Hello and welcome to this 27th edition of Territoire Echo, the show dedicated to economic news of the French Riviera from the Nice Matin group, produced in partnership with the Chamber of Commerce and Industry Nice Côte d'Azur and the newspaper Tribune Côte d'Azur. As usual, I am joined by Agnès Farodia, journalist at the economics department of Nice Matin. Good morning, Agnès.
And Isabelle Osias, editor-in-chief of Tribune Côte d'Azur. Good morning, Isabelle.
And in this issue, the big interview with Pierre Gattaz, former president of MEDEF, who will talk about his latest book 'Win More, Now', but also about the launch of the Institute for Southern Solutions. Also on the program, the Echo newspaper summarizing the economic news of September. The behind-the-scenes segment that will get a little ahead of Christmas since we will discover the manufacturing secrets of the artisan chocolatier Lac. And finally, as October is cybersecurity month, we will welcome Karine Usan from Cyber Keep Cool. And right now, let's move to the big interview.
Pierre Gattaz, good morning.
Thank you for accepting our invitation.
You are, among other things, the head of Radiall, an electronic components company, but also of a vineyard, Château de San in the Luberon. You are also known for having created 1 million jobs in 5 years when you led MEDEF nationally between 2013 and 2018. And if you are here with us on this set, it's because, as usual, your news is very busy. You have just published, with three other business leaders, a book with a telling title, since it's 'Win More, Now'. And you describe there, sorry, 30 measures that will allow the French to increase their purchasing power by 30% within 10 years. And you are also in Nice to launch the Institute for Southern Solutions. So Pierre, before addressing the main lines of your book, can you give us a brief update on the economic and political situation of the country?
Yes. The political situation is catastrophic, as you imagine. I meet many people, bosses, traders, artisans, workers too who are fed up with this political instability since the dissolution, the petty comments, and it's quite unbearable. When you're a boss, you feel like a pariah because some parties say you are bad. We can't take it anymore because we are at war. The Chinese are coming with low prices, we have to motivate teams, defend cash, deal with American tariffs, and when you return to France, you're insulted. There is anxiety and a deep silent anger. On the economic front, it's not yet catastrophic, but what worries us is that these petty comments continue until May 2027. That could be very long.
And yes, precisely this political situation that is dragging on a bit.
Well, that's what I'm telling you, we go from one twist to another. We can call into question a reform that was going in the right direction. I hear people wanting to call into question the competitiveness policy that gave incredible results. We created 2.3 million jobs in 9 years. Then the dissolution created a schism. Beyond our companies, people don't understand what we are doing. It's dramatic to see political parties unable to agree on a compromise to save the country. We have many assets, but they must get along. It's time for this political circus to stop.
So, with everything we've just said, your latest book titled 'Win More, Now' – is that possible?
Yes. The book was written right after the dissolution because we saw Pandora's box open. We said, what can we do with a group of business leaders? My three partners and I thought of 30 reforms. From 10.2% unemployment to 7.2% is good, but we must go to 4%. We want full employment. We calculated that if we implement these reforms, we can increase wages by 30% in 10 years. For example, the minimum wage could go from €1,450 to €2,000. It's possible.
You proposed 30 measures to achieve that. 30% still seems completely huge.
Yes, but look at Geneva's minimum wage of €3,800 net. Adjusted for cost of living, it's equivalent to €2,500 in France. That's €1,000 more. So 30% is a minimum. The problem is whether the French want to earn more. I hear from a taxi driver whose brother-in-law earns more on unemployment watching TV. The Yellow Vests were demanding more money. We need to make work pay.
My brother, he will earn more on unemployment but for a short time.
Yes, but behind that, there are benefits. I know many people who work only 15 hours a week to keep their housing aid. We wrote in our book that it's not normal. Those who work must earn more. We proposed four ways to earn more.
That might be the next question. If it's so simple and understandable, why don't we manage to implement it?
Because we have a culture of the welfare state. The state has become obese with 1,200 agencies and one million too many civil servants compared to Germany. We have six layers of administration: commune, community, agglomeration, metropolis, department, region, nation. Switzerland has three. That's 500,000 too many. Also, 35% of hospital staff are administrative, compared to 25% in Germany. We have 1,200 agencies created in 20 years, half are redundant. The state has not managed its expenses for 40 years. We propose optimizing the social model: retirement at 32, 35-hour week, generous unemployment benefits – all that costs. If we align with European levels (12 months of unemployment, retirement at 67 gradually), we can save €450 billion in 10 years. That's 15% of GDP. We distribute it: 200 billion for wage increases, 150 billion to reduce the deficit, 150 billion for investment in defense and the planet.
But how can we do that in a country where this morning Élisabeth Borne used Article 49.3 to pass pension reform, and then the current government says we must wait until 2027 to talk about it again?
We'll never move forward. Surreal.
It's surreal. Our task is to feed political parties with these 30 reforms and a positive vision for France. We believe we can achieve 2% growth per year, like Switzerland. France has been at 1% for 20 years, this year 0.5%. Because people are afraid to invest. This situation may last until May 2027, with parties saying anything. We must hold on and re-enchant work and industry. Young people are afraid of climate change, resource depletion. We transform those fears into opportunities for innovation, startups, jobs. Artificial intelligence is productivity. French engineers are strong. We can increase industry from 10% of GDP to 15%, create a million jobs, and return to full employment where wages rise. I am convinced. This is a bad moment, but we see the future positively.
Yet, excuse me, during Covid, we saw that we were dependent on other countries, we tried to relocate our industry, it didn't really work. Why would it work now?
It didn't work much because we need a strong will. I'm happy that the French now have 70% esteem for business leaders. Trust is returning. For industry, we need a stable business-friendly environment. You invest in a factory for 30 to 50 years. Today's instability is bad. We need a stable tax system and an inciting fiscal policy. The Zucman tax was a scandal, taxing people who reinvest in their businesses. It caused 20 of my competitors to disappear. France's industry went from 20% to 10% of GDP. Italy has 10,000 mid-sized companies, Germany 15,000, France only 5,000. We need to stop taxing success and instead attract talent. We must choose: do we want to develop startups with inciting taxes or not?
Yes, that tax needed to be reviewed. It was much talked about.
Yes. The Zucman tax targeted 1,800 wealthy households, but it hurt family-owned industrial companies. We need to stop attacking those who create jobs. France needs to be motivating and inciting. Otherwise, we'll wake up with 10-15% unemployment in three years.
Maybe we'll end on that. These proposals are numerous, the 30 measures in your book. This book is actually the support for a very human and practical initiative: IDS. Can you tell us in a few words what IDS is and why you are on the Côte d'Azur?
