Honneur aux dames. Amel, how do you quickly introduce yourself?
Yes, so good evening everyone. My name is Amel Chaby. I'm a stand-up comedian, actress, and writer. Recently, I wrote a book about stand-up called Dingry Book. And otherwise, I do stand-up. I'm an actress in series, films. I also directed a film, a comedy, and a documentary called 'Why Do They Hate Us, Us Arabs?' That's it. That's it. And well, that's it. That's it, basically. And you're a dreamer? And I am, well, given everything I undertake each time, yes, a big dreamer.
Thank you for being here, Amel, and to you, Frédéric. Well, from stand-up to startups, there's only one step. It's almost the same, actually. We do the same job. It's up. Yeah. Or you see, it's a thing with 'up'.
So there you go, I'm an entrepreneur, so I founded BlaBlaCar, which you all must know. You might not all be registered, I didn't check before coming, but if you're not registered, I hope you'll do it soon. No, so it's 20 million French people who use BlaBlaCar, 100 million people in the world. It's a very international company. There are 55 nationalities in the workforce and we are on three continents in more than twenty countries. There you go. And besides that, I also created another company called DIFT, which aims to direct as much funding as possible to associations in collaboration with companies. And then there you go, I'm very immersed in the world of companies, of all startups, but also mainly impact startups via France Digitale because I am co-president of the association France Digitale, which brings together 2,000 startups and about a hundred investors.
And also, I have a show on BFM Business called Les Pionniers, in which I receive incredible people who share their journeys and who make you want to act. I received Gad Elmaleh. Yeah, notably. And spoiler, it's not Fred who did my intro. Ah yes! Ah yes, I... Ah no, I received several comedians. I received Pascal Legitimus too and then Didier Bourdon. There you go. But but actually, I received 90 personalities, including three comedians. But not only, since there are also astronauts, philosophers, adventurers, athletes. I received Martin Fourcade and Tony Estanguet, in short, a rich life, you know.
Yeah, but it's especially, you know, when you when you meet these people, you see the journeys they've had and you see with what humility they share everything they've done, it makes you want to do it too, even if, well, to be an Olympic champion, for me, it's a bit late. Ping pong no. Yeah, not sure. Maybe table tennis. No, I have a first small question if I may. I want, I told you, it's to talk about dreams today and I would like to know first what you consider a dreamer and a dreamer. And what is maybe the first dream you are most proud of that you achieved, Amel, I don't know, or the first one that has something in mind.
The first dream for for me, it's to get on stage and it was on a small stage in Paris called the Théâtre de Trévise. An open stage, what we call, you know what it is, anyone can get on stage. So I spent months and months preparing for this moment. And so it was a dream that I checked off like that by going and it was a monumental flop. But then, but it was bad, really bad. But I how to say, even if it was bad on stage, I felt that at that moment on stage, it was my place. It made me happy to be there. And so it was a nice flop in the end because when I came back, I told myself 'OK, it wasn't fun because I didn't have the techniques but I love I love being there. I'm convinced that it's something I want to do and I went home and I worked hard for another show that was not bad. Not bad but not bad and slowly, well, you learn this profession. So there you go, that was my first dream, it was the Trévise stage in Paris.
What's your big venue? It's the Zéniths. How many thousands of people? It's uh it's many thousands of people. But it's not necessarily the most enjoyable. Yeah, the Zéniths are incredible. It's like a carousel, let's say, you know, the big H like that. But it's not what I prefer. It's really because you know, you don't really see anyone. You get waves of laughter but you don't see, and the small venues, that's what I prefer because there's a real exchange, there's something happening in the air. There you go.
And she still plays at the Sacré. I'm waiting for my invite but there you go, you want to come see her. And you Fred, if I ask you the same question.
Uh, I think that the most important thing I've managed to achieve is to be happy to work every day, you know, to not ask myself questions, to be happy to do what I do and to be aligned between what I think needs to be done and what I do.
And did you always think that was possible, to be able to live like that?
