? Is it services materially better margins than products for you or not? It's just more about sustaining where you are and remaining competitive?

Thank you. And my second question is just more: you've just decided to do one more step in the US, and there's a lot of anxiety from investors about sort of which stage we are in terms of US economy, where are we in telecoms and data centers, but you clearly decided to do this move for Channel now. Can you give us a little bit of context of why why now? Was this a competitive process? Do you have a different view on the market?

Thank you. And there's other hands there.

Hi, Chris Len from UBS. Thanks for taking. I've just got two questions if I may. The first is on the target for 3 billion or so of EBITDA by 2028. If I do the numbers, it seems to me like the Electrification margin maybe will blow sort of 10% by 2028, if we take into account Power Grid staying at 12-13 and the growth in Transmission as well. Are those the right sort of numbers to be thinking about for Electrification, and does that imply the Enkor margin is slightly reducing out to 2028? Just trying to get clarity there, as you said in your remarks you'd see stability on margin. So just trying to understand Electrification to 2028 on low voltage.

Okay, super clear. Thank you for that. And second question on the capacity additions for Transmission. Is there any sort of guidance you can give us on the CapEx we should be expecting there on Transmission to support that EBITDA CAGR of 25 to 28%, and how are you seeing with that new capacity coming in, how are you seeing the supply and demand picture as well at high voltage?

I see VC from Citi.

Thank you very much, everyone. Good morning. It's VC from Citi. I have a couple of questions on Digital Solutions if I may. So the first question is a follow-up regarding Channel. You've alluded to the better margin. Channel, you've given us an absolute EBITDA number. It'd be quite interesting to learn what the margin is. And could you also give us a little bit of background on has that margin been stable over time or has there been an improvement in recent years?

Fully understood. Thank you. My second question again on Digital Solutions, a bit broader. It's a bit more, you know, we sometimes get questions given some of the news flow in the US and some of the political chatter, there's of course Starlink and also more broadly the questions around the BEAD program. I'd just be interested in some of your thoughts around that.

Thank you. I see Akash from JP Morgan.

Yes, hi, good morning everyone and thanks for your time. I got two questions. The first one is on margins. So you said in 2028 we could be above 12%. Last year we were at 11.3. And when we look at the moving parts, you have margin improvement significant in Transmission, significant in Digital Solutions, some normalization in Power Grid, and Electrification largely stable. Now the question I have is more for like when we look at your presentation today and especially Serini on innovation, where you highlight these new areas where you are going into, and also little bit following up from Daniela as well that more on service side. So like if you target higher vitality ratio in future, what is the upside from those new innovation on margins? I mean, Serini talked about a couple of those, like this new groundbreaking technology in submarine cable that I think could be really revolutionary, and same thing with these overhead wires. So maybe a question about on margins, there is a debate, but then there are moving parts. So how do you see role innovation playing in margins by 2028 versus where we are last year?

Thank you. And my second question is more short-term question. So last month at Q4 results, when you admitted that there is some price pressure in Enkor, you told us that you expect improvement from March onwards. Now we are end of March. So can you confirm if you have seen improvement in Enkor price, or will it take more time than what you previously said?

Thank you. Welcome.

Yes, hi, good morning. Alistair from Bernstein. Just a couple of questions. One on the US listing. You said that was paused. I think it's put a little bit of pressure on the share price. Do you think that largely just as a timing issue, something you can return to once Channel completes in Q2, or do you think there's maybe a higher chance now that this doesn't happen at all? And then the second question on data centers and digital solutions. You said in the past that you were a little bit kind of underrepresented here. So does Channel, the acquisition from Channel, now give you everything you need in Digital Solutions to really pursue all the opportunities in front of you there, or do you need to continue to innovate and develop organically and perhaps still do some bolt-on M&A deals here as well?

Thank you, thank you. It's Thamanna from Bank of America. Thank you for taking my question. I just have one please. So on Power Grid margins. So for Power Grid, I guess you're investing a bit more into the US, and if I understand correctly, your US margins are significantly higher than Europe. So how should we think about the margin dynamics given you have guided flat in the next few years? When I have thought, the US growth should have lifted the margins a bit further.

