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Hey, I'm Cramer. Welcome to Mad Money. Welcome to Cramerica. Other people make friends. I'm just trying to make you a little extra money here. My job is not just to entertain, but to teach you. So call me at 1-800-743-CBC or tweet me at @JimCramer. At last, a quiet week. Even if we didn't gain any ground, I'll take it. Some called it a waste of cab fare and five clean shirts. Could I love that line? I couldn't agree more. And the volatile close out with the Dow ultimately dipping 95 points, just barely advancing 0.17%, and the NASDAQ rising 0.39%, left us thinking good. Only 12 more days of the hardest month of the year. Then again, next week maybe more of the same. Only a few big companies important. There's one incredibly important and I think positive analyst meeting that I'm going to cover in a moment. Me, I used the tranquility as an opportunity to go see the exciting new phone launch at the Apple store in the basement of the old GM building today, Midtown. And I was wowed by the iPhone 18, mostly because the bane of my existence, dimming battery life. Get this. This new phone gets something like 36 hours per charge before it runs out of juice.
The pictures are incredible to me at least. They look like they're professional grade. But I had to chat to that stupid word aperture that I see all the time because it's one of those terms like misalign. It wasn't really me. If I were a photographer, if I was an aficionado, I'd be dying for this phone. I bought it for the battery life, frankly, because I'm tired of living in fear that my phone's about to die just when the Eagles score a touchdown and I can't boast an eagle on X.
I live for small things. While I was at the store, I pulled up with Apple CEO John Turners and CFO Kevin Parrick to take the temperature of the event. They were confident and excited. But what basically a double launch: first this phone, and then a month from now the Duo comes out, and that's the big foldable phone. That's huge. I think the 18 is metal, but the Duo is revolutionary and it could become indispensable for all of you who are watching. I got to play with the Duo yesterday. It was kind of astounding. I mean, first it may be foldable, but there's no crease. I mean, none. I mean, you can't tell. You can't tell it is in one part. That matters because I think if you looked like it was two pieces, it would not be as graceful, Elliot, and it would certainly be distracting. The screen, gorgeous. The resolution better than anything I've ever seen. Oh, and those of us who don't like our Kindles because we like turning pages, it's got a page-like screen that lets you do it like a hardback.
It's so impressive. I told both Parrick and Turners that I intend to buy the Duo as a second phone. That's right, two phones, because I can't imagine it ever being off when I'm working or when I'm traveling, and I don't want to hop off to take a phone call. In fact, when we get Starlink on an airplane, I say I bet you'll be able to watch anything perfectly on this pocket screen that unfolds into a very exciting mini television. I have missed so many Super Bowls, so many game sevens that this device may be the end of the tyranny of Wi-Fi.
It was odd when I mentioned buying a second phone. Neither men seemed surprised at all. Probably because the reviews for the Duo are said to be among the best in Apple's history. Of course, they couldn't assure availability. So I duly noted that I should pre-order the Duo on October 16th. I don't want to wait until October 23rd, the availability date, because who knows if they even have availability at the time. High quality problem though. I know the cost is high, but I have a 17 Pro Max and I have a chance to sell when I priced it out. It might go for 800 bucks. That's not so bad. If I switch to T-Mobile, which is my orientation, I can get an even better deal. It drives me crazy when I hear all these Wall Street analysts talking about how Apple's new phones are too expensive because of rising DRAM prices. Sure, they're too expensive if you're paying full price, bozo, but who pays full price? Do some work. These things are heavily subsidized by the wireless carriers because they're all commodities anyway. CEO Turners is continuing the Apple tradition of having the products speak for themselves, which I think is a pretty good idea. I mean, after all, when you turn the cards over, you don't have to explain that a king beats a queen, right? I mean, plus, I'm a kid in a candy store, a Hershey bar, or even an M&M bag when I go to these events. For those of us who live 24/7 on our Apple device, there's nothing more fun than discussing the new designs with Apple exec Greg Joswiak, whom we all know as Jaws. I always talk to him. He's always there. He's fantastic. He's got so many great ideas. I talk about Wonderman per share. And that's my evergreen joke. He always laughs. These products in general, I don't think I've ever seen Jaws more excited about an Apple product than the Duo, though. I don't blame him. I haven't been this excited about an Apple launch since maybe the original iPhone reveal.
