Thank you, Honorable Presidents, Honorable Deputies and Senators. Good afternoon to all. Thank you, President Gusmeroli, for what you said, and thank you, President De Carlo, for the opportunity to be heard by both branches of Parliament for a discussion on the situation of the automotive sector in Italy and Europe, and for the opportunity to directly illustrate our commitment, our commitment of Stellantis in our country. With me are my colleagues Gianfilippo Imparato, responsible for the Europe Region, Antonella Bruno, who leads our commercial activities in Italy, Santo Ficili, CEO of Alfa Romeo and Maserati, and Monica Genovese, responsible for purchasing, the entire Powertrain part. When I received the invitation from President Gusmeroli, I confirmed my availability for the discussion, but in the necessary respect of the path traced by Parliament itself. In particular, the Chamber of Deputies, through the two motions approved on October 16, 2024, had committed the government to concluding the dialogue table with Stellantis and other components of the automotive supply chain by the end of the year. The table promoted by the Ministry of Enterprises and Made in Italy (MIMIT) actually reached its conclusive synthesis last December 17, in the presence of Minister Calderone, Minister Giorgetti, and Minister Urso, as well as the governors of the regions where our plants are located, the trade unions, ANFIA, and some of my colleagues mentioned. And based on the conclusion of this process, which we established with President Gusmeroli, today's hearing was set. I am intervening in this capacity as the person responsible for the operational management of Stellantis, a role I received from the Board of Directors last December 2, 2024, following the resignation of Carlos Tavares, whose succession is proceeding according to the established timelines, and the new CEO of Stellantis will be announced, as we have indicated, within the first half of this year. We have prepared for today's hearing with great attention because for us, Italy plays a central role. Last July 11, we celebrated 125 years of activity at the Lingotto in Turin, an exceptional milestone for a startup born in 1899. As President Gusmeroli recalled, since then we have developed, facing the challenges of the times without forgetting our roots, but always keeping our gaze focused on the future. Italy for Fiat and Fiat for Italy have represented and still mean a great deal: industry, work, development, but also solidarity, culture, responsibility, and social progress. Of this long history of ours, the history of Fiat which has now become Stellantis, we are, I am personally, very proud. It is not a given, considering that less than 1% of companies founded at the beginning of the 1900s are still alive. And if in a moment I will talk to you about investments, new models, and advanced technologies, it means that this strength, this will to progress, and the courage to look to the future are always present. As requested by the subject of today's hearing, I will dedicate particular attention to Italy. I will do so by embracing the last 20 years of our history, the ones I have lived personally, and above all, I will share current and future prospects without neglecting the broader context and the historical moment in which we operate. I will structure my report in three parts: the first, in which I will highlight the positive contribution that an industrial group like Fiat, FCA, now Stellantis, has brought to our country; the second, in which I will illustrate the actions announced last December 17, reiterating and confirming the points of the MIMIT table; and the third, in which I will share the perspective of the automotive sector not only in Italy but also in Europe and the world.
First part. I began to hold positions of responsibility at Fiat in 2004 as Vice President. I had joined the Board of Directors in 1997. I remember well what the situation was in those years and especially the fight to ensure our survival, the survival of Fiat. In 2003, when my grandfather Gianni Agnelli passed away, Fiat had a turnover of 20 billion euros and was losing two. With its four brands, it sold 1.7 million vehicles, of which almost half in Italy, and was outside the top 10 of global manufacturers. Many spoke in 2004 of Fiat as a company that was finished, bankrupt, to be nationalized. Despite the dramatic situation, my family took on the responsibility of defending the company and those who worked there, investing new resources and laying the foundations for the relaunch. Thanks to the work of so many people at Fiat and with Sergio Marchionne, we managed to heal the company and above all give it a leading role in the global automotive landscape. In the most difficult moments of recent history that we have gone through, such as the international financial crisis of 2008 and the pandemic crisis of COVID in 2020, Fiat became larger, obtaining those economies of scale that have always been the goal of car manufacturers to survive. The two epochal consolidation operations we carried out not only allowed us to survive but above all to open new perspectives, first with Chrysler and then with PSA, which led to the creation of Stellantis. Today, Stellantis is the fourth manufacturer in the world, is profitable, and has a turnover of 157 billion. With our 14 brands, we sell 5.5 million vehicles, of which less than half in Europe. Twenty years ago, we were fighting for survival; today, we are among the leading manufacturers in the world. Italy and the Italians have great merit in this extraordinary development path, and our gratitude goes to the entire country. But one is often asked: what benefits does Italy get from Stellantis? If Stellantis did not exist today, we would not be here because the Italian car would have already disappeared long ago, like computing after Olivetti or chemicals after Montedison. In the last 20 years, the domestic market has fallen by 30%, while employment has been reduced by about 20%. This means that the company has defended the production and employment of the country's plants thanks to the export of Italian brands. In addition to the Jeeps produced in Basilicata, the Dodge in Campania, the Citroen, Opel, and Peugeot vans in Abruzzo, and more recently the DS in Melfi, we wanted to quantify the contribution given by the company to the country by asking the Luiss Guido Carli University to carry out an independent study on the group's history from 2004 to 2023, as we do not yet have the data for 2024. These are the years I have lived through personally. What emerges is that the positive contribution to the growth of the Italian economy has never diminished. The study will be presented publicly in the coming weeks, and you will be able to read an excerpt that will be made available today. From 2004 to 2023, Stellantis produced 16.7 million cars and commercial vehicles in Italy, for a total production value of almost 700 billion euros. Calculating the effects on the supply chain and the repercussions on family consumption, the total value of production in Italy over the last 20 years rises to 1,700 billion euros, with a value added of 417 billion. For every euro of value created by Stellantis, nine are generated in the rest of the Italian economy. An even more important fact, if one considers the contribution that our industrial hubs have given and continue to give to the country. In these 20 years, 38.9 billion in wages have been paid, net of social contributions. Regarding the use of the Cassa Integrazione (wage guarantee fund), the cumulative balance between what the company has paid and what workers have received is negative by 0.6 billion. It must be remembered that these resources do not go to the company but to those who work and their families. Without this unique tool in Italy, many jobs would have been lost, as has happened in other countries where we operate. Not only in these 20 years, the company has paid 14 billion directly to the treasury. If we also consider the revenue from VAT and taxes paid on behalf of employees, this value rises to 32.2 billion. The expenditure for investments and R&D in Italy, what we have invested in Italy in these 20 years, has been equal to 53 billion, compared to public contributions of 1 billion, a ratio of 50 to 1. I would like to add a very important piece of data: in 2024, Stellantis was the group that filed the most industrial patents in Italy. Each patent is not just a number but a step forward in the country's technological innovation. This heritage of ideas and solutions strengthens the competitiveness of Italian industry, creates opportunities for our supply chain, and helps keep our knowledge at the forefront in a sector undergoing profound transformation. These data tell us that Italy and Fiat, today Stellantis, have grown together.
