On the Startup Stage this week, we are here with a very special project. I have very special guests with me. The General Manager of Türkiye İş Bankası, dear Hakan Aran, and Professor Doctor Gökhan Hotamışlıgil are with us. Welcome.
We are too. We are very happy to host you. With your permission, I will start with my first question to dear Professor Gökhan. Professor Gökhan, first of all, let me tell our viewers that we will be talking about the Enlila project, but what does Enlila mean?
Well, Enlila is the name of the journey we have embarked on together. It has many stops and parts. The reason we chose that name is that perhaps the most important thing for us is our desire to maintain our ties with these lands, and Enlila is a name that originated from here. It is an ancient name that comes from the history of this place, extending to Mesopotamian culture. It is not just a symbol; it has a meaning related to the long-term, sustainable life we want to create, to transforming life. It represents that source of power. It also symbolizes the lands where we were born, grew up, and were shaped. We aim to engage in activities both in terms of mechanism and solution for the group of diseases that cause the most trouble for humanity, creating the greatest burdens, some of which come with aging and some with obesity, affecting almost half of the world's population in some way. This requires a new structure to bring to life some projects that have been ongoing in my own laboratory for 30 years and have matured. We all see this need, and by a series of coincidences, the stars align. Both there, in a place like Boston, which is truly the heart of the biotechnology world, and within it, a large university, a very comprehensive university like Harvard University. And our common ground is our aspirations and dreams related to the Republic, our aspirations and dreams related to Turkey, our aspirations and dreams related to science, and our aspirations and dreams about leaving something useful in this world before going to humanity. When the right stars align at the right time, this project emerged.
Dear Hakan Bey, we are actually facing a picture that we don't see very often in Turkey. We are talking about an initiative where a bank, a venture capital, and a world-class scientist come together. What was the shared dream that made this table possible?
Thank you very much. Before coming to the shared dream, I would like to share with you what made this table possible. We had organized 'Looking to the 2nd Century with Atatürk's Vision' conferences on the 100th anniversary of the Republic and the bank. And especially in the conference in the second year, Professor Gökhan was a speaker, and he explained so beautifully the difficulties he encountered during his scientific work, that science needs to be understood and supported as much as art. I was in the audience at that conference. In that speech, Professor Gökhan's striking analogies describing the obstacles in front of science affected me deeply and I never forgot them. In fact, Professor Gökhan himself brought that shared dream. He provided the shared dream with that speech. He gave these two examples. One was about Pasteur. When he rises from his grave and sees that people are still dying of cancer, he says, 'Haven't you found a cure for cancer even in this day and age?' And thinking, 'Let me solve this so I can rest in peace in my grave,' he would embark on scientific studies to solve cancer. But when the academic board that allows this asks him what he will do, how long he plans to get results, what budget he wants, what kind of team he wants, how often he will inform them, the report, etc., and states the conditions, Pasteur decides to return to the grave. That was the first example. So, we are trying to do something in a scientific environment that caused Pasteur to return to his grave, but he didn't say that. The other example he gave was from painting, from art. If you ask Michelangelo, 'How much red paint will you use, how much yellow paint will you use, how much blue paint will you use while painting a picture? What budget are you thinking for these paints? Where do you want to go with this picture? And as you paint the picture, please tell us from time to time how much material you used and what the result is,' what kind of art would we encounter? Science cannot be done under such constraints. It cannot be done, and it progresses in a problematic way. When he said that, since we are thinking about what should be done differently in the 2nd century, what we are dreaming of, the idea of contributing to Professor Gökhan's work and finding the model that can provide the closest contribution he desires lit a light in us, Kubilay Bey and me. When I said, 'Let's support this, but let's design a model for how we can support,' in a very short time, the model that Professor Gökhan first described, a model centered around a project, long-term, and allowing the scientist to work as comfortably as possible, emerged. Signing such an important project in Turkey's future, especially considering how much the population will age by 2050 and the proportion of the population over 65, is a problem that the whole world is focusing on. If these forces, these parts come together to find a solution, it is worth it, at least worth trying. The dream brought us together. I think, as far as I know, please correct me if I'm wrong, we are talking about this initiative, perhaps for the first time in such detail on a television program.