Thank you. The question is about on Power Grid margins, and since in many case we are saying that US market has higher margins but we are guiding for flattish market on Power Grid, the expectations were for margins to continue to grow given our also investment in US Power Grid. I take it first of all I think that our target of mid-single-digit growth in Power Grid is both in US and in Europe. Also Europe is clearly an opportunity in terms of growth. So I don't think that there is a big mix effect on that. Having said that, your remark about the differential between EBITDA margin in North America and Europe for Power Grid is certainly there. And then we had to. We on the safe side as we explained, we have decided to embed in our financial targets a, let me say, minimal normalization of price and margins. And this means an EBITDA margin run rate between 12 and 13% versus the 13.4% which was achieved in 2024. We think it's quite safe. It could be, we hope it will be conservative. We hope and we think it's also well possible that margins remain stable in both in US and by the way could improve in Europe because the gap as you remarked is pretty significant. And this will potentially play on the top part of our target range.

Welcome, Josh from Morgan Stanley.

Hi, thank you. It's Josh Miller from Morgan Stanley. I guess first question going back to something Chris was asking on the high voltage supply demand environment. In the past you've talked about this being 30% undersupplied. Since then we've maybe seen a bit of a step up from Asia competition in terms of expanding capacity in western markets, and also maybe a weakening of the offshore demand environment. If you were to take a step back and re-evaluate that statement, that view, what would that look like today?

Amazing, thank you. And just a second question again sort of linked to high voltage. You're now guiding for sort of an 18 to 20% margin for 28, that's what it sounds like. When you look at new orders, obviously you had some new orders at the end of last year. When you look at these new orders you're still taking in, is there room for this to push higher in the out years beyond 2028? Do you feel like this is now the right level for this business going beyond into that mid-long term?

I saw Akash and then we have...

Yes, hi, it's Akash again from JP Morgan. A couple of follow-ups to Francesco. So the first one is on the Channel deal. I think when you acquired Enkor, you gave us what sort of EPS accretion you are expecting from Enkor. Could you quantify any like what sort of EPS accretion we should expect from Channel? And then the second one is on the bridge between EBITDA and EPS, because last time when we had previous capital market day, you did not give us EPS guidance, but this time around for 28 you have given EPS guidance. So maybe if you can talk about the big ticket items that flows from EBITDA to EPS, so we can see what's your assumption behind some of these lines.

Okay, let me start from Channel, not Channel, just to avoid any confusion. Even if margins are high, but maybe not that high. And the quality of the actually I don't know the margins of Channel, I will check. Apart from jokes, I think we have been in our press release quite explicit on the way we will finance that. We come from a very large acquisition in 2024, before we are very keen on maintaining our investment grade, of course. So we have decided to go for that ambition, but at the same time to finance this in a quite prudent way. And this quite prudent way is what I try to express in the press release as a balanced mix of equity and debt. In principle, equity provided by some disposals of the treasury shares. You remember that we have just completed our share buyback in Q1 2025, so we have a quite significant portfolio of treasury shares. At the same time, we plan to tap the capital market with a hybrid. To be very clear, a hybrid is not a convertible. A hybrid is a subordinated bond which will not result into issuance of new shares. Still, normally the interest rates of subordinated bonds is slightly higher, not massively higher, slightly higher than a senior bond, let's say 100-150 basis points higher. And boiling this down and putting all these in a pot, I think this still will result into a certain accretion, a slight accretion, let me say a one-digit accretion of EPS coming from the Channel acquisition. And talking about the 15-19% EPS CAGR which will convert in terms of adjusted EPS in substantially, we think the midpoint is very realistic at five euro per share, 4.9 let's say five euro per share. You have visibility on the EBITDA. The adjustments below the adjusted EBITDA line will definitely decrease because in 2024 there were particularly high on the back of Digital Solution restructuring and also all the transaction costs and also some PPA effects related to the Enkor acquisition. So this will contribute to the growth of the net income. Our DNA, I'm trying to comment, Akash, on the most important items. Our DNA, reflecting the increase of our the ongoing increase of our capital expenditure plan, will definitely increase. By the way, we have reflected in the DNA increase all the effects related to the purchase price allocation of Enkor. So I want to be clear, the additional DNA coming from the purchase price allocation is taken into account in our EPS, in our EPS growth. But definitely our DNA will increase significantly up to a level I believe between 600-650 million from the current 460 million in 2024. What else? I think the financial charges, of course the financial charges will increase this year because we'll have the full-year effect of the Enkor acquisition financing. And then the cash generation is so strong and the deleverage will kick in so quick that we think that from a level of 260-265 million financial charges this year, this will drop in 2028 well below the 200 million threshold. The last but not least, the tax rate, quite stable, 26-27% depending on the year. And this will actually drive a net income that, including Channel, we see consistently with the midpoint of our EBITDA range in the 1.45 billion somewhere there. Of course that's the midpoint of a range.