The positive impact of the company has not only concerned the economic aspect but also the social one. Let's take the field of training, an area in which we have always been committed, since the times of the founder, Senator Giovanni Agnelli. Many remember the Fiat apprentice schools, which were a fundamental resource for the spread of knowledge related to mechanics and manufacturing in Italy. We still continue to commit to education, collaborating with schools, technical institutes, and universities, as demonstrated, for example, by the agreement with the Polytechnic of Turin, started in 1999 on the occasion of our Centenary and since then renewed and expanded several times. Just in these days, speaking with the trade unions, the importance of what we do in training is reiterated by them as essential to continue building together. It is precisely the importance we attribute to education that also extends beyond the company's borders, creating benefits for society as a whole. I will cite two initiatives above all: the HOPE project, carried out with CERN, the world's largest research center on particles, and with the National Institute of Nuclear Physics. The project has so far involved 40,000 middle school students with the aim of introducing them to physics. I also want to mention the project we are carrying out in collaboration with the Salesians. The initiative focuses on the transition to adult life for people with disabilities, starting with work. These are just a few examples of the activities we carry out in the field of education. The theme is particularly dear to me and my family, so much so that we have dedicated the exclusive commitment of the Agnelli Foundation to it, carrying out concrete projects and research activities to support Italian public schools at all levels, from kindergarten to university. I hope that from today and with today, the balance sheet of give and take between the country and the company is no longer a divisive theme but an opportunity to continue this virtuous path together, which has lasted for more than 125 years, proudly with Italy. I would now like to move on to the second part. Jean-Philippe, with our colleagues, last December 17 at MIMIT, described our commitment in Italy, referring to the Italian plants. On that occasion, we reiterated and confirmed the centrality of our country, Italy, in which for the current year we are spending about 2 billion euros in investments and 6 billion euros in purchases from Italian suppliers. Since its birth in January 2021, Stellantis has purchased services and components from the Italian automotive supply chain for a value of 24 billion euros, which will become 30 by the end of 2025. These resources spent in Italy demonstrate the importance of the bond with the Italian supply chain, represented by the wide supply chain that is an excellence that has accompanied us in the world and has grown together with us. Monica, who is here, is organizing with her purchasing colleagues, right here in Turin in early April, a meeting with all our Italian and European suppliers to discuss the opportunities to continue working together. At the Stellantis table, we made commitments to all actors in the automotive sector, and we are fulfilling these commitments punctually. I would like to dwell on one of the cornerstones and would ask if the slide is available. Thank you. We have tried to work and have invested in these multi-energy platforms. These multi-energy platforms allow us to make cars with all the different technologies, from thermal engines to hybrid and electric. On these platforms, which are the skeleton, the framework of a car, we have the possibility of adding the components. And the great flexibility we have managed to achieve is that on these various platforms we can make different models of different brands. This great flexibility, which allows us to cover a wider market and also more varied customer demands, is one of the great strengths we believe we have and that we have dedicated to Italy. And now I will go into the details of what we want to do in Italy, but before doing so, if you look at the STLA Medium, for example, which we have in Melfi, on that platform we will make seven different products. Of these seven different products, we will make them with three brands: the Jeep brand, the DS brand, and the Lancia brand. And of the seven products, five will be with non-Italian brands, produced in Basilicata, and of these products, we will also have versions that are both fully electric and hybrid. Perhaps I spoke too much as an engineer. Now let's get into what is concrete in our work that we are carrying out here in Italy. The second slide gives you an idea, it shows you visually what our activity is in Italy from north to south. Let's start from Pomigliano. We wanted to extend the current production of the Panda Hybrid, which we affectionately call the 'Pandina', which will be followed by the new generation of the same model. We are proud to remember that this year, in January and February 2025, the Pandina was chosen by over 25,400 customers and has a market share of 10%, which is higher than any brand in Italy. This demonstrates not only the affection that Italians have for the Pandina but also the great commercial capacity of Antonella and her team, whom I would like to thank. Also in the Giambattista Vico plant, I remind you that the Giambattista Vico plant was born when we decided to bring the Panda from Poland to Italy, and on that occasion, a great investment was made to equip our plant with the most cutting-edge technologies, and there we would like to install the new STLA Small platform, thanks to which the production of two compact models is planned starting from 2028. In Melfi, as I reminded you, we have the STLA Medium platform. This year we are launching the DS No. 8, we are preparing the Jeep Compass, both electric and hybrid, and in the Lucano plant, in 2026, the new Lancia range and the new DS No. 7 will also come out. In Cassino, where we are installing the STLA Large platform, in addition to the current production of the Maserati Grecale and the Alfa Romeo Stelvio, the new generations of the Alfa Romeo Stelvio, which we will present at the end of this year, and the Giulia in 2026 will be produced. As for Mirafiori, its future does not only include the production of the current Fiat 500 electric, which was what we had hypothesized when we moved the 500 from Poland to Italy, to Turin. We were with Gianfilippo and colleagues, with the bishop of our city, visiting Mirafiori, and he was able to see how much desire there is for this product, which is being transformed, and we are working on the new 500 Hybrid, and everyone is putting in an enormous commitment so that the start of production can take place this November. The 500 Hybrid will ensure an increase in production volumes in line with market demands for this type of segment, and as I told you before, we saw this with the Panda Hybrid, and Antonella and colleagues can't wait to have the 500 for our customers. Also in Mirafiori, an important production site not only for the most iconic Fiat car, the 500, but also for electrified gearboxes, with an installed production capacity of 600,000 units, which today allows us to equip all the hybrid engines of the many models produced in our plants in Europe. This means that from Mirafiori we send gearboxes, for example, to Germany, to Russelsheim for Opel, to France, to Sochaux for Peugeot, or to Spain, to Zaragoza, where we produce both Peugeot and Opel. We are moving forward with this technology, and if one looks at the next generation, we are talking about emissions under 100 grams of CO2 per km, or a 20% reduction compared to today's hybrid engines. Regarding gearbox production, we have started work for the installation of a production line in the Termoli plant in Molise for current and future hybrid cars. As you know, Stellantis is a minority shareholder in ACC, a company that produces batteries and is evaluating the construction of a gigafactory in Termoli, based on the market and various factors. While waiting for ACC to make its plan known, we have moved in advance, complementing the production of thermal engines with gearboxes for hybrid cars. A special mention goes to the Atessa plant in Abruzzo. It was the first partnership started with the PSA Group back in 1981, the seed of what is today the Stellantis group. In these over 40 years, we have produced 7.5 million vehicles, and it represents one of the group's world-class excellences. Today, the Abruzzo site produces the entire range of large commercial vehicles for the Fiat, Peugeot, Opel, and Citroen brands. We export to 75 countries, over 80% of our production. Just to give you an idea of the complexity that our colleagues have to manage, we have more or less 600,000 different types of commercial vehicles, one of whose very important applications is, for example, campers. We are the market leader in Europe in campers, 60% of the market, and we have consecutively won in Germany, which is the largest and most difficult market, with the Ducato, the best camper of the year. So, this is an extremely important plant for us in Italy and of global relevance. Finally, we are working on the future of Maserati, which is inextricably linked to Italy, to Modena, and to the Motor Valley. Santo, who is here, who is also working as head of Alfa Romeo, we were together on Monday in France, where he broke all records with the sale of the Alfa Romeo Junior, which increased by 64%, and he is working on Maserati. Obviously, Maserati, Alfa Romeo, like all our brands, linked to exports outside the European market, will also have to take into account what will happen with tariff policy. 2025, as we have clearly stated at the MIMIT table, will be another difficult year. The Italian market in the first two months is contracting by 7% compared to the same period last year. In 2026, we foresee an increase in production thanks to the launch of 10 new product updates in the Italian factories, which we talked about before, whose production levels will depend on the market and external factors such as tariffs. Even in a moment of persistent difficulty for the automotive sector in Europe, we continue to invest in Italy. In Turin, the future is, for just over a year, the seat of the group's first circular economy center, thus reaffirming its leadership in this sector. Turin hosts the Battery Technology Center, currently the only center in the world of the group for designing, developing, and testing battery packs, modules, and cells for high-voltage systems that will power the future vehicles of all our brands. The center is among the largest in the European automotive industry. Furthermore, Turin has global responsibility for advanced driver assistance systems (ADAS) and the development of the new STLA AutoDrive platform, which is our autonomous driving system for all vehicles in the world. Stellantis is carrying out what it had committed to achieving last December. I would like to reaffirm today our commitment in Italy and for Italy, with passion, responsibility, and professionalism, but above all because we believe in it. We are convinced that it can be done for Italy, it can be done with Italy, as we have always done.
The third and last part. I would like to address this last part of my report by describing the challenges of the automotive sector not only in Italy but also in Europe and the rest of the world. Let's start with the market. The global market for motor vehicles accounts for about 80 million units sold in 2024. China occupies the first place with 30 million, followed by the United States with 16 million and the European Union with 15 million. Compared to 20 years ago, sales in China have exploded fourfold, 400%. In the United States, they have slightly decreased by 5%, while in Europe they have fallen by 12% and in Italy by 30%. If fewer cars are produced today in Europe and Italy, it is a consequence of the market contraction of the last 20 years. Similarly, the increase in production in Europe and Italy in the next twenty years will depend on market growth, which will be increasingly electric. Now I would like to delve into two key elements for the development of our sector in Europe: the first, the competitiveness factors for the production of electric cars; the second, environmental and energy regulation. On competitiveness, I would like to dwell on two aspects: the costs of industrial transformation and the development of European battery technology. European car manufacturers are facing a structural disadvantage compared to their Chinese competitors, equal to 40% of the total manufacturing cost. In particular, energy prices in European car-producing countries are five times higher than Chinese ones. It must also be remembered that for a gigafactory, the energy consumption required is 10 times higher than that of a car production plant. For this reason, Europe should lower energy prices to globally competitive levels and keep them at constant and predictable levels. To reduce these gaps, it is necessary to act on the energy mix, their costs, and national taxation, as well as on the adoption of measures that favor true competition. In addition to the structural disadvantage due to European manufacturing costs, Europe faces a great challenge represented by its dependence on Asian, particularly Chinese, producers for battery production. I would like to remind you that the cost of the battery today represents up to 45% of the total cost of an electric vehicle. Today, there are 214 gigafactories active worldwide, located in China, and 13 in Europe, of which seven are Asian. Chinese and Asian companies have market leadership not only in terms of production but above all of technology. Furthermore, we do not control the extraction and refining of critical materials necessary for production. The European Commission's commitment to make 1.8 billion euros available with the Industrial Action Plan to produce batteries at a European level is an initial effort but not sufficient to bridge the gap with China and Asia. We come to the second point: environmental and energy regulation. The European automotive sector is in a critical phase, having to deal with the increasing pressure exerted by regulatory objectives on CO2 and the decrease in its global competitiveness. This sector is a key example of the lack of planning to which a rigid climate policy has been imposed without having created the industrial conditions to support it. Decarbonization regulations have created a fragmented and non-homogeneous market. To give an example, in 2024, in small markets like Belgium, Sweden, the Netherlands, Finland, and Denmark, the share of electric vehicle registrations is over 30%, but in the main European markets, Germany, France, Italy, and Spain, which represent 70% of total European registrations, this share does not exceed 17%, with the Italian data struggling to move from 4% in two years. This means that twice as many electric cars are sold in Belgium as in Italy. At Stellantis, we continue to maintain that electrification is the most effective tool for achieving decarbonization. At the same time, to achieve the 2035 climate goals, it is necessary to use the entire range of low and zero-emission technologies for both new vehicles and the existing fleet. 15 million cars are sold this year, perhaps 14, where the market is going, but there are 250 million cars in circulation. If one tries to reduce that circulating fleet, which has a very wide average age, by moving, for example, only from old engines to newer ones, from thermal to hybrid, this has a very important impact. The changes to the CO2 regulation announced two weeks ago by the European Commission go in the direction of reducing the burden on manufacturers who cannot meet the objectives in the short term. However, these are short-sighted interventions that do not give the necessary certainty to the market. In ACEA, the European Association of Manufacturers of which we are a part, and in CLEPA, which brings together European automotive suppliers, we hope to find a point of synthesis capable of reconciling environmental sustainability with economic and social sustainability. In the meantime, it is urgent to strengthen the charging infrastructure. The lack of a solid network of charging stations discourages buyers of electric vehicles. Despite the progress made in recent years, the pace of installation remains too slow and insufficient to convince customers to switch to electric. Almost 60% of all European charging stations are located in just three countries: Germany, France, and the Netherlands. To give you an idea, in Italy there are a third of the number of charging stations that there are in the Netherlands. For this reason, ACEA has asked European institutions to intervene to improve this fundamental aspect for the energy transition, using the tools at their disposal, because charging must be easy, accessible to all, fast, and also economically convenient. To conclude, our sector, the automotive sector, in 20 years will mainly produce electric cars. China and the United States are defining an industrial policy for cars with regulations and resources oriented to reach their national interests. We hope that this can happen soon in Europe as well, because in our profession we need a clear framework. This is fundamental for everyone: for manufacturers, for trade unions, for suppliers, for dealers, and above all for customers. Honorable Presidents, Honorable Deputies and Senators, I thank you, also on behalf of my colleagues, for your attention, and we are ready to answer your questions.
