What's going to happen in the midterms? Why is Elon Musk a unique danger to the democracy? And what happens after them? Wow, that's a lot. Guess what? I have somebody who can check every box uniquely well. Who? Oh, I'll tell you. Chris Cuomo here. Welcome to the Chris Cuomo Project. Kara Swisher. Not only does she have a top five political podcast, even though she doesn't really come out of politics, but she knows tech. She knows Musk. She knows what's happening in the country right now with MAGA. She's seen it through different ways. She's putting out content all the time. She's talking to people all the time and she has her own predictions about what she thinks is going to happen in the midterms. Some of which I get, some of which I don't get. But we're in question everything mode, right? That's why I'm selling the merch because we're critical thinkers. We're free agents. And Kara Swisher is a major point of view in America right now. So, what does she know? Why does she believe it? And what does she think is going to happen next, which I think is the most interesting part of the conversation you're about to hear. Oh, and then there's a kicker for you. She had a take that people didn't like about the Elizabeth Holmes film that's out right now. Why is it getting so much traction? She's got a take on that, too. So, let's get after it. [music]
Hey, Kara. I want to say first, and because here I can say whatever I want. I really appreciate what you and not just with Galloway, but what you're doing, what you're putting out there. First thing is us as adults. You ain't never seen it like this, my friend. You ain't never seen it like this. No. Neither have I. We always say the division. We always say the two. We always say this election. We always say everything's always hyperbolic. Not like this. This is different, what we're living through right now.
Here's what's different. It's the leaders that are different. I think people are not. I do, I still, I believe in the voters. I don't think there's as much anger among regular people as they think there is. I think it's the leaders who are willing to do things like Vivek Ramaswamy or something else. You know, that to me is the issue more than anything, because when you go around, there's so much more commonality among voters and people, and you see it in other countries right now, like people do bind together even with differences, and there are significant differences. But at some point everyone's had enough, and I think what they have had enough of is Donald Trump, like happened at the last season of The Apprentice. We've had enough of this nonsense. And so I think even his supporters, you know, as much as they like their tax breaks or 'I don't like what he says, but he does really well for the economy,' you know, 'I'll put up with whatever racist, misogynist thing he's going to do that day or kooky thing' mostly in general. And now they're just like, you know what, we're not getting anything out of the deal. And so why should we put up with this hatred, really, that just spews from him on the daily? It's really pretty ugly. The pivot, and again, this isn't new.
But the pivot to what we used to call culture wars. I don't even know that that's what it is anymore, but...
Do you think that it's getting traction that will matter electorally? The Islamophobia, the otherization, the freak show stuff. Do you think that it could be enough to make a difference in races?
No. Because of the economy. No. Because of prices. I mean, look, we've always had this. Both of our grandparents, and my grandparents came from Italy, like, and got a lot of incredible attacks for years and years and years. And the...
Now, people cut me off right there and they say, 'No, no, this is different. No, no. Islam's different.' It is.
Yeah. Italians had a hard time, but Islam's different. These people are different. Their book is different. They do bad things. You guys weren't terrorists.
They just, then they're uneducated, obviously, on the situation. And so what are you going to do if people, you know, are willfully ignorant? You know, I just feel like it's just a lot of, we've done this over and over again in this country over whoever it happens to be. I mean, I thought actually Elie had a very good point about JFK. Do you remember when he said he was going to take instructions from the Pope? That was pretty ugly, you know, and weird, and this idea of what Catholics are. Or now Catholics haven't exactly, you know, covered themselves in glory over the many years recently, but that's a different story. I just think Islamophobia is the latest, is the same thing as all of them. And it is ugly if you can't separate certain people from other people based on what they say versus their religion or their faith or anything else.
So, there's an ad he has out right now which I think is certainly clever. It's a twist on the deadly ad that they had against Harris and the Democrats of 'they are for they/them, we are for you.' Or...
He's using that as a tagline.
And the part that's a little woah to me is he's got people, maybe I'm being just sensitive to it, they look like stereotypical Jews. Like if I was going to try to picture some kind of effigy of Jewish people, and they're sitting in a grocery store talking about what to buy. And they say, 'Put the eggs back. We need that money to give the money to kill the Palestinians.' And they're like, 'Oh, why do we have to pay for that?' And they're like, 'Well, this is what it is.' And it's an Elie ad against Rogers. And they're like, 'What about universal health care? Are we going to have to pay for that, too? Why do we have to pay for all this shit?' And it's Mike Rogers is for they/them. Meaning those two Jews sitting in that supermarket, 'I am for us.'
I didn't see it that way, but you could see that. I could see that. All this political advertising has gotten disgusting, I think.
What's your read on that ad? What do you think?
I didn't have, I just, it's like they want to, you know, push on young people. They're worried about money abroad. I think the war in Iran, are we giving too much money to Israel? These are debates to have, right? And it doesn't have to have anti-Semitism attached to it. It's, you know, I know from having a young, I mean, I have a son who's in Michigan. He's worried about that. Like, there's no way he is anti-Semitic. But he questions our commitments in Iran. He questions our funding for Israel. He thinks about not being able to buy a house. Like, he loves universal... See, I was just at Michigan. You see I'm wearing it for the weekend. Go blue. And he goes there. He's a senior and a lot of those kids are just worried about, they're very attracted to Medicare for all. And I have to say, I went to the Big House for the game that they lost. It was a good game. And there was mostly Abdul El-Sayed signs. I didn't see one Mike Rogers sign, I can tell you that. And it was 'vote, vote, vote Abdul, vote blue,' vote something like that. It was all over the place. So I think young people are very attracted to the idea, and that you don't have to immediately accuse them of anti-Semitism when they have concerns. And I think, but it does veer into that, obviously, anti-Semitism is...