And that's what I have to say about Apple. Now, let's take a look at the game plan for next week. Like I mentioned before, there's not much on the horizon. It looks boring, but we got an action-packed... You ever hear like they say it's a jam-packed day? Like right around like 12 minutes into most shows, it's jam-packed day. I don't say that because sometimes it's jam-packed and sometimes it isn't. Let's start with the most consequential. On Wednesday, we have an Okta analyst. Okay, this is it. Of all the cos I had on the show this past week in Silicon Valley, Okta's Todd McKinnon may have been the most enlightening in his own soft, sweet way actually. He calmly explained that his company's specialty, identity verification, extends to AI agents. Those little gremlins, the ants, the bots, whatever you call them. He was quite confident he could stop any of these attacks we've been hearing about because he knows the identity of each agent. They do have identities. And once you have the identity, he knows their whereabouts. It wouldn't matter if it was a swarm or a handful. The agents, they'd be stopped. It got me thinking, how is it possible we have all these real smart people at these AI companies and they got us all worried about a practical cyber solution? Why don't they like talk to the cyber security guys? I bet we hear a lot about that on Wednesday. I would do that if I were them. We've got some earnings of consequence too. On Tuesday, KB Homes reports. I think it's going to be one more lousy number from a home builder because how are they supposed to do it? Well, when like the Fed's raising rates, I mean, bane of their existence. Mine's battery life. Theirs is like, I don't know, not selling homes. Okay. Basically the same thing we heard from Lennar this week. We probably hear from KB Wednesday. Besides the Okta meeting, we have reports from two companies that are very important to small and medium-sized businesses. Cintas, and they do uniforms and paychecks. Now actually I shouldn't say do more than uniforms at Cintas. They've got a lot of other things, but it's a pretty good business. Paychex handles payroll processing and human resources. Both are coming in earnings with a full head of steam. Makes sense. That segment of the economy remains the hottest and historically won't be hurt by that first rate hike. General Mills reports too. One thing I never thought I'd see was a 6.72% dividend yield for this very consistent company. But input costs, GOP test-1, processed food are all taking their toll on the stock, which is how a deal gets so high. What a red flag. I can't recommend it. Thursday, we get results from Darden. Okay. What's that about? That's Olive Garden. But anyway, Darden's the parent of Olive Garden. And Olive Garden is a gold mine. That said, call me a Brinker guy because it's three for me. I like them. They have a smaller, stronger game plan. By the way, that $11 special is very good. Finally is Costco. Reports after the bell on Thursday. Stock's acting poorly and it's a club name and it has not been a good club name. They're having problems getting younger people to re-sign up for membership. The issue: younger people are more likely to shop online at home. They don't really have big houses and it's the in-store experience that makes Costco so apart from others and what great samples you don't eat before you go to a Costco. Remember September is the coolest month. It's been okay, not great. Jam-packed so far, but the good news today is that we are finally oversold. Yes, officially minus 5.66 and we may be due for a bounce. But the bottom line, unless the president does something extreme out of peak with Iran, here's hoping we'll have a relatively sedate couple of weeks and get out of this month without it turning into the House of...
Jason in Pennsylvania. Jason.
Jim, good afternoon. I'm a first-time caller, longtime listener. I appreciate everything you do for the individual investor.
Oh, thank you, Jason. I appreciate that.
In 2014, I bought a position in Micron Technology. I haven't touched it since. 12 years later, and with the AI boom, that value of my position has increased dramatically. I don't need the money right now, and I don't want to pay the tax man. But I know what you say about pigs getting slaughtered. Micron reports at the end of the month, the stock crossed $1,000 today, but is still 25% off its all-time high. Do you think that it's time to ring the register on Micron?
No, Jason, I don't. I don't. You're not being this one sale. And the reason I say is it sells at 13 times earnings, maybe six times next year's earnings. I care about PE multiples and this is one incredibly cheap stock, which is why we have a giant position for it for the charitable trust. All right, listen to me. September can be a rough, really rough for the market. So, here's hoping we have a date couple of weeks coming up. Wouldn't that be great? On Mad Money tonight, jam-packed. Robinhood has captured the young investor, but what is it doing to keep them engaged throughout their lives? I'm learning more from the co. Then is it time to get bearish on copper? I'm going off the charts on this non-precious metal that's integral to the economy. And then Siemens is at the forefront of the industrial AI movement. I'm finding out more from the company's top brass. So stay with Cramer.
Don't miss a second of Mad Money. Follow Jim Cramer on X. Have a question? Tweet Cramer #madmentions. Send Jim an email to
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All right. What do you make of the stock of Robinhood Markets? The online brokerage platform of choice for younger investors with a stock that's kind of joined at the hip with Bitcoin. It shot up over 9% today thanks to Bitcoin rally and up nearly 90% from its March lows, but it's still not back up to where it was trading in its highs in January. Still, there's a lot going on at Robinhood. Earlier this week when I was out in Silicon Valley, I got to speak with Vlad Tenev, the co-founder and chairman and CEO of Robinhood Markets at their headquarters in Menlo Park. Take a look.