Thank you. The Honorable Chiara Pendino has registered to speak. I have no other speakers from the Five Star Movement, so you have 7 minutes, please. Thank you, President. I thank President Elkann for having appeared here, albeit, if you'll allow me, in a traditional way, but appearing here means appearing in front of the Italians, so it was very important. I confess that in light of today's hearing, we haven't learned much new compared to what had already emerged, and so we haven't resolved our doubts, which are substantially about how you really see the future of Stellantis and above all how you plan to reverse the course compared to what we have seen in recent years. Because what we would like to know, and I believe it's a bit of the question many are asking, is whether Stellantis is still a company that really produces and wants to produce cars or has simply become a financial asset. Because the answer depends a bit on who we ask this question to. If we talk to the workers of Stellantis, they legitimately experience it, from my point of view, as a company that has basically delocalized and that also treats employees as objects, between solidarity contracts, push towards voluntary redundancy, and redundancy fund. Then, however, if we look at it from the ownership side, President Elkann, we see a company that, through the foundation, is able to distribute many resources, many dividends, that is, we are talking about 17 billion, and we ask ourselves, to reward what? Because you also remembered it in a historical reconstruction...
We are facing a loss of over 2 million cars produced compared to 2019. We are facing a European market share that went from 20% in 2019 to 15.7% in 2024. We are facing what I consider, I've said it many times, the dismantling of the Italian automotive supply chain. And so I cannot understand how one can be proud of this paradox, which falls on the workers and on those small and medium-sized enterprises that you know well, that supply chain which is an asset of our country, because they have been forced, they have denounced it many times, to suffer order cuts or price cuts which for them mean less revenue and therefore the difficulty of staying afloat, and many have closed. So you see, I think it's difficult today, I say it sincerely, to believe your words. And I say it because the plan you talked about, which is also reported today in detail, is one that in some way, you see, rightly fills your mouth with Italy and Italianness. But then you see five new models launched in 2024 that are produced in Serbia, Morocco, Spain, Poland. You see investments in Italy for 2025, you rightly remembered today, announced for 2 billion, but 2 billion are few if we compare them with Brazil, where they will be more than four, where they will be more than five. You stopped, and on this I really would have liked to hear a word from you, the Termoli gigafactory project, and concurrently you announced a parallel investment which therefore evidently draws resources, at least within the group, compared to Italy. In Spain, you mentioned the Maserati workers earlier, those Maserati workers are on layoff, and just a few weeks ago, if what we read in the press is true, if it's not true you can obviously deny it, in that plant which has been idle since November, you proposed to the employees to go to Serbia to produce the Grande Panda. You mentioned the hybrid 500 in Turin, you went with the bishop, you did very well, but let's also remember that those workers, those female workers, are on layoff at least until April. I think, President, and you know it very well, that the relaunch passes through the production of mass-market products that are appealing on the market. You said you are an engineer, I am not an engineer, and so I know very well that you know, and I've heard many times say that you don't want to close the plants, but we know you don't want to close the plants. The problem is that through missed investments, missed hires, voluntary exits, early exits, missed productions, the plants die on their own. You don't need to close them, simply like a plant that isn't watered and then doesn't grow. So I really ask you for greater commitment than what you have said and what you have promised to Italy, and I hope the CEO arrives quickly. I heard he said in a few months, because it's difficult to lead such an important company without a CEO. Speaking of CEO, a few months ago we had an audition here with the former CEO, thank goodness, Tavares, and it was a spectacle of indecorum, President Elkann, I must tell you, indecorous after the disasters he caused. He came here and said a series of lies, and so I remember one that is unforgettable and that I hope you can in some way deny, which is that Stellantis was forced to produce abroad because Italians don't buy enough electric cars. So look, I really agree with you when you denounce that here there is a lack of infrastructure, that it's more difficult in Italy, that there are no charging stations, and I know how complex it is to install them. But we can't say that production is in Serbia because the electric market is better there, because even a child understands that it's not based on how many cars you sell in that market that you decide where to produce and to disinvest. The disinvestment started well before the ecological transition, and you know the numbers very well. And always on the CEO, and I close, I said it in the chamber, I said it here, I say it here in your presence, I think that showering with gold Tavares, who dismantled the Italian automotive industry, was not a good signal for Italy. So I ask you to give a signal of change, as much as possible, also on this when you go to negotiate the contract for the new CEO. We ask these questions because I think they are questions that the workers, the female workers, the small and medium-sized enterprises, the supply chain ask themselves. And so I believe that today you also owe an answer on a topic that you didn't raise, but that I want to raise. You see, we come from 2 years, this is certainly not attributable to you, of 24 months of decline in industrial production here, I am obviously referring not only to the automotive part but in general to Italy, obviously Stellantis also had an impact in some way. And in the face of this disaster, I'm going to close, President, this government has decided that the solution to restart industrial production and reconvert our companies, or rather companies of this country, into arms. So I think it's madness. I don't think it's right that a worker in the automotive sector, I close, President, should be thinking about arms. But I ask you, President, what do you think, because it will be up to you to decide which side to take when the government makes this proposal. So I close, President, I am sincere. For us it's difficult to believe those who have promised many times without keeping their promises, those who produce more cars, more layoff funds. But on the defense topic, we want an answer. Thank you, thank you Senator Bergesio, you have 3 minutes.
Thank you President Gusmeroli. Thank you for having convened this very important hearing together with President De Carlo. We have done excellent work in the commissions, both in the Senate and here in the Chamber, on this automotive topic. The sector is going through a phase of epochal transformation, driven above all by structural factors. We have listened, thank you President Elkann, naturally for this hearing, we have listened from your words the theme of the ecological transition, what has impacted, digitalization, global competition. However, this transition presents significant challenges. The Italian industry has been declining especially over the years, starting from the over 2 million units that national production was able to produce in the 90s to the current 500,000. In recent years, the European and international picture shows an acceleration in public and private investments in electrification and sustainability, topics you mentioned previously. The electric topic, naturally, is a topic on the agenda, and I believe that above all I would like to connect to an aspect on which you mentioned, it was mentioned previously by the colleague, we had heard a lot about the Termoli gigafactory which was to be built, it was even defined, I think by the CEO, a milestone, and then this gigafactory in the end, nothing more was heard, on the contrary, the information that arrived was clearly contrary. Regarding this, we have the topic you mentioned, competitiveness, the topic of fiscal taxation. I believe that the topic of fiscal taxation must also be somewhat linked to the aspect of where the company positions itself as a headquarters, as a reality, where the fiscal wealth of the company is redistributed, because this becomes fundamental in a comprehensive concept. I believe that today we are facing an epochal change in the sector. I much appreciated the tone with which you expressed yourself today here with us, the ability to subdivide. I ask for a strong commitment regarding the approach you have given in the development in Italy, even if there are many shadows as you also said, due to various aspects. There is also the theme of strengthening Mirafiori, Rivalta, Carmagnola, Piedmont, where we come from. But I also wanted to ask you on the topic of adequate charging infrastructure. You said the cost of over 40% of batteries that impact cars. What can the company do, because here we always talk about incentives, but what can the company do to meet the needs of consumers or potential customers on this topic as well? Thank you.
Thank you, thank you Honorable. 3 minutes because no one from the PD has signed up, and get ready Honorable De Carlo.