Of course, at least I haven't talked about it.
Then I can consider myself lucky.
Yes. Yes. Probably, Professor Gökhan, I don't know if you have talked about the story of this in such detail. The beginning of this story is a very unusual beginning. Not just for Turkey, but for the world too. Secondly, in terms of structure, one branch is completely connected to academia, one branch is connected through the academia-industry relationship, and a part of it is related to the creation of the industry piece. So, while we were thinking of opening the way, as Hakan Bey said, academia has very good sides. It has very difficult sides. It has very suffocating, movement-restricting sides, and opening sides. Industry is the same way; within industry, there are opportunities to move very quickly, and opportunities to not move at all. But our idea was that if we set up both in parallel and connect them, then we can use the characteristics of where we need flexibility, speed, and efficiency the most. We had a dream like that, and it came true.
Now, it has become a model project. As far as I understand, the same applies globally. It's not limited to Turkey. For us, this kind of collaboration is very new. The professor calls it academia, industry, and I will add finance to this, especially. Because the story you told about Pasteur actually explains the dynamics of the finance world in very simple terms. How we, classic financiers, look at projects.
We are not alone. It's not just financiers who look at it this way. The academic world also looks at it this way. Everyone looks at it that way. Exactly. Both financiers and perhaps, Professor, a common point can be found there. That's why the perspectives are already like this. This is a dilemma, Professor. He had explained it as the opposition between Apollo and Dionysus. So, the perspective of the financiers, the perspective Professor criticized, is the Apollonian perspective.
The professor wants the creativity of Dionysus to be added. Emotions to be added. Not just so much reason and logic. Even if we are doing science, we need to make an important place for emotions. He hears. So, he explained starting from that opposition. Now, a biotechnology, at some point, a part of it is a biotechnology initiative project, Enlila. A part of it, I haven't heard before, but a bank taking such a clear stance here, frankly, I haven't heard of it, it's not something I'm used to.
Well, for the country's economic independence, for the country's development, if there is a gap in any area, if there is an entrepreneur who needs to be supported, if there is an artist who needs to be supported, if there is a scientist who needs to be supported, filling that gap is within its mission. That corporate mission defined 100 years ago promises us that if there is an opportunity that creates value for the country, and if there is a lack of support in the area that needs support for that opportunity, entering that area, filling that area, and being an example is part of it. That's why a bank might not be in this project. It could easily be explained why not. When you made a speech at your conference and shared that work, and when you said that work needed support to succeed, and that this support could not be obtained in a long-term, sustainable way and in the way you desired, and you pointed out the constraints in this direction, you see a gap there, and you fill this gap with the motivation that comes from your mission. For a work, a project that Professor Gökhan has perhaps dedicated his life to, both to succeed as a project and for humanity to benefit from its contributions, and in the future, we are talking about the 2050s. If someone is to look back and say, 'Who thought of this, what did they do?', seeing this program, watching it, reading Professor Gökhan's life, where things happened, how this unity was formed, and then the factors that brought success came together. Seeing this and making people say when we look back from the future that there was a visionary stance here is enough for us. Our main motivation in such matters is usually this perspective.
I am also very happy to be a small part of the story. Thank you for being here again.
Now, Professor, as Hakan Bey said, you are a very valuable scientist who has dedicated your life to science. Now, we are all trying to reach a shared dream with the work you do. The finance world has certain requirements, and those requirements might be of a nature that could challenge a scientist at some point. What I see, what I observe, and in our previous conversations, is that the institution that will make you feel this the least and provide the best support in the true sense will be a teammate. And it has come together beautifully. Hakan Bey, my last question to you. Now, I will ask openly. I asked you a similar question before in one of our programs, and it came true. By the way, two years ago, I asked about artificial intelligence. Something like 'what is the technology of the future,' which we didn't talk about as much back then. Now we understand. So, trusting your predictions, I am asking. Do you think a world-class unicorn will emerge from Turkey in the biomedical, health, biotechnology field? What is the probability of it emerging?