Vlad, it's been a remarkable time. You have kind of captured what people want in different instruments. You're bringing them all. I wanted to ask you how much of what you do is literally because people want it as opposed to necessarily what you guys sit back in a room and offer.
I think that it's a good mix of both. I think there's a lot of things where, you know, obviously our customers are asking us for more trading assets, international stocks and things of that nature and we have an endless road map from customers. But there's also things where we have an opinion and a point of view and really nobody's asking us for that specific thing. But we think that's where the industry is going to go, that we believe we can build bigger, better products. So for example, when you look at tokenization and prediction markets, that was just, you know, we had a view of what we wanted the product to be and we built that. There is one, you know, Robinhood is working on a lot of stuff.
Right, we just as we were talking went through a long list of different products: credit cards, Trump accounts, tokenization.
You know, US equities, and the way I think about it is there's really one idea that's core to everything, and that's ownership. We believe that ownership is essential not just because if people are owners they have skin in the game, they can benefit financially, but also a society where more people own high-quality financial assets is inherently a more stable society. And that's kind of underlying everything that we do.
But how do you be sure that there isn't too much gambling? I know that you and I have talked over the multiple years. We don't want to encourage gambling. We can't stop it. We want to encourage investing. At what point do you say maybe some of these instruments aren't right for our people?
Yeah, and that's a question that we think about a lot. The thing is ownership doesn't work without healthy markets and markets don't work without traders. So, you need traders. Robinhood doesn't work without traders either. If you think about active traders as a part of our business, it's really the engine room and the foundation of our business. So the products that we build to serve traders allow us to acquire customers and get them into products that, you know, are perhaps a little bit less sexy but long-term more important. I'll give you an example. There's actually one product that we incentivize at Robinhood. You probably wouldn't guess what it was.
We incentivize retirement. So, if you open up a retirement account at Robinhood and you're a gold member, you get a 3% contribution match, which means every $100 you contribute, we match out of our corporate balance sheet 3%. And, you know, our view in that was a lot of people now have gone away from the traditional lifelong employment model where you're working at a company, you know, from 18 years old to retirement, and so people are moving around, the accounts are much more portable and...
There's less reliance on the conventional 401k.
Right. So we wanted to build a product for that and that's what we incentivize. But what we've also found is that, you know, retirement ads aren't the best at pulling people in. So, we actually get customers from a wide variety of different means, including prediction markets, stock trading, crypto, and once they come into Robinhood, we've actually seen that at relatively high rates, they're adopting all of our products and opening up retirement accounts and building a comprehensive financial relationship.
Well, I tell you, it's so good you mentioned because every time I say, 'Okay, they're doing too much. I think it's too close prediction. Maybe too much gambling.' I then look at a credit card that you do 3% that's better than so many credit cards. I look at what you're doing retirement. I said, 'Well, yeah, that's pretty good.' What? So this is why I start with this because I think you are in touch with the zeitgeist of all the people, more people than any other firm who are going to get the trillions of dollars from the generational handoff of baby boom to people who are in Gen Z. And that you have what they want although they aren't even sure necessarily what they want. You offered the vast panoply and the other guys don't, which is what I'm leading to is why you're so darn successful.
Well, we appreciate that. I think there's a lot more to do. I think that we look at all the products that we could offer that we are offering. I still think there's a lot more to do. I mean, you mentioned it yourself, over a hundred trillion in wealth is passing from older generations to younger, and, you know, when we look at what that means, that's an accelerating and very large asset transfer over the next several decades. And, you know, these customers, their needs evolve. So they start out with relatively simple needs like, you know, they want a place to buy stocks. Maybe they'll have an IRA. Over time, they'll get more complex. They start asking for trusts, which we now offer different types of trusts. They want estate planning. They want private wealth management, private banking. And our challenge, and I think this is like an exciting one for me personally, is how can we offer these high-net-worth quality products to the mass market at very low prices. And I think that's an exciting challenge for me because as an engineer and a technologist you can actually push pretty hard by using technology. It used to be that you had to go into a building with big columns and talk to expensive people wearing suits in order to get some of these services. They wouldn't even talk to you if you have less than, you know, $250,000 with their institution. And, you know, with technology, we can make the front door much bigger and open it up to tens of millions.
But how do you know? I mean, I've always felt that you were democratizing finance, which is when we first had you on long before you actually just when you were an app, we had you on. You were definitely about democratizing finance or manufacturing more things to trade, which I don't know whether you, I think is actually a good thing.