Thank you, thank you President. We take note of the communications of President Elkann which seem, meanwhile we positively greet the fact that there is this confrontation that we together with many others had asked for precisely in this important venue which is the parliamentary one. We hope that the commitments taken, also illustrated today in this venue, are respected, and we on this intend to monitor with great attention week by week, because as you said, Stellantis has inherited the legacy of that Fiat which represented an important piece of the country's industrial history, and has a duty to assume responsibility also towards the present, towards the future, towards the employees, towards a supply chain that, as you know, is in great suffering, and towards the territories and communities involved, towards the entire country system. We said it also last time in front of the former CEO Tavares, we have the intention to contribute also from the opposition to safeguard the manufacturing vocation of our country and also save the future of the automotive industry. On this I would like to ask you some more questions. We think that Italy cannot live on tourism and services, but needs to rediscover, relaunch, strengthen its industrial vocation. It must do so in a very complex situation, some aspects of which you touched upon, but I would like you to elaborate a bit more, for example, on how much the cost of energy weighs from this point of view, for example, of what is expected regarding the tariffs threatened by Trump of 25% on the European Union and how this will affect the European market and the Italian automotive market. We hope that there is really the intention to start substantial investments again, because otherwise we will continue to see what we have seen in fact. Then on this, evidently we have different readings, because we have read signals in these years of disinvestment by Stellantis in Italy, and I am referring to a very strong decrease in workers, if I'm not mistaken about 120-130,000 in the last 10 years, a strong explosion of layoff funds, incentives for early retirement, new models that were produced abroad, and also the sale of Comau to an investment fund. And yet you remembered your participation, which if I'm not mistaken is minority but about 40%, in ACC. Regarding the Termoli gigafactory, for us the stop to that project is and remains incomprehensible. It comes to me to say, President Elkann, even more incomprehensible given the things you stated today here regarding the European delay on the battery and energy storage systems sector, a delay that it is the duty of the European Union and Italy to try to fill, precisely because otherwise we are telling ourselves that there is no way to recover the competitiveness gap of Chinese production. So I would like us to definitively dismiss this hypothesis, we are not willing, I believe none of us, to give up the future of the car in Europe, and therefore we must understand how to put in place European industrial supply chains and what resources we need to manage to recover this gap, both in batteries and first. You mentioned energy, on this I want to return in a second. I was saying we are all aware of the difficulty of the complex phase that the automotive sector is going through, and therefore Italy is no exception. Stellantis is a real existential challenge. For this we would also like to ask you what will happen when the social safety nets expire in this country. What will be the fate of those workers? We want to protect those jobs, because as you were told regarding patents, it's not just about numbers, in this case it's about people with irreplaceable skills and knowledge that we must accompany into the future also through large investments in training, in the requalification of those skills and knowledge, and through the use of new technologies. There is a technological delay, there is strong competition with China. We share the concern expressed in this same venue by the unions about the uncertainty for the future, about the collapse in production, we have seen it both in the 2024 data and as you announced in the first data of 2025. We therefore expect Stellantis to maintain its commitments, to take on its responsibilities, and a strong initiative. We expect it, but also from the Italian government, because so far there has been a lack of a real industrial policy. We need to realize that we must really put the forces together in the European Union. We are asking for a European fund to help the automotive sector, we are not the only ones asking for it, there are other forces asking for it in Brussels too. We believe that the way to save the future of the Union in the face of new challenges is a great common investment plan, a sort of Next Generation EU that is 800 billion per year to aim for European strategic autonomy. That must be a European industrial policy, a European environmental and energy policy, a European innovation and social policy. This is what is needed, not what we are discussing in these days with the recourse to national debts. And I also want to ask you about this latest idea about the reconversion of the automotive sector towards defense. So to us it seems pure propaganda, and moreover of the right, let's say, a propaganda that wants to cover a difficulty of the sector that exists but cannot be solved in that direction, giving up the future of the automotive sector in Italy and in Europe, the two things are closely linked. As you know, for this I am well aware of the further difficulties that exist in Italy, for this we criticize this government which on the cost of energy for these last two years has done nothing. You did a decree, it's true, two weeks ago, also accepting some of our proposals, on this we expressed appreciation, the extension of the social bonus, changing the single buyer, avoiding auctions for the vulnerable. But the real theme here, also on this I would like to ask you what you think, is what other European countries have done with a de facto decoupling of the energy price from the gas price. This path has been carried forward in Spain, in Portugal, where they acted through a cap on the gas price, but it has also been carried forward in other ways, I think of Power Purchase Agreements which can lower gas and energy prices for businesses and also for families. So I understand that this topic is important for the productivity of our country, and I would like to have from you some more elements on how you think it can be addressed. I arrive briefly at the conclusion. We have made 21 concrete proposals that the government so far has not listened to, and we have made them together with the other oppositions around a joint motion on the Automotive. We make them available also to this debate. We think it is important and dutiful in our role to aim for incentives not only on the demand side but also on the supply side. However, we would like to insist that the path is not to abandon decarbonization objectives, perhaps arguing with the dates in Europe, but to understand what is the great common European investment plan that is needed to build here the foundations of the automotive industrial supply chain and also of the battery supply chains, because otherwise you are telling us, correct me if I'm wrong, I would be happy to be proven wrong, that if we go down this path we succumb to competition with the Chinese on electric car production. Thank you.
Thank you Senator De Carlo, and get ready Senator Floridia.
Thank you President. I also greet and thank President Elkann for having accepted our request to come to a hearing in a difficult context for the European, Italian, and global automotive industry. If there is one thing that connects President Elkann's hearing to that of former CEO Tavares, which I also did not appreciate in a particular way, neither for the tones nor for the substantive issues, it is the fact of having made a very clear analysis of what have been the predominant causes to face a situation of this type, that is, the blindness of European policies conditioned by a transition that was supposed to be ecological but was instead ideological, which did not take into account exactly what you also anticipated, the social issues, nor the economic issues. And so I believe that this, said in a context in which in Italy the government was the first to mobilize precisely to change those rules, albeit in the short term, gives reason, that is, the one regarding the fines, the deferral of fines which were anyway a heavy factor for companies. I believe it is the implicit recognition of an extraordinary work carried out by the government and by Minister Urso who with the non-paper managed to drag not only other nations but also the industrial associations, as well as naturally France and Germany, which today substantially speak the same language, that is, the language of businesses and entrepreneurs that the Italian government speaks. And also on the revision of the CO2 regulation, with your anticipation, its revision, the anticipation of its revision means realizing and being aware that the policies carried out so far have not only not paid off, not only have translated into a massacre for companies, not only Italian companies, because today we are hearing Stellantis and we are very happy to receive also the reassurances regarding the industrial plan presented already on December 17th, and I thank Dr. Imparato for having already communicated in fact what were the lines they intended to adopt. Among other things, investments without asking for public money, because if it is equally true, I tell you this President with the frankness that characterizes us, that Fiat is history and Stellantis today is the history of this nation, indissolubly both for economic and social reasons, it is equally true that this nation, that is, Italy, has always believed in the strategic importance of Stellantis and of Fiat before, whatever governments have been called to address delicate issues. For which I believe that with the pragmatism that characterizes us and with the serene consideration that today not only must we work for a European industrial policy, not only must we be careful because this is what we deal with, the repercussions it has in this nation, because what I was saying before, that is, the fact that the current situation is the result of a missed planning, is given to us clearly by the fact that in my Veneto, the component part, the part is not so much less significant compared to Stellantis, but is strongly conditioned by the crisis that the sector is also having in Germany, where they suffer the same European policies that we also suffered in Italy. For which ours will be an opening of trust, as it should be, between a government and a strategic company. But if I can summarize our position, it will be trust and vigilant waiting for your just and necessary plans to translate into reality and not remain only on paper. Thank you.
Good, Senator, 3 minutes. Thank you President. Get ready Honorable Squeri.
Thank you President. Elkann, as also rightly pointed out by you, we are in a historic moment. I must... how do I do it? I must get closer, that is, I am getting closer. Okay, now you hear me. You spoke of this historic, delicate, complex moment that we are living both in Europe and in Italy, and this historic moment requires, more than ever, a change of course at the Italian level but also at the European level, and therefore the need to produce in Italy is today stronger than ever, not only for a mere economic question but precisely because we talk about the security and defense of our country. So Italian production must be protected. I think only of the delocalization of several plants due to multinationals. You were speaking earlier of the excellence of Italian mechanics, I think of Dana for example, which boasts 3,800 employees here in Italy, and there is the risk, for example, in Trentino, in the Trentino plants, of relocating them. So this is the situation, but as yesterday we also pointed out to President Draghi, when he spoke of competitiveness and the fragmentation that Europe lives, I also ask you from your perspective, which is corporate, do you support a common European industrial policy and common European tax systems with an integrated environmental tax? After which I would ask you to project yourself into 2035. You spoke of the structural disadvantage, 40%, China, 214 plants that produce batteries. Okay, let's project ourselves into 2035, we have managed to reduce this gap. What happened to reduce it? Because you also said in 20 years we will have, the market will be electric, what will have happened and what will have, how to say, how the various governments will have intervened, what can be done to reduce the gap? And I also wanted to ask you regarding recycling, not only battery production but recycling, because I know of some Italian company realities that are able to recycle batteries up to 95%, but afterwards they must still transfer them to China. How is it... and I invite you to conclude. Yes, these are the questions I had, how to project into the future and what must have happened. Ah, excuse me, you were also talking about... I haven't finished, I finished. Thank you.
Thank you Honorable Squeri, you have 4 minutes, and get ready Senator Calenda.