No, I didn't know. There were moments when I was working, well, because I've had quite a few activities, there were moments, I was doing things, it was just, you know, purely financial to make sure I could make ends meet. So it wasn't necessarily very intellectually interesting, it's not exactly what I wanted to do. It happened to me a few times but still enough to tell myself I need to be careful, I need to find something that makes me really happy to do what I do when I work. And so today, as an entrepreneur, you choose the subjects you're going to work on. So necessarily, you are, well, or if you choose badly, then you've gotten into something. Because since it's you who chooses, you only have yourself to blame if what you're working on doesn't please you. But since you have the leisure to choose, well, you choose something that interests you. And at that moment, it's a real dream. It means you don't feel like you're working. Even though you spend 80, 90 hours a week on it, you know, you're going to spend time on it but you don't even feel like you're working. And on the other side, you know, people who don't like their job too much, well, they end up complaining when they work 30 or 35 hours a month, a week, sorry. There you go, and so you tell yourself, well, I prefer to work more but actually I'm not working because I'm doing what I like.
It's very, very hard. It's one by one. At first, you try to get your service referenced on other sites that have a bit more traffic. You exchange a little bit like that, a good faith exchange. You try to make sure you stand out on the right keywords. And then after, there you go, little by little, you also rely on the few people who are registered to tell them to talk about it around them if they think it's good. And then after, well, we also had at one point a visibility accelerator because that's where, well, since we were born in France, it helped us. The SNCF strikes, that helped us a lot. It means that when the SNCF announced they were going on strike, well, we were saying, well, there's BlaBlaCar, well, at the time we were called covoiturage.fr. That gave us a lot of visibility, actually. It's little by little, but don't believe it comes overnight. You really have to be patient. You have to use a lot of, when you can, especially with a public service, it's easier, but the media, talking about the concept and little by little it starts to spread in society. There you go, what we were promoting, carpooling becomes less, somewhere, weird or less unknown as we manage to talk about it. So there you go, you have to do everything, it takes time. It took 7 years between the first registrant and the first million registrants, and then it took 18 months between the first million and the second million, and then it took 6, 8 months between the 2nd and the 3rd million. And then today, we're at 100 million.
Yeah. And actually, I find it funny but it's almost clients that you have to find too, Amel. Completely. And then we say a thing in the artist's profession, in any case, you spend 10 years, 10 years to be known overnight. You see what I mean? 10 years to be known overnight, it means the same. You have to little by little build your notoriety in a closed circle which is our industry and also look for your base. Today, it's the followers but the people who target, finally, the people who are ready to come see you in a show. So there you go, for 10 years, you have to work and then they'll say she's brilliant. Well yeah, well she's been at it for a while. Yeah. In the small cellars, you know, the small, the small comedians, all that, it stays quite confidential and after when they invite you on TV to defend your little show, in reality, you were already in the circuit for a while, you know. So once, a journalist told me like that, yes, BlaBlaCar, it's an overnight success, you know, in success the night was long. Ah yes, yeah, you bet. Yeah, you see, it's crazy, it takes 10 years. It takes 10 years. People don't see the work, so it's already working. It's already the product is working already while we were at version 327 of the product, you know, which has evolved a lot. It's the same, version 1 of a product, it's not good. It's like you. Or yes, it's flops, mini flops. There you go. You still have to launch it and then it will help you get on the right track but it's not there yet. And yeah.
And well, that's what you were saying earlier, finally, you're super happy to get up, strangely, you know. And what I told you at the beginning, it's a flop, it's bad, no one laughs. But I don't know, you enjoy it, you're very happy actually. You say no, I believe in it actually. You also have to like pasta, huh. Well, you have to like pasta. Yeah, you have to like pasta. If you like pasta already, you have an advantage with pasta. Yeah. And well, that's great. And well yeah, frankly because finally, to not get distracted, you do small jobs, well, small jobs that you don't necessarily like, waiter and etc., but quickly, you understand that you shouldn't tire yourself out either. You understand? You shouldn't do too much of those jobs either. So, you have to eat pasta, tighten the belt, find ways to give all your energy to your art or your business or your idea, you know.