We try really hard not to push our customers in one direction or another. I mean, if there's anything we do incentivize, it's retirement with the 3% match. That said, we recognize also people trade things. And it's not even two different groups of people. It's not like you have the traders and, you know, the safety seekers inside every person, inside most people. There's a part of you that wants safety, wants security and wants to make sure your financial future is secure. Right? Then there's another part that does have a point of view and, you know, wants to take a portion of your portfolio and put it in different trades. I know I'm the...
I say, you know, I say one-tenth should go, one-tenth should be because I want people to be in, but they want to speculate. I call it speculation. I think everyone has a right to speculate.
Yeah. It's a very human thing, you know, inside every human. There's sort of like a risk-taking part and also a safety-seeking part. And I think that does intersect in your financial life.
Well, that's why it's all under one roof, which is good. I mean, I know that, but someone, they're going to do, people are going to be in prediction markets. I'd rather have it be in a place where it's, you know, a known place. I don't want to be in some outfit no one's ever heard of. You have the potential for the ultimate killer app that has everything.
Yeah, that's right. And I think that all of these assets I think are very, very useful. I mean, if you look at prediction markets and how that ties into ownership, you can directly with prediction markets monetize an idea or an insight. So, if you have a particular view on crypto market structure legislation, the Clarity Act, we have a market on that. If you have a view on Fed rates, well, you can trade the Fed rate rather than, you know, trading futures or other products that are tied to it. And there's going to be a huge increase in the types of contracts that people trade. Like we're at the very beginning. We're already seeing some diversification. A lot of people look at it and say, 'Well, this is just sports. It's all sports.' But we're already seeing other categories like crypto taking a disproportionate share. And I think within a few years, sports will actually be in the minority. Similar to active trading at large, sports has been a great tool to bring people in, get liquidity, get interest, establish. It's sort of like a wedge. But I think the industry is also expanding far beyond sports.
I do want to come out here just one last thing. How are the Trump accounts doing? Because we feel passionately about those on the show and we know that you're one of the key, well, I bet you have more money under the Trump accounts than any other firm.
Well, so currently we're the sole broker and initial trustee of the Trump accounts in partnership with BNY, who's a financial agent, and of course US Treasury and the administration. So this has been a, we talk about ownership being the one idea that Robinhood's founded on. No better way to make that a reality than to start at birth from age zero. You teach the kids about compound interest. You create a connection with the great companies of this country and we do it at very, very low cost. So the program's been extraordinarily effective. 7 million signed up pre-launch and just last week we've seen Michael Dell, who kickstarted this thing with a massive donation from his foundation, his funds have started rolling out to the children. And what we've seen is more and more things are being built. We're going to have a big employer program. So employers will be able to manage the Trump accounts contributions to their employees and we're building that out. Donors, it started with Michael Dell, but there's also Gwynne Shotwell, Brad Gerstner, so many others.
I think this could be the best philanthropic platform out there.
Well, we may have to leave it at that. There are many more things to talk about.
We do have to run though. But I want to thank you, Vlad, for you turn on a lot of people to finance and in many different ways. If you get them in only to save and you get them to retire with retirement and you get them to be able to earn a little more on a credit card, I think that's a great success and through tokenization do it all over the world.
Okay, that's Vlad Tenev, chairman, president, CEO of Robinhood. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.
Coming up, copper has been pushing for record highs, but it may not last for long. Cramer's got the charts to prove it next.