Yes, thank you President. I first of all express an appreciation for the intervention made by President Elkann, hoping that the commitments that were stated can then translate into reality. I like to say that between saying and doing there is doing, so the wish, not only for Stellantis but let me also say for our country, is that these commitments are respected. And I also emphasize the emphasis he put when he spoke of the central role that Stellantis will have in Italy. That said, references were made to those who preceded him in this room in the role he now holds pro tempore, and I must say that yes, it was not a very brilliant intervention, but I certainly shared one thing of what he said, that is, that the blackout, the clamorous short circuit between demand and supply that European industry is experiencing, had a very evident cause, that is, a reckless European policy that has in fact betrayed the principle of technological neutrality, has betrayed every elementary rule of the market, for which it imposed a technology not so much by setting the 2035 date but even before, that is, the fines that kicked in from January 1st, which have already oriented the automotive industry, as I was saying, to get into, I use this ugly term, a dead end from which it is not easy to get out. I like to remember what the predecessor of Tavares, Marchionne, said, who we know how much he was considered a leader in the industrial thought of the automotive industry at a global level, he said that the times and ways linked to this electrification of mobility would have led us to a disaster, and let me say that industrially speaking, but not only, we have arrived at the disaster. So I had a series of questions, but let's say they have been absorbed by the commitments you have made, so I won't repeat them here because we move forward. I repeat, if what you said can be concretized, and I have two questions left that I improvise, not so much what you ask of the government, but what, given the competence you have, you expect the government to do to try, the government not only Italian but let me also say European, to do to revitalize a market, an automotive industry that is now absolutely in difficulty, because we have handed over not only the main know-how but also the whole issue of raw materials to China, and therefore we are in serious difficulty. And specifically on this topic, if you think, I must say that you made a passage that is not exciting for me when you said that electrification is our future, because I believe that electrification is a fundamental technology but not the only one, and precisely in this sense I ask you if you believe, and if so, how much you believe it is fundamental, and in Europe it will certainly be possible to discuss it in 2026, to reopen the window to allow other technologies, see biofuels, to be alongside the electric car. Thank you Senator Calenda.
Thank you very much. Honorable Cavò, you have 4 and a half minutes.
Thank you. Engineer Elkann, I miss in your reconstruction if you have ever made a mistake, given that a few months ago there was the CEO, his title is very badly set, sales too, that is, from this glorious reconstruction a piece of responsibility is missing, there isn't one. Don't you have a responsibility because this year we have reached the minimum of production, minus 62% on cars compared to what was produced in 2017? And you can't tell me, you see, that it's only the market forecast because you distributed the dividends in 2024. I then remind you that we gave you a guarantee on 80% of a loan of 6.3 billion which provided for full employment in 2023, investing 5.2 billion euros, not ceding assets, not delocalizing production of models subject to industrialization, there isn't one of these things that you have respected. You may tell me because then when we no longer needed it we repaid it and returned it, but I don't think that counts for much. And on what you say and on what Minister Urso says, who I believe is the last one left to believe the numbers you give, because I have heard this story of a million cars from Minister Urso in '23 and '24, to me it seems that the cars have become like Mussolini's air squadrons, that is, they are always the same ones going around, because in the meantime everything has collapsed. Engineer Elkann, and your plan, I didn't understand one thing, I heard earlier interventions where they said I hope you will respect the obligations, but help me understand how many cars you plan to produce this year, next year, and up to the million cars you will produce in 2030, that is, what are the volumes? Because you see, the problem I see in your plan is that in 2025, which I think will be a tragic year, but you will tell us now how much you plan to produce in 2025, the models you launch are very few, they arrive very late, especially those with high volumes, and do you really think the Panda and the 500 as they are will hold up until 2030? So you see, I try, I know you are doing a great communication campaign with more conciliatory tones, I appreciate it very much, I believe it has also worked from the interventions I have heard, I must tell the truth, but what I would like to ask you in the clearest way possible is the volumes you plan to make, how much layoff you plan to use in 2025, if you are willing to anticipate the Fast in or bring back the Grande Panda from Serbia, are you financially able to sustain the investments given that you promised 5 billion dollars to Trump? And the fundamental question is this, can this plan be discussed by the new CEO? Because if this plan can be discussed by the new CEO, we are playing ping pong. So these are fundamental points, and I understand it's difficult to predict how the market will go and how the tariffs will go, but I am certain that when you start production, at least I remember it was done this way but maybe I'm wrong, when you start production of a model you have clear what is the break-even point, that is, what is the production that gives the break-even point. So today you know the more or less conditions, and please don't tell me the problem is the European regulation which is completely nonsensical because your CEO was the only one who supported it even in the fines. In 2025, the last point I want to tell you is that the oppositions had presented an Automotive plan, you told Minister Urso that there is no need, that you will make 750,000 cars in 2026 up to 1 million in 2030, so says Urso, I don't know, so says Urso, if he denies it I am very happy, but so says Urso. But my question, the question that comes to me to ask you in all this is if there isn't a core, let's say, of fundamental investments and fundamental volumes, how can we today consider this commitment a significant one, because so many have already been betrayed in the past, Engineer Elkann? Thank you Senator Calenda, we move on to Honorable Cavò, get ready Senator Fregolent.
Honorable Cavò, 5 minutes. Thank you President. Thank you for this moment of meeting and confrontation. SC... tu tu... Here, now perhaps we are there. Thank you. Thank you for this moment of meeting and for what you have outlined. I pick up on some points, you were talking about give and take, you outlined in detail what was given by Fiat and then Stellantis and what instead our country gave to the company, to your family and your history. You hoped that this would no longer be a theme, but let's say this balancing, this confrontation, is an opportunity, which is evidently what we all hope for, because this can be, because the opportunity is fully grasped and no longer a theme of how much is given or how much is received in terms of commitments. Certainly the numbers you provided are important, the commitments we have heard, the plan that was outlined. I allow myself, however, also to ask, since we had very clear slides on the types of models and the commitments in all the plants which are absolutely important, also on the quantity of volumes, to go into detail, because clearly it is an absolutely important figure. The other, and here I refer to a question I had asked in the previous hearing with Tavares, I also allow myself to underline how it was a hearing that was at least, at least difficult and certainly disappointing. I hope that the answer from this point of view, but I am certain it will be so in this case, is a more specific answer. I am referring to the supply chain, to the entire supply chain linked to the automotive industry, because clearly the plants are important, the picture we heard was important, the plan we heard illustrated is important, obviously what this can mean for the prospects of the automotive supply chain. You spoke of growth, you gave data on growth, let's say of the orders, of the purchases that Stellantis has made towards the supply chain, and an increase also, let's say, of 25% compared to 2024, so certainly an important prospect. I ask you if you can guarantee and if you feel committed in the medium to long term from this point of view, because clearly this would be important to go into a vision beyond 2025. I would ask you if it is possible a scenario on the topic of innovation in the sector, obviously much has been mentioned, but a more specific one if I may ask you also in your capacity as president of a fund that invests in startups, and therefore I believe that the reasoning can be expanded on how much what was outlined today can have, let's say, repercussions on the entire supply chain, not only that strictly linked to the automotive industry. Clearly the topic of the new CEO, not for nothing I cited the hearing with Tavares, is an important topic, because obviously we would not want, but we are certain it is not so, to find ourselves in a confrontation with a new CEO who should not confirm what was outlined today. So we can hope and wish that the new figure that arrives is completely in line with what you said today. And then it would be important to understand, I follow the question my colleague Squeri asked regarding substantially the fact if we must stop at the prospect of an electric car or if other, let's say, modes, biofuel, e-fuel, hydrogen, are modes that you take into consideration, well knowing that the topic is European and that it will be necessary to play the game at a European level where technological neutrality in this sector has not yet passed clearly as a concept. And in the case where one manages to introduce, let's say, a mix and not just a single forced choice, what would be Stellantis's position from this point of view, and if, let's say, different choices, and therefore more open clearly to a mix and other technologies, could increase or change, let's say, the commitments taken by the group in Italy. I allow myself, I don't know how much time is left, very little, a small passage as a Ligurian parliamentarian, because there are many relevant factors, one I believe is also that of logistics and infrastructure. We have, let's say, we have experienced a great development of an axis which is substantially Turin-Milan, now an axis of Genoa is also developing towards Northern Europe, so if you believe this can help a company like yours, how do you see this also with respect to portuality and intermodality which I believe are fundamental for the development and the commitments taken by your company? Thank you Senator Fregolent, get ready Honorable Bonelli.
Thank you, 3 minutes. Thank you President. I come from Turin, for me it's not Stellantis, it's Fiat, pronouncing the T of Turin with great pride. You see, yesterday President Draghi said that in Norway there is no longer a Norwegian car manufacturer. Today we have the fortune of having the possibility to still converse with the parent company, and we ask the parent company questions like why don't you bring the workers from Serbia to Turin, which would be my dream, as if politics didn't know that the choices it makes depend on the choices industry can make, the cost of labor, the cost of energy. I ask today my colleagues, since we are all very worried about the Italian automotive industry, to make an energy plan where we say we start drilling our gas, we do renewables and we do nuclear for the successful maintenance of our industries, because it costs much more to produce in Italy, and we make a plan like was done with the Jobs Act in favor of workers and businesses, so that workers earn but entrepreneurs don't have the temptation to go abroad. I hope to find unanimity in the proposals. Instead when I ask you, obviously Turin for me is my city, so since you started speaking about Southern Italy and then arrived at Turin, Mirafiori is central and will remain central, the search for new models will be central, not only the 500, training obviously, the Polytechnic is the Polytechnic, but if you plan to extend and increase the production of the gigafactory and all the production also of what concerns hydrogen. And instead a question that I don't know if your courtesy and your institutional role can allow you, if you had to ask one thing of European politics and one thing of Italian politics, what are the two priorities? Thank you. Good, Honorable Bonelli, get ready Honorable Piaceri.