I see Matteo for a question for Francesco on the link between free cash flow and working capital. So in 2024 you generated 1 billion free cash flow, but more than 40% of that was working capital, which makes sense because in '23 you announced big orders and so you took the advance payment. My question is basically over your plan, what are your assumptions for this item of the working capital? Also in relation and that's the second question to your projection of 15 to 20 billion intake per year, which is a big number for transmission because some of your peers guide more 10 to 15 and not 15 to 20. So I would like to know a little bit more. First of all, the composition of this 15 to 20 billion across interconnector and offshore wind, if you can provide a little bit more color. And second, in relation also to the intake in high voltage, the dynamic of the working capital to understand if it's going to continue to play a big role in your free cash flow.

Thank you, Matteo. Very interesting question. Our journey, our move from 1 billion to 1.6 billion. Basically the first years, or the central part of this period of time, will be a bit in the growth will be a bit burdened by the increase of working capital related with transmission. And basically the deployment of the additional capacity and the acceleration in project execution will drive a quite significant increase in working capital, which is embedded of course in our plan. And in the last part, let me say in the last year basically of our plan, as I explained, we think it's realistic to see a substantial balancing between down payments and further growth of the working capital, talking about transmission. And that's good because you are totally right, differently from 2024 where our free cash flow was boosted by you mentioned this 40% component which was coming from the in principle from customer down payments on transmission related to 24 and even more to 23. The 2028 will definitely be much more sustainable. So this growth will happen in steps. Let's quantify them of 150 million in the first two years, 150 in 26, 150 in 27, and then a stronger step around 300 million in the last period of our plan in 2028. Then I maybe I didn't get exactly what are the assumptions. I think on the working capital coming from transmission, considering that in any case we are considering 15-20 billion market which is higher than the estimate of our peers because they are guiding from a lower market in between the 10th and the 12th. On working capital is what I was commenting. We are reflecting a decrease in down payments because this is embedded in our targets. My question was 15-20 billion, how did you build that? Because it's different from what your peers typically say. Where did you take this assumption? How did you build this assumption on the market evolution 15 to 20 billion market size? Since the estimates is again higher than some, not necessarily material because some of them are talking about addressable market. If I think about smaller players which don't have the same coverage that we have, they are targeting the 10-11. We have other competitors that are even talking about 26 billion. So at the end we are taking a more balanced approach. And then in our case, and then Massimo of course you can complement. It's a bottom up. So what we are seeing is the pipeline of projects and the framework that we see coming. We have, if you do this exercise of course you also end up with higher numbers which is not far from some of the other competitors, but we are taking a more prudent approach, you know lowering a bit the estimates. And then I don't know Massimo if you want to. We have, we see the pipeline of projects from competitor from sorry from customers now they already given us a lot of volume to cover revenues for us and other competitors through 2030. They launch in 25 and 26 project will be executed in 2031, 2032. So we have this visibility and the comfort that they are working on this project as we speak. So 20, 15 to 20 million is our best estimate, bottom up estimate of the demand of intake over the next five years.