Lately, the price of copper has been hanging around within spitting distance of multi-year highs. Normally, that's a sign of strength for the economy because you need a lot of copper for any kind of construction, including the data center. But sometimes the price can get so high that it becomes self-defeating. Have we reached that point? Now, tonight we're going off the charts with Larry Williams, that legendary technician and market historian who's been the best in the business since before I learned how to drive because he's got an answer to this question. It's fascinating. Remember, Larry's had a truly incredible track record with us in recent years. He called the copper bottom in April 2020, one of the greatest calls ever. Everyone else still thought the economy was collapsing. Five months ago, he told us to steer clear of gold before it got slammed in May and June. And now he says that copper's entered a vulnerable phase of extreme overvaluation. Lately, commercial hedgers have been selling copper futures like crazy while both large and small investors have accumulated enormous net long positions. As Larry sees it, this is a case where the public versus the professionals is all about the, it's the most important thing you need to know. And the professionals are the commercial hedgers and he always wants to go with the pros, the commercial hedgers. What's the issue here? For starters, the hyperscalers have started replacing copper with fiber optic cable, which is both faster and cheaper to use. On top of that, once the Federal Reserve starts raising interest rates, it eventually tends to have a pretty negative impact on commodity prices. Although that can take some time to play out, as will the copper being pulled out of the data center slow. At the end of August, we heard from another chartist, Bob Lang, who was very bullish on copper, but that was before the Fed got serious about stamping out inflation. It was also before OpenAI and Anthropic started talking about the need for an AI slowdown pacing. We're in a very different world now. At the same time, the charts, well, they don't look pretty. First, check out this weekly chart of copper with Larry's valuation model down at the bottom in black. Okay, the model shows you the valuation of copper versus the dollar index. Whenever it reaches overvalued levels where the black valuation line goes above the red one right here, it tends to trigger a selloff in the underlying metal. We've seen this over and over and over again in the last couple years. Some of these declines were a lot more extreme than others. But either way, this indicator reaching overvalued levels has been a pretty darn bad sign. Whoa. Then there's the issue of who's buying copper descended up to these levels. Take a look at this weekly chart of the copper futures. Okay, now this is important. This CFTC's Commitment of Traders data is down at the bottom. That's the COT report. Okay, this is a survey that shows you how large speculators, small speculators, and commercial hedgers position given commodity. Large speculators are professional money managers, small speculators are home gamers maybe like you. And commercial hedgers are businesses that actually deal in copper either as producer or consumer. Larry likes to bet with the commercial hedgers, okay? Because they're the ones who best understand the industry. They're in it every day. At the same time, he's very skeptical of the largest speculator, especially when the positions start getting extreme. When you look at the bottom, you can see two lines. Black shows open interest. Okay, the meaning the total market action the copper futures. The blue line shows small speculators generally the least informed. Lately, small speculators have become heavy, heavy buyers of copper to the point where it's driven up the open interest substantially. But the last couple times we saw small speculators get very bullish on copper, well, it led to some serious declines. Now, let's take a broader view. This next chart shows you copper versus the Commitment of Traders data for all three groups. Okay, commercial hedgers are in red, speculators are in green, and large speculators are in blue. Larry points out that both kinds of speculators have large net long positions in copper, but the commercial hedgers, uh-uh. See, they've been the largest net short position in years. Oh boy, is this important. Who's left to buy? Larry thinks the bull speculators have exhausted themselves and the commercial hedgers aren't going to turn positive with copper prices at their highest level in years. The commercials are betting that those prices will come down. And historically, Larry says they have a better track record than either kind of speculator. So, this is another sign that copper could be approaching its peak. What else is going on here? Okay, Larry always looking for patterns that repeat themselves. Okay, now get this. Take a look at this weekly chart of copper. Okay, it's Williams trading cycles at the past action here. He's detected a dominant cycle that repeats itself every 300 days. We saw it in 2024. We saw it in 2025. And it fits the action surprisingly well. Most of the major moves coincide with peaks or troughs in the cycle forecast. So what does the cycle tell us at this present moment? I want you to check out the recent chart with a cycle forecast projected into the future. As of right now, copper's at a high point in the cycle, which is about to turn very negative. Given Larry's track record, I would not come in here and start buying this right now. This is where it is. Okay? When it gets up to this height, you sell it. Okay? Gets up to this height, you sell it. Right here, we're at the worst possible level to buy. And everybody's so bullish on copper. How about if we drill down on copper's daily chart? All right. This past week, the red metal completed one of Larry's most reliable patterns as copper broke out of a trading range with a new high close, then immediately broke to the downside. Right now, Larry wants to wait for one last short-term rally in the hope that copper goes to overbought levels because up there he thinks shorting it would be like shooting fish in a barrel. Here's the bottom line. The charts interpreted by Larry Williams suggest that copper prices are poised to roll over. Given that the Fed's now in tightening mode, I think that makes a lot of sense. When the Fed is no longer a friend, the path of least resistance for copper is lower. Those were some of the most damning charts I've ever seen. If I were in copper and I saw that, or by the way FCX or Southern, I guess I'd sell it on Monday. Money's back after the break.
Coming up, Cramer sitting down with the CEO of Siemens to learn more about how the company is benefiting from the rise of AI. Next.
When I was at Salesforce's annual Dreamforce conference, I got the chance to catch up with Siemens, the German industrial powerhouse, biggest industrial in Europe. Lately, Siemens has been benefiting from the great data center buildout. Lots of orders for electrification and climate control products and their industrial automation business. It's on fire. I got to dig deep with Dr. Roland Busch, the president and CEO of Siemens. Take a look.
Dr. Busch, welcome to Mad Money.
Thanks for having me. Thanks for having me.