President Elkann, I am Bonelli, and I also speak on behalf of colleague Fratoianni of the parliamentary group Green-Left Alliance. Look, I listened to your presentation with great attention, the division into points, in particular the slide where you highlighted the various, let's say, elastic, intermodal platforms interested me a lot. However, I would like if you could tell us, fill with numbers those platforms, that is, because today unions, workers, female workers are very worried, and I think today it is very important that you can say a clear word in employment terms of what are the investments, also on the topic of layoff, also in the planning and in the future perspective. It is clear that in this picture, the topic of a strategy if Stellantis has one to bring back to Italy some productions, I think of Serbia, I think of Spain, there is a very nice ad that Stellantis did of the Grande Panda with the Italian flag, all Italian, but there was a detail, President, that it is produced in...
Serbia, detto questo, dire una cosa chiara da questo punto di vista sul tema occupazionale, sugli impegni, sugli investimenti, perché questo è un elemento fondamentale e c'è tutta una questione anche di quali modelli, in particolar modo dal punto di vista dei modelli mass market, che è un elemento fondamentale anche nella competizione globale del mercato. Ora qui io non entro, perché mi voglio concentrare più su di lei e non sulla polemica politica, transeologica o ideologica. Lasciamo perdere il punto che abbiamo chiaro, e glielo dico da ambientalista: è che in una fase delicata per il pianeta e anche per l'industria, bisogna avere un attimo di elasticità. Io non ho problemi ad affermare questo tema, multa e quant'altro. Per quanto ci riguarda, il tema non è l'anno in più o l'anno in meno, ma capire con chiarezza se il settore industriale va in una direzione che è quella dell'elettrificazione, e lei l'ha detto, il punto, e sono gli investimenti del governo dal punto di vista dell'infrastruttura. Da questo punto di vista, ma una risposta ce la deve anche sulla Gigafactory di Termoli, perché questo è un elemento importante. Vorrei dire sommessamente, vorrei una sua opinione in merito, in una situazione di incertezza dell'Europa sul tema della politica industriale dell'auto, ovvero se l'Europa intende investire come i cinesi hanno fatto fortemente da questo punto di vista sull'elettrico. Se l'Europa dovesse essere ulteriormente incerta, io ho una mia opinione che dico che non conta nulla, ma vorrei sapere la sua. Penso che rimarremo, diciamo, un vaso di coccio tra due grandi colossi, i cinesi e Tesla americani, che conquisteranno il mercato europeo con prezzi convenienti, con ricadute sull'occupazione drammatiche. Da questo punto di vista, questa è la riflessione che faccio anche a coloro i quali dicono il tema della transizione è ideologico. No, è molto pragmatica da questo punto di vista sul tema dell'energia. Quindi, appunto, bisogna produrre energia a basso costo, siamo assolutamente d'accordo. Allora, una delle grandi questioni che noi abbiamo posto al governo e che sottopongo anche alla sua attenzione, che riguarda anche grandi industrie ma non solo, le famiglie italiane, è che una direttiva europea che dovrebbe introdurre il tema della tariffazione zonale del prezzo dell'energia, che in particolar modo oggi nel sud porterebbe a riduzione di costi pari al 30-35%, non viene applicata già oggi. Già oggi, se andiamo a vedere il dispositivo di Terni, dove ci indica, la chiudo, grazie presidente, e andiamo a vedere la produzione di energia, vediamo che abbiamo 130-140% di produzione di rinnovabili nel sud, in Calabria, Sicilia, Sardegna. Ecco, però il prezzo a Termoli lo pagate, a Melfi lo pagate sul prezzo del gas. E allora una tariffazione zonale da questo punto di vista sarebbe un passo che si può fare subito, immediatamente, e il governo lo potrebbe fare per dare già un input molto forte nella riduzione del costo dell'energia.
Grazie onorevole Bonelli. Onorevole Marattin si prepari. L'onorevole Comba.
Grazie presidente. Buon pomeriggio, buon pomeriggio ingegnere. Ho tre domande soltanto veloci. Una, e molti colleghi hanno citato il nuovo amministratore delegato, io le chiedo solo conferma della sua ultima dichiarazione che ha detto che sarebbe arrivato entro metà 2025. Ci conferma questo timing o no? Secondo, lei ha citato i dazi, mi chiedevo se avesse qualche informazione in più su qual è la sensibilità della vostra produzione italiana a eventuali dazi. Cioè, per il momento quelli in essere, grazie a Dio, non credo impattino sull'industria automobilistica, ma se dovesse peggiorare la situazione, che scenari di sensibilità abbiamo sulla produzione italiana? Infine, ultima domanda: vede nell'ultima audizione di Tavares, che secondo me l'altra volta è stata brutta sia per chi ha parlato, diciamo per tutti quelli che hanno parlato, non è stata una bella audizione in generale, né da parte del dottor Tavares né da parte di noi politici, ovviamente mi ci metto anch'io. In quell'audizione lui ha dato un dato che lei ha confermato, cioè noi c'abbiamo un doppio gap. Alcuni pensano che la produzione sia una variabile esogena, cioè che la produzione avvenga per decisione magari politica e non invece per condizioni di competitività che determinano le convenienze relative a produrre qua o là. Allora Tavares ci ha detto: c'è un doppio gap di competitività dell'Europa con la Cina sull'elettrico, ma dell'Italia con l'Euro. E io gli chiesi: ci può dire, senza che lei venga reso responsabile di dettar legge alla politica, glielo sta chiedendo la politica, o meglio una parte insignificante in questo caso della politica, quali sono le dimensioni su cui la politica deve agire per chiudere questo gap di competitività? L'energia lei l'ha detto bene, ma c'è solo l'energia o c'è qualche altra dimensione che determina la discompetitività dell'Italia non rispetto alla Cina ma rispetto al resto dell'Europa, dove possiamo agire? Grazie.
Grazie onorevole Comba. 2 minuti e si prepari l'onorevole Bagnai.
Presidente Elkann, benvenuto. Lo stabilimento di Mirafiori è il più grande polo produttivo di Stellantis in Italia, è uno dei principali in Europa, con oltre 11.000 addetti e una capacità produttiva che si estende su più di 2 milioni di metri quadri. Grazie alla sua condizione storico-strategica e agli investimenti mirati, Mirafiori ha costituito per decenni un asset fondamentale dell'intero settore automobilistico del nostro paese. È fondamentale ricordare, sottolineare che la centralità di Mirafiori è cruciale per mantenere il nostro paese competitivo nell'industria, garantendo un alto livello di innovazione tecnologica e sostenibilità, altamente qualificata in un contesto di transizione verso mobilità elettrica. La continuità e l'efficienza di un impianto come Mirafiori sono vitali per preservare le filiere produttive italiane, sostenere la crescita del settore e rafforzare la posizione dell'Italia come leader nella produzione automobilistica in Europa. Anche in questo caso il governo italiano ha mostrato un grande pragmatismo e una visione industriale straordinaria, in quanto ha consigliato la strada giusta con politiche mirate di sostegno al rilancio industriale, garantendo la stabilità dei livelli occupazionali. Trovo che questo scenario è sostanziale, che le grandi aziende come Stellantis lavorino in sinergia con le istituzioni italiane per garantire una produttività d'eccellenza che tuteli i lavoratori e stimoli lo sviluppo tecnologico della nazione. A Mirafiori il ministro Urso ha richiesto la produzione della 500 ibrida, cosa che finalmente ritroviamo nel vostro piano. È stato inoltre sollecitata dal governo la vostra adesione alla Fondazione Chips Act di Pavia e la Fondazione AI Industry di Torino. Confermate questi impegni? E questo vuol dire che siete tornati a scommettere sulla centralità italiana? Grazie.
Grazie, grazie presidente. Grazie onorevole Comba. Immagino che siamo tutti d'accordo. Stiamo sentendo i capigruppo d'aula che va tutto bene. Sì, mi boh. Allora onorevole Bagnai a 5 minuti. Prego e scusi, va bene se c'è la commemorazione, non se ci sono le risoluzioni sul Consiglio Europeo, sia chiaro, ma solo non per sospendere ma per dare un segnale giusto all'Loco con tutta franchezza. E allora dobbiamo finire le audizioni e le sto dicendo che se vuole chi deve commemorare Luca, fra questi ci siamo io e l'onorevole Fassino, scendiamo, ma non esiste adesso, sentiamo l'aula intanto, non esiste che l'aula riprenda sulle risoluzioni in nostra assenza, questo dico.
Sì presidente, posso? Allora onorevole Bagnai, 5 minuti.