You're welcome. Hi, Simon from BNP Paribas. Thank you for taking my questions. So my first question is on medium voltage. I remember back in Q4, as you were launching the 20,000 ton new capacity onto the US market, you were very transparent about some margin softness that you see on the spot market. Now you have this new $245 million investment in medium voltage in the US ramping up from Q3 2027. Can you give us a bit more color on how you're comfortable with the 12 to 13% margin with more capacity, and maybe in particular how you see the competition landscape in the US given your biggest competitor here is a private player we don't really have a lot of visibility on how much capacity they're adding.

Thanks very much. So my second question is on the vertical integration of Channel. Channel is very nice, but fiber optics is the most important expensive part in the telecom cable. I think in European market, Asian import makes up a lot of the supply given their cost advantage. Is this the same in the US market? If so, how do you see tariffs play in Europe and here? Why is US that's the question?

Thanks very much. My last question if I'm allowed is on the transmission market size. You commented on this 15 to 20 billion that I expect between 25-30. So I saw the APAC bar is growing. So previously you already commented on transmission business being a global market. I'm just wondering, and recently you were selected as a preferred supplier for the Malaysia to Singapore link. So in this market, what specific countries maybe do you have in mind for this growth?

I see, hi, this is Andrea from Federated Hermes. I have a question for Serini. I really enjoyed your presentation. Can you help me understand how you allocate capital? Because I'm sure you have plenty of projects where you can invest in. How do you think about which one you want to prioritize? Is there any financial KPI in mind? And secondly, it would be interesting to understand if some of the innovation comes from clients coming to you and asking for XYZ, or you going to them with breakthrough innovations.

I can do the second one if you want.

Yeah, you know, when you innovate and you are the only one providing this solution to customer, some customer want to have a double source. So this is when innovation is not enough to penetrate a customer. But again, when medium voltage P-Laser solution was invented, customers were reluctant because they could not find the same alternative among other suppliers. But then with time you break this barrier and you are really able to push your innovation through to all customers.

Absolutely. And then I think that the question was also around how we allocate resources in terms of where we decide to invest in terms of innovation. I would say to comment this that we are definitely selective in terms of projects that we are keen to take and to follow. I think that the split of our backlog, which is very focused on the TSO and much less focused on developers, for instance financial developers, is a clear indication for that. Because we definitely believe that there is much more risk to go after projects with developers in terms of uncertainty of the timeline and also potential uncertainty about the project. In terms of we always try to balance and to look at both the margins and of course the terms and conditions of the contracts, which are important because they reflect directly on the level of risk, it's part of the level of risk embedded in a project. Having said this, I cannot say we are strictly applying financial parameters in taking our projects, no. We have also to consider that the cash flow dynamics, the cash flow profile of the project business of the transmission business is a very good one, is a very strong one. For the simple reason that in the early in the life of a project we get the down payments, we have pretty large milestones that we collect, and this creates a situation where the working capital, before coming obviously to a balance at the end of the project, is basically positive throughout the life of it. So also this has to be taken into consideration in order to decide whether to go after a project or not. Because something is margin, something else of course is the return on capital which is extremely strong in the transmission. In principle you could even think that a part of the large CapEx that we have on transmission, it's approximately one half, close to one half of the total 2.6 billion that I was, is financed, is covered by the positive profile of working capital and the down payments. You can also think it this way.

I know we have time for a couple of other questions if any. I don't see questions coming from the web. I'm not too sure is the device is working. It sounds strange to me, or people are shy, or we have been very long.

So a question.

Okay, sorry, thank you very much everyone. My pleasure. Just another follow-up if I may. So I can see on the appendix you've not assumed an impact from import tariffs. I was just following up again on that question, but in terms of the passthrough mechanisms, it would be great if you could just walk us through how those work maybe by business, particularly around some of the metal tariffs that have been proposed recently.

Thank you. I think we are unfortunately running out of time. We are 10 minutes late on our schedule. It's probably my fault, I overrun by few minutes and then you all fall. Anybody's fault. So thank you again. Some of you will join us with a tour to Enkor war so you will see how large and impressive this site is. Some of us will return to your location and I hope to meet you soon. Really, thank you. Thank you also. Welcome.