And do you doubt in 10 years how you continue? No, if... ah if OK. No but how do you do it or what is it? It's passion that makes you stop, it's regrets, what would it be? For me, it's you doubt but you tell yourself anyway I have no other path, I have nothing better to do, I'm happy where I am. It's what you said. Uh, it's there you go, I love doing what I do so I don't see what I would go do otherwise so I'm going to continue. Same for you Amel. Yes, it's the same. And you are secretly convinced perhaps also of something. You say 'Ah, I hope to get there.' Well, there are days you are... yeah, there are days you're really like that. You have more strength. OK. I say well, I don't know if I'm going to get there and I don't know, a week passes and there's a little thing where you, well, you can hold on to a little thing but it's so small this thing, so small and uh but you were like that and the little thing grows slowly and it's true that you have to, well, you have to hold on and you also have to resist when you expose, in any case in my case, when I was exposing what I wanted to do, you know, what I wanted to build with BlaBlaCar and that there are friends who love you, who listen to you patiently and who don't say much, but you read the compassion in their eyes, you know, and there they look at you, they tell themselves 'It's weird, he was doing well. Yeah, he had a good education. Yeah, he had a job, a real job. And now, he's dropping everything to go build a website for people who hitchhike.' And and and there, you feel a bit of loneliness. Hm hm. Uh but uh what kept me going, what made me hold on, was the first users who were using, well, at the time we were called covoiturage.fr, who were using it and who found it good. So I have 1500 phone numbers of carpoolers, so it's the beginnings of value creation and I was calling them, you know, to ask them what we needed to improve and to be in contact like that with people who use the product even when it's at a very small scale. It helps you a lot to hold on because you already know who you're working for.
Is it the first audience that you make laugh or who gives you back, for example, the same thing of 'Ah, you're useful there?' Yes, absolutely. In fact, it's those who will stay after the show, there are four who will stay who will and who will talk to you finally. They will say 'Oh my, I identified with that moment. It helped me. It gave me joy, it made me laugh or cry. It depends on the emotions you want to convey. And these four people who stay, you say 'OK, great, I did my job, I'm super happy and little by little, well, there's a seed that remains, after there are lots of people and it's nice, you know. But from 4 to 6, it grows, you know.
There, we are already in a logic where we multiply the means of transport on BlaBlaCar. You must have seen. It means there's long-distance carpooling, there's short-distance carpooling and there's also bus and now there's also train. Uh, you must have seen that you can book train tickets. Well, not on all routes yet but it's coming, well, we started with Spain and then now in the south of France. Uh and so uh so the logic is to go multiply the transport possibilities on BlaBlaCar and then to continue the growth where we see an enormous potential, notably today in Brazil and India, there are very strong potentials. It means that you have no competition there. Well, in fact, already in Brazil, there's no train. Everything goes by road or by plane. Uh but so therefore, you have strong growth because there's an enormous interest for moving. Uh and so after in terms of competition, well, what happens is that when there are platforms that do carpooling too, well, generally uh you try to have, well, always the best product because in fact on services like that, people are one click away from one service to another and so they always go to the platform that is the best made. So you really have to make sure you always have the best product.
That's very important. I've always had the same friends for 25 years. Uh, well, I have other friends but I also always have my friends from 25 years. I managed to make two or three friends since. After, it's very important because precisely, it keeps in the, in the each one's journey and no distancing. That's important too because you can quickly isolate yourself when you're caught like that by a project that takes you 24/7. You can lose your friends. Be very careful about that, you have to stay in contact. So I've always been careful. It's more to mention a human reaction than to mention the reactions of certain people. It's the general acceptability of what is new that is difficult. Anyway, it's anyone. And even us, well, even me in certain situations, I behave like my friends could behave when I presented them with something new. It's quite difficult generally to understand someone who is inhabited by a mission. Uh, you have to spend time on it.
It's funny, you talk about being inhabited. I wanted to ask you the question, we're not going to speak Chinese. You didn't get upset. When people, they give you back, it's your loved ones and they give you back doubt. Well, the word 'seum' didn't exist at the time. Yeah, but Amel understood me. So 2 + 1, uh 2 but I... No but you see what I mean? It's saying well, you don't understand my thing but support me. No because I think we already know because it's friends and family too. We feel a worry more from family and friends. It's something very benevolent of 'Oh my, she might be or he might be wasting his time, his money, his energy and it's more, yes, worry and fear of telling yourself 'Oh my, he's going to be disappointed, it's going to be hard.' Uh and finally, you feel that look, huh, the look you're talking about, it's certain, but we try to convince them too.
And how do you do it? Well, I'm asking the question again, but there are people, I don't know if they're malicious, but if they don't allow themselves to dream, they might give you back negativity regarding your dreams. How do you manage or do you separate yourself from these people? In fact, uh, it's negative again, well-meaning, it's weird but you know, it's like they can slow you down and in fact, well, you see them less, it's true but you try to dose it. You don't tell everything either, uh, you try to be optimistic. Especially for the family, poor things. Oh my. Oh they were in a panic, poor things. They said 'Oh my! He's going straight into the wall.' So you try to say 'Yeah, no, it's fine, it went well. You avoid the scary stuff.'