Grazie presidente. Illustre presidente Elkann, qui nessuno disconosce l'importante ruolo che l'azienda che lei rappresenta ha avuto nella storia del paese, né tantomeno posso farlo io che rappresento gli elettori del collegio di Chieti, ai cui abitanti gli stabilimenti della ex Sevel e il relativo indotto hanno garantito per 40, da 40 anni una relativa prosperità. Lei ha citato anche il ruolo di questa azienda nel percorso più complessivo del gruppo in quanto precursore di un certo tipo di strategia di alleanze. Adesso quello stabilimento viaggia sui 1500-1700 cassintegrati e alcuni sono anche i miei amici. Quando chiedevo se fossero preoccupati, la risposta è stata: siamo rassegnati. Mi sembra però che il riconoscimento e il rispetto forse non siano pienamente reciproci, in un certo senso. Sono d'accordo con il senatore Calenda, può sembrare strano a chi guarda la pessima televisione, ma poi sui problemi seri ci ritroviamo. Lei per esempio al primo giugno 2023 ha dichiarato che nella nostra storia noi abbiamo mai avuto bisogno di avere lo stato nel nostro capitale. Anche la ricostruzione di oggi che lei ha fatto è giustamente molto apologetica riguardo la storia dell'azienda. Indubbiamente non avete sentito il bisogno di avere lo stato nel capitale, però mi sembra che dalla sua ricostruzione non emerga, diciamo, un riconoscimento del ruolo che comunque lo Stato ha avuto come finanziatore, come sostenitore attraverso contributi alla produzione, attraverso la cassa integrazione. Cioè, per esempio, qua le cifre del Ministero del Lavoro ci dicono che comunque nel periodo fra il 2021 e la metà del 2024, solo di cassa integrazione lo Stato ha erogato una cifra molto vicina a un milione di euro per giorno lavorativo. Quindi, insomma, un certo tipo di atteggiamento chiaramente non favorisce poi un dialogo sereno. Io su questo innesco anche la vicenda del Green, perché insomma prima si parlava anche di eventuali responsabilità se ora le cose non vanno tanto bene. Il primo aprile del 2022 i giornali riportavano una sua dichiarazione agli azionisti: solo nel 2021 sono stati effettuati 11 significativi collocamenti in borsa di costruttori puri di auto elettriche, i mercati ci stanno chiaramente indicando in che direzione sta andando il futuro. Ma sì, forse quella era la direzione lei vedeva e annunciava un futuro full electric del tutto incurante dei segnali che think o anche partiti indipendenti come quello a cui appartengo stavano già dando di allarme verso la transizione. Credo si renda conto di che impatto un annuncio simile dato da un personaggio influente come lei può aver avuto sul mercato in termini di scelte di investimento e via dicendo. Poi le cose sono andate come stanno andando. Devo citare il della bancarotta di Northvolt per esempio, tanto per parlare di batterie. E il problema secondo me non è tanto l'errore della previsione quanto i motivi che potrebbero aver sotteso a questo errore, perché quello che è vero è che secondo me l'industria ha intravisto nel Green l'opportunità di forzare un gigantesco rinnovo del parco macchine per sostituirlo con modelli più costosi e ha spinto Bruxelles in quella direzione. Solo che, come spesso accade, io l'ho visto accadere tante volte anche nei campi di mia più diretta pertinenza, per esempio nell'industria finanziaria. Prima si spinge in una direzione Bruxelles e poi si viene dalla politica a chiedere di essere protetti da Bruxelles. Ora, il fatto sta è che alcune cose sono cambiate. L'economia di comando e di sussidio che era necessaria per forzare la transizione al Green non esiste più perché oggi abbiamo un governo responsabile che sta attento ai conti e quindi, diciamo, non ci sono più le condizioni finanziarie perché questo tipo di economia vada avanti. Allora, fatto questa premessa, io le farei qualche domanda. Sarei grato innanzitutto se potesse chiarire quali investimenti e quali livelli di occupazione intende mantenere nel sito della Val di Sangro, nella ex Sevel di Atessa. Poi le chiederei: ma secondo lei effettivamente il settore europeo è in grado di sopravvivere all'enorme vantaggio competitivo cinese? Rimarrà qualcosa in Europa? Perché secondo me quando si è presa una certa strada si è pensato che forse si è sottovalutato il gap con la Cina, che è un gap che non è solo sul costo dell'energia. Per esempio c'è il tema delle materie critiche, tutta una era che noi non controlliamo. Poi come vede la concorrenza cinese sull'endometriosi? Assicurazioni in questo senso non si corre il rischio che poi marchi storici italiani come Alfa Romeo, Lancia siano spiazzati rispetto ai modelli cinesi, francesi o americani? E infine, e concludo, siccome mi pare che il protezionismo sia effettivamente oltre che nelle corde della nuova amministrazione USA, ma questo qui non riguarda, sia l'unica strada per tutelare in qualche modo un'industria europea che è nascente rispetto a quella cinese, vista la complessità delle catene di approvvigionamento. L'UE è in grado di applicare misure protezionistiche per proteggere il suo settore automotive? Infine, una considerazione: il bilancio del dare e dell'avere lei ha detto non deve essere divisivo, a prezzo i toni affinché non lo sia, e però è necessario che i dati siano condivisi, perché finché io vengo qua con i dati che mi dà il mio governo e lei viene con i dati che le danno i suoi uffici, ognuno ha i suoi dati e questo bilancio del dare e dell'avere non si riesce a fare, anche perché oggettivamente è difficile. Considerando che per esempio il suo gruppo lei prima ha parlato delle imposte che Gra versa, però dove le versa? Cioè, questo è un altro tema. Perfetto, si parlava di qui, benissimo. La ringrazio.
Grazie onorevole Magi. Onorevole Casasco a 2 minuti.
Grazie presidente. Grazie presidente Elkann di essere qui oggi e la ringrazio perché lei è in perfect time. È stato detto una collega precedente che lei è in ritardo, per me oggi lei fa grande onore essere qui, le fa grande onore per due motivi: per essersi assunto la responsabilità gestionale operativa dell'azienda e per aver anticipato di essere qui prima dell'amministratore delegato che poi era quello deputato all'attuazione del piano industriale. Quindi le fa onore molto e fa parte della storia della sua famiglia assumersi una grande responsabilità in questo momento e può essere una grande svolta. Voglio dire, per il nostro paese Fiat è stata estremamente importante, la storia della sua famiglia e la storia dell'impresa italiana e la storia anche di tutto un ecosistema che ha dato lavoro e opportunità alle famiglie italiane. Quindi quello che lei ha detto di coniugare l'economia reale, lo sviluppo, gli investimenti, la ricerca insieme all'economia sociale, questo è estremamente importante e apprezzabile. Ritorno proprio al discorso precedente, cioè il fatto adesso dell'amministratore delegato sarà una scelta sua, come lei si è assunto questa grande responsabilità che le fa onore, ripeto, è una grande responsabilità anche la scelta giusta di qualcuno che sappia tradurre, voglio dire, in pratica quelli che sono i vostri investimenti, la vostra ricerca e il vostro sviluppo. La storia della Fiat, la storia della sua famiglia ha sempre scelto degli italiani. Non sono per l'italianità in assoluto, sto dicendo però che e questo è molto importante, perché avere eventualmente all'interno di scelte all'interno del gruppo di esperienze di settore che abbiano una competenza di conoscenza del gruppo, della conoscenza del territorio nazionale e delle sue capacità, e altrettanto una scelta internazionale potrebbe essere importante. Ben lungi dal condizionare questa cosa, però vol darle solo un pensiero nel rispetto e nel riconoscimento di quello che le ho detto. Grazie.
Onorevole Della Vedova a un minuto e mezzo. Grazie, prepari l'onorevole Schiano di Visconti.
Grazie presidente. Grazie presidente Elkann. Una domanda è sui volumi in prospettiva con il calo demografico. Parlo dei volumi in Europa e il cambio di abitudini, non si rischia di fare dei piani che poi in realtà non avranno sostanza per mancanza di mercato al di là dei modelli? Noi abbiamo due temi: elettrico e Cina. Luca De Meo, che peraltro ha avuto passaggi anche in Fiat, l'amministratore delegato di Renault, ha reiteratamente chiesto, immaginato un Airbus dell'elettrico sull'automobile, quindi sulla sinergia, sulle collaborazioni e cooperazioni tra i grandi gruppi europei in particolare per fronteggiare la concorrenza cinese. Qual è la posizione di Stellantis su questo? Sulla guida autonoma, lei pensa che ci siano margini di recupero rispetto agli Stati Uniti e alla Cina e se prevedete che questo sia un mercato vero in prospettiva?
Onorevole Schiano di Visconti a 2 minuti. Si prepari il senatore Pogliese.
Presidente, benvenuto. Presidente Elkann, gli stabilimenti automobilistici nel mezzogiorno rappresentano un asset strategico per l'industria nazionale, contribuendo in modo rilevante alla produzione, all'export e all'occupazione. In particolare lo stabilimento di Pomigliano d'Arco, operativo dal '72, ha costituito un pilastro della manifattura italiana con una capacità produttiva che ha superato le 200.000 unità annue e un'occupazione diretta di circa 4.500 addetti, oltre un indotto significativo distribuito lungo la filiera. Dal punto di vista occupazionale Pomigliano ha rappresentato per oltre 50 anni un volano di sviluppo per il mezzogiorno. Componentistiche e nei servizi. Tuttavia il contesto attuale, caratterizzato dalle dinamiche globali di riconversione industriale e da una progressiva riorganizzazione produttiva su scala europea, solleva interrogative sulla continuità e sul futuro di questi asset produttivi fondamentali per il tessuto economico e occupazionale del sud Italia. A Pomigliano, su richiesta del governo, avete annunciato una nuova piattaforma Stellantis Small dal 2028 che avrebbe dovuto essere destinata ad altri paesi. Si tratta di una svolta importante che potrebbe riportare in Italia un prodotto di media gamma e di grandi volumi produttivi. Confermate questa impostazione? E pensate che le vendite prospettiche siano sufficienti a garantire la piena occupazione dello stabilimento nel medio lungo periodo? Grazie.
Bene, senatore Pogliese a 2 minuti. Si prepari l'onorevole Caramanna.
