Your guest now in the big live interview on Boursorama, it's Bertrand Dumazy, CEO of Edenred. Hello.
With us on Boursorama, specialist leader in French meal vouchers and employee benefits. We were just talking about central banks meeting today and tomorrow. Do you fear, as a business leader and even as a citizen, especially as a business leader, this extension of the conflict in Iran that could potentially derail the global economy?
So yes, like all business leaders, we are very concerned about the situation in the Middle East. But then we need to get into the specifics of Edenred. For me, first, I have 200 employees in Dubai, so my priority is their safety. So teleworking and placing them where their safety is not in danger. The second priority is obviously taking care of our clients in the Emirates since we have 2 million people using Edenred solutions out of the 60 million. 2 million out of the 60 million who carry Edenred either on a card or on their mobile phone, and thus ensuring them quality and continuity of service to ensure that the most normal life possible can be led. That's my second priority. The third thing is that this conflict creates inflation, first energy inflation with oil prices, and we have solutions to limit that. That is, when you use Edenred solutions, when you use a fuel card or an energy card, it's a way to control how and where money is spent. And so, we have many un-equipped clients calling us saying 'Ah, maybe it's time for us to switch to using a fuel card or an energy card.' And it's the same for purchasing power in general since inflation could return, and we have solutions for that because being the leader, not French but global, in employee benefits, we contribute globally. I read we are the 4th European player.
So the 4th European player for mobility, the mobility solutions. 4th in Europe, first in Latin America. But on the employee benefits solutions, by far the first player globally. So you follow the situation day by day.
We follow it very closely, and it also has another impact on the evolution of interest rates since like all companies we finance ourselves on the financial markets. We feel a tension on rates. Sovereign rates, I haven't looked at corporate rates, but on sovereign rates we have taken between 30 and 40 basis points, which is not nothing in 15 days. It turns out that our refinancing for the year was done a few months ago. So we are well-covered.
So you follow that day by day, your employees who are on the ground, and no business impact to date?
No business impact to date. Again, opportunities to accelerate the penetration of our products. There is one issue that really worries me: capitalism doesn't like uncertainty. And uncertainty creates uncertainty for our clients as well. And since we are in markets that are largely underpenetrated, we need to convince clients to use Edenred solutions even more. When there is uncertainty, this effort is a bit more difficult.
In terms of, sorry, it's quite concrete, but are you scaling back on certain trips? Are there investment decisions that are being put on standby?
So on trips, yes, we are very careful. For example, I am supposed to be in Turkey and Dubai in April, and for now the trips are maintained but we will decide at the last minute. My duty is to be close to the teams even when there are drones jumping left and right and to show them that life goes on and we must move forward. So I think the leader has an imperative duty on this, but going to the point of putting oneself completely in danger, there is a limit, and a limit that we will evaluate a few days before departure.
Hm. Bertrand Dumazy, you published your annual results at the end of February. It was a complicated year in terms of regulatory reforms that were unfavorable to you. We'll talk about Brazil and Italy, but you achieved all your financial targets in this context. One might think it wasn't easy. Is it a source of satisfaction to achieve these objectives with so many headwinds?
Well, not only did we achieve them, we exceeded them. We exceeded market expectations. So, I think the lesson we can draw is the great resilience of the group. That is, effectively 6% revenue growth, 11% operating profit growth, EBITDA margin at 41%, up 200 basis points, and that is proof of the great resilience of the group. In fact, Edenred has multiple product lines, multiple countries, multiple management teams, and that means we are constantly compensating one market with another when the winds are less favorable. So indeed, the winds were less favorable in Italy, but that's behind us. We are back to double-digit growth in Italy. We are in a phase of reinvention for part of our business in Brazil, but we have many other assets up our sleeve to compensate for the less favorable winds. And in fact, this is what showed the year 2025, the very great resilience of the Edenred group, but also the will to prepare for the future since not only did we achieve our objectives, but we also significantly reduced our debt level, which fell by 30%.
Yes yes yes yes. We'll talk about it. I was wondering how you did it, but we'll talk about this shock of regulatory reforms in Italy and Brazil. Ultimately, how much does the bill cost you in 2025?
So if we take a static view, then we'd have to look at the dynamic, but in Italy it costs us 120 million euros in operating profit. That is, the redefinition of the rules costs us 120 million euros when we take a snapshot at the end of the year. You and the other market players as well. The 120 million euros is for us, but the bill is also with the other market players. That's a static view. From there, we are back to double-digit growth. Why? Because the Italian market remains very largely underpenetrated with the solutions we offer. And secondly, the government, which wants more meal vouchers in Italy, redefined the rules to ensure the sustainability of the system but also sent a very positive signal since at the end of December, Parliament voted for a 25% increase in the face value.
It's very good. That is, the Italian government said loudly, we want more meal vouchers in Italy. That's why we know we have good growth to go after in Italy on a system that has been redefined, which hadn't been redefined in 30 years. The new rules have been set. It's up to us to make them fruitful.
So in Italy, no more bad surprises. Now it's over. Now we start anew on new bases.
And at the same time with a face value that has increased by 25%. So we start on good bases.
Exactly. So the bill, we paid 60 million euros in 2025, there are 60 million additional euros to reach the 120 million by the end of 2026. So 2026 is a rebasing year in Italy, but we know that underlyingly and after 2026, we are back to double-digit growth. In Brazil, it's a bit different.
In Brazil, it's 10% of your revenue. I'm talking about your control. Regulatory change. Basically, the commissions paid by merchants have been cut in half, right?
Uh no, not half, let's say rather a large third, a third, to be precise.
It's not yet in effect. I read that you obtained a suspension of the decree, but a judgment on the merits will come by the end of the year.
So it's true that you are still in the fog. We don't really know how it will all end.
In the meantime, the suspension of the decree has been suspended, but there are other actions ongoing.