Yes. Let me put it this way. I will answer that question last, but firstly, I sincerely believe this. If you are dealing with an important problem, if your dream is big, a lifetime may not be enough to solve that problem. So, what Professor said, I had said this at the signing ceremony of this protocol at his university. In the speech I made there, I said, 'We are marathon runners.' So, we signed for a 10-year program. We have a partnership. But this 10 years can be extended. It can outlive us. But if the path you take and the ideal are right, as Professor described, several lifetimes can combine to reach this problem again. But starting this, taking the first step on this path, and opening that way is very valuable. That's why, the risks of failure that Professor mentioned, in your comment, create the comfort zone that İş Bankası provides to the Professor. Because we are not expecting a success. We already accept that the project itself, working on this path, is a success. If there is financial success, we will be very happy, but if not, the budget we allocated is clear, what it is is clear. We are trying this with a budget that we think is reasonable for such a study. So, for us, the subject is clear. Will a unicorn emerge? As for the subject, why not? Because here, we are not limited only to Turkey's resources. We are also using America's resources. Professor Gökhan's presence, his laboratory's presence, the presence of students from all over the world working in that laboratory, the work from past years. Also, when we came to this initiative, this model, I did something else. I listened to Professor Gökhan, but I also did an academic literature review. What studies are being done on this molecule in the world, what is happening? In every article I saw, I saw that Professor Gökhan was referenced. So, this work is currently attracting interest in many parts of the world. Many laboratories are working on this subject, but Professor Gökhan is at the center of all of them. Therefore, if a unicorn emerges in the field we mentioned, the probability of it coming from Turkey is the highest right now. I can say that. I hope it emerges. We believe it will emerge. So, we are acting with that belief. With that energy, astrologers will interpret the alignment of these stars. I hope they will tell us whether it will emerge, and if it will, when it will emerge.
We are also waiting with excitement. Dear Professor, my last question to you. I personally know that you have very beautiful dreams about Turkey. If you could talk a little about these dreams and share them with our viewers.
Of course, if we start from the furthest point, I never lose my optimism about Turkey, about its future potential. When you come here and meet the young generations, the students in school, the assistants and doctors we work with, there is an inexhaustible creative capacity here. And it always happens. It happens when the country's economic situation is good, and it happens when it's bad. Regardless of the conditions, there is a river of creativity flowing in this geography. If we can channel that water into the right path, if we can use the energy of that water productively, I believe much greater things can come out of here. And I see that as the most important thing for the survival of our country, our Republic. Now, one of the most important things that will determine the prosperity and development of this country is the emergence of more science and technology-based industries from here, their transformation into more value, their transformation into more benefit for humanity, and their transformation into more contribution for the country. And for that, of course, what a person or an institution can do alone is very limited, but if we can plant a seed, for a group of people at least, to create an environment where they can turn this wheel in a certain field, for example, is one of my biggest dreams. I have been thinking for years how it can be done? How can such an obstacle be overcome? Can we provide different versions of the platform we are talking about here to the values here? So that they can follow their ideas for a long time, that they can be a bit Dionysian, but the structure we have built will provide them with Apollonian characteristics, so that while dreaming without completely going off the path, a disciplined, perfected system will support them, open to everyone, and the current academic world, which I don't just see as the national academic world. Globally, the academic world faces a very tough process ahead. In the next 50 years, and this might be corrected with reforms, but in my opinion, a very significant portion of universities will not be able to implement these reforms. Therefore, new structures are needed. We need to imagine new structures, build them, and make them sustainable. If time permits, to plant a seed of that, to provide the opportunity to start more such projects here. For myself, I also want to live in my own country a bit. When you ask about my dream, these are among the things that make me happy.