Grazie presidente. Io ho ascoltato con grande attenzione la relazione dell'ingegnere John Elkann, del quale comunque ho apprezzato la volontà di metterci la faccia e di non essersi sottratto al confronto, che credo rappresenti un elemento che deve essere apprezzato in maniera assolutamente trasversale da tutti. Ma veniamo ad alcune domande. Secondo numerose ricostruzioni giornalistiche, alcune delle quali in realtà parzialmente smentite in riferimento ai dati che lei ha divulgato un'ora fa, l'ultima delle quali è quella del Corriere della Sera, fra il 1990 e il 2019 il complesso dei contributi pubblici di cui ha beneficiato il gruppo ammonterebbe a circa 4 miliardi di euro a fronte di poco più di 10 miliardi di investimenti dichiarati. Lei ha affermato che ha in programma per il 2025 investimenti per circa 2 miliardi di euro ma che farà a meno di qualunque contributo pubblico per mantenere la produzione negli stabilimenti italiani garantendo al contempo i livelli occupazionali. Si tratta di una svolta netta rispetto al passato che deve essere accolta con grande soddisfazione, che è coerente rispetto all'indirizzo del governo di destinare tutte le risorse pubbliche alla filiera della componentistica. Conferma questa impostazione? Se così, conferma che i 2 miliardi di investimenti per il 2025 previsti nel piano Italia saranno tutte risorse del vostro gruppo?
Onorevole Caramanna si prepari l'onorevole Bignami.
Grazie presidente. Benvenuto presidente Elkann. Grazie di essere venuto, avevamo chiesto ovviamente già in passato la sua partecipazione alla commissione e non mi dilungherò sulla presenza dell'ingegner Tavares perché penso sia superfluo, i miei colleghi si sono già espressi in merito. Però lei conoscerà bene la posizione di Fratelli d'Italia sul Green Deal, quindi comunque su quelle che sono alcune politiche. Quindi la crisi europea dell'automotive che noi riteniamo, insomma, essere stata principalmente rovinata dalle follie del Green Deal ha portato diverse case automobilistiche europee a gravi problemi e ultima delle quali abbiamo visto proprio in questi giorni Audi, che ha ridotto i piani di investimento, annunciato chiusure di stabilimenti, razionalizzando i costi inclusi quelli della manodopera e in alcuni casi ha annunciato decine di migliaia di licenziamenti. Noi siamo vicini al collasso dell'auto europea in Europa. Prima lei parlava di dati che ovviamente non sono confortanti. Stellantis al contrario ha annunciato proprio dopo l'intesa con il governo un piano Italia che assegna un ruolo specifico a ciascun stabilimento come oggi lei ci ha illustrato, scongiurando chiusura e ridimensionamenti, confermando gli attuali livelli di occupazione e soprattutto quello che a noi diciamo interessa molto, prevedendo l'inserimento di figure altamente specializzate e l'avvio di un programma di inserimento per i giovani, nonostante prosegua il ricorso agli ammortizzatori sociali conseguente a rallentamento del mercato e la transizione delle vecchie piattaforme produttive. Quello che noi le chiediamo, in parte già lei lo aveva già anticipato, è se può confermare che questa sia l'intenzione del gruppo ovviamente e soprattutto se, dato che oggi insomma abbiamo l'onore di averla qui e può prendere un impegno con la commissione e con il Parlamento tutto, di quanto concordato con il governo sarà mantenuto, cioè tutti i livelli produttivi, i siti produttivi rimarranno in attività e i livelli occupazionali saranno garantiti. Un'altra cosa che le volevo chiedere: quali saranno le condizioni per restare competitivi in Europa per un produttore come Stellantis alla luce di quello che ci siamo detti, soprattutto perché a mio avviso in questi anni uno dei grandi errori che è stato fatto, e lo abbiamo detto anche, è stato quello di non investire adeguatamente in tecnologie che sono secondo me il plus della vostra azienda.
Grazie onorevole Bignami. L'ultimo intervento, grazie.
Grazie presidente, grazie al presidente Elkann. Convergo che si debba, come faceva il senatore Pogliese pocanzi menzione, ringraziare per la volontà di essere venuto a metterci quantomeno la faccia, anche confrontandosi col Parlamento. Però mi permette anche di ringraziare il ministro Urso che, pur sprovvisto di strumenti su cui mi permetterò di concentrare il quesito, quale la Golden Power, è riuscito a indurre Stellantis a realizzare un piano di sviluppo da cui dovrebbero poi, da quello che anche lei ci ha riferito, dedursi investimenti per 2 miliardi, individuando modelli, stabilimenti, produzioni con obiettivi specifici. Che, tuttavia, come appunto dicevo, essendo sprovvisti di strumenti come quelli di cui la Golden Power può beneficiare, si traducono, per essere norme sostanzialmente imperfette, cioè prive di un'effettiva possibilità di vincolatività rispetto all'adempimento delle stesse. Si tratta certamente di obiettivi che consentono, con una trasparenza anche assistita dal monitoraggio e dalla verifica che il ministro Urso intende avviare, che ha già avviato, di verificare l'andamento degli stessi. Però è chiaro che l'assenza di questo strumento di Golden Power indebolisce la posizione del governo e dello Stato. Questo è una premessa che mi permettevo, presente, di evidenziare perché, come lei sa, il 7 di settembre voi avete, 7 settembre 2020, nel momento in cui è stata realizzata Stellantis, voi avevate presentato per l'esercizio della Golden Power la segnalazione utile all'attivazione della stessa. E ci consta che il 25 settembre 2020 il governo di allora, governo Conte, abbia ritenuto l'operazione non ricadente nell'ambito di applicazione della Golden Power, un approccio che lei ben lo sa, se poi tradotto in maniera del tutto diversa quando il governo Meloni rispetto a com'era invece ha ritenuto che fosse da attivare la stessa Golden Power, esercitando i poteri che ne derivano, evidentemente postulati dalla sussistenza di un interesse nazionale alla difesa della stessa. Allora le chiedo, e mi permetto su questo di essere preciso nei quesiti, chi lei incontrò in quel periodo, a dire nel periodo in cui del 7 settembre 2020 si dedde corso l'operazione, quali ministri al governo Conte, il Conte 2, e se incontrò il Presidente del Consiglio d'allora. Quali impegni le furono chiesti, se le furono chiesti, per garantire la produzione, investimenti in Italia. A riguardo le chiedo se può precisare gli eventi che ho richiamato anche con dettagli di sorta.
Bene, abbiamo finito gli interventi, quindi do la parola al presidente per la replica. Innanzitutto ringrazio, so che abbiamo finito i tempi, posso prendere almeno un quarto d'ora con i miei colleghi? Grazie. Un tema ricorrente è stato quello della fornitura della filiera. Dunque chiederei a Monica Magari se sì, grazie.
Salve a tutti, sono Monica Genovese. Allora, riguardo al tema della filiera, ritengo innanzitutto doveroso fare una premessa. Ardo al processo di selezione dei... scusi presidente, scusi, una domanda sull'ordine dei lavori. Noi stiamo udendo lo staff manageriale della Fiat, non stiamo audendo... mi lasci spazio alla dottoressa Genovese. Prego, mi sentite meglio così? Ok, grazie. No, dicevo, allora innanzitutto è opportuno secondo me fare innanzitutto una premessa riguardo al processo di selezione dei fornitori in ambito Stellantis. Infatti la selezione dei fornitori avviene basata su criteri di qualità, primo criterio, criteri di competitività tecnologica in funzione delle specifiche che vengono richieste e soprattutto e anche ovviamente competitività di costo. Nella parte del suo discorso il presidente ha citato il valore di fatturato di acquisto da fornitori in Italia nel periodo dal 2021 al 2024 che è pari a circa 6 miliardi di euro all'anno e la stessa prospettiva l'abbiamo anche per l'anno in corso, chiaramente compatibilmente con i trend di mercato. E da qualche mese abbiamo, ho sentito molto connessione con la filiera, questo è stato un commento che ho sentito da vari onorevoli e senatori, da qualche mese noi abbiamo rinforzato la connessione con i fornitori e nello specifico con la filiera italiana. Come è già stato comunicato al MIMIT il 17 dicembre, abbiamo nominato nell'ambito degli acquisti una persona di riferimento che è dedicata a coordinare tutte le azioni all'interno di Stellantis e insieme alle varie parti coinvolte, finalizzata alla gestione di eventuali casi di fornitori critici identificati. Le azioni sono finalizzate a due obiettivi: un obiettivo di breve termine e un obiettivo di lungo termine. Un obiettivo di breve termine per stabilizzare la situazione di criticità specifica con il fornitore definito e obiettivi di lungo termine per l'identificazione di azioni strutturali con il contributo di tutte le varie parti coinvolte. Abbiamo anche in essere un dialogo molto costruttivo con ANFIA su un piano di attività identificate come prioritarie per la filiera che includa l'individuazione di azioni che sono mirate al miglioramento della competitività in Italia, perché questo è il fattore chiave per aumentare il business. Ne è un esempio il tema dell'energia di cui si è già parlato, che in Italia in questo momento è effettivamente un fattore di minore competitività non solo paragonata rispetto alla Cina ma anche paragonata rispetto ad altri paesi europei. Il 2 aprile abbiamo organizzato a Torino una convention a livello europeo che coinvolge i fornitori del business di Stellantis in Europa. Sarà una convention molto importante, saranno coinvolti più di 200 fornitori di cui circa la metà hanno stabilimenti in Italia. Molteplici sono gli obiettivi di questa convention che vanno proprio nella direzione di cui stiamo discutendo. Principalmente il tema principale è la riconnessione con la filiera, ma ovviamente parleremo di business, faremo il punto sul business di Stellantis in Europa e soprattutto faremo un focus sulle opportunità di crescita, sulle azioni messe in campo in particolar modo sul ruolo dei fornitori, in particolare quelli italiani, grazie anche al coinvolgimento dell'ANFIA. Grazie.