For some. And look, that ad to me is problematic, and his answer, who is worse for America, Iran or Israel, and his pause on that. But as you said, it is a debate to have, not on that level to me. I mean, the regime in Iran, I don't think you could find anybody worse. But today, and I'm getting heat for it right now while we speak, Bibi should lose. Bibi is reflective of Israel the same way Trump is reflective of America. I mean, the country is not Bibi. And the guy was on trial for corruption. He's very divisive. And people are saying to me, 'We lost Cuomo.' No, no, no, no, no, no. I believe in Israel, not just its existence. I believe in its people. He's a problem, this guy, and he should lose to this guy. But they're saying that the guy who may beat him may not be able to put a government together.
Well, maybe not. I mean, that's how we see trouble.
That's how he's taken advantage of that situation and be, you know, same, you know, that's how he's taken advantage of the situation is...
But he is the wedge, right? And I think he's going to wind up being a wedge for the Israelis, even though he's got such an easier time than we do in this country because they have a real existential issue that the people there vote on differently than everything else. They have a yea or nay that we don't have, or we shouldn't.
Were you surprised at all? That Trump started calling him Muhammad? Elie said that Trump came out and said Ramaswamy's ad is great. Did either of those things surprise you, or do you see...
Hussein Obama? No, I don't. No, that's how he does, that's how he works it, you know. That's how he does it.
I would... Oh, which one?
The mom is a good person.
Terrible ad. It was a terrible ad.
I know. But I'm saying that Trump said, 'Don't keep the ad. Keep running it.'
Chris, I think you're not surprised. I think not at all. Anytime. He never misses a chance to be a jackass. He really doesn't, especially unkind towards women. He never misses a chance to make a dig. He never misses a chance. This is his brand. And honestly, I'm not even sure he knows what's going on. I have to say, his, like, he, all those expressions he makes now, he goes from thing to thing.
I guess where I'm coming at it from is if we're seeing Trump really go as low as he can because of the desperation in a way that there's like no mitigation. There's no mitigation. Never anything but the worst.
You remember this? No. No. John McCain is not a war hero. I don't know, shall we stack rank his terribleness? You know I do. No. No. This is, I, Barack Hussein Obama. It's the same. It's the greatest hits. Let's hit someone with an Islamic name. Let's hit a woman. Let's talk about her boobs. Let's talk about someone's ass. [music]
Election season comes with a lot of noise. Polls, predictions, forecasts, analysis, all over the place. It can be hard to keep up with everything. That's why I love Polymarket. I just love what it's about. Why? It's easy and it's people putting their money where their mouth is, which is such a commodity for me when it comes to political opinion and analysis. You know, this is the easy way for you to know what people think is going to happen. And now you can trade on your own predictions or just follow the odds for control of Congress, individual races, and other midterm outcomes. Polymarket also just launched a new midterm hub that puts everything you want in one place. You can follow specific states, candidates, policies, races without having to jump around everywhere. It's easy and it's effective. So, there's a lot on the line this election and I'll definitely be following along with Polymarket and you should, too. Download the Polymarket app to stay on top of the midterms. New customers can deposit $10 and get $25 to trade instantly with the code CUOMO. Okay? Use my name as a code CUOMO and your $10 will become $25. I'm telling you, Polymarket is more than just people's feeling in the moment. It's who is willing to put their money where their mouth is. [music]
So, do you believe that MAGA is going to be beaten by the same kind of thing, which is outrage and rejection? Because I'm having a hard time believing... I believe we need a change of control. I believe you need checked power. I always feel that way. I feel it especially now. But I can't believe... the prediction markets. And I like the prediction markets because I like people putting money where their mouth is. I think polling, the alchemy's not right, but like for instance, Polymarket, 64% chance of controlling the Senate, Democrats. I can't believe that it's so hard to turn the seats. Do you think that's right?
I do. If you go out, and I've been traveling a lot lately, and I have to say people are pissed. People, all kinds of people are pissed, and I have a lot of Trump relatives and they've had it with him. Like they just, they're not getting the thing. Look, they'll look, 'we're here for the racism, whatever, as long as prices are low.' Just a second, prices aren't low. And I hate to say that about people I'm related to, but that's what they're like. They're very practical in that regard. They don't, they zone out the nastiness. They zone out the autocracy. And but hey, when the gas prices are up, no way, dude. And so he's not delivering what he said he was going to deliver. They don't feel... I think people are tired on all sides of being... they're sick and tired, like Obama said, they're sick and tired of being sick and tired. And even, like, even the, not all the left obviously, but the censorious left, they're like, 'oh whatever, like say whatever,' like they've stopped getting quite so mad about what people say. I think everybody is like, 'enough of being angry.' Now it pops up all the time. I like, I went and saw that Nathan Fielder movie and I had a take and people did not agree with Kara Swisher, and I was like, 'Oh my god, that's my... like calm the fuck down.' Like it's just a movie, and I happen to know her. I happen to have met her many times. So I just, I have a take that I think...
But they're amped up because... And I do think this is different. There is no openness to the other side. This is good and evil. This is existential. Look, it's artificial. It's manufactured. I don't think it's as manufactured on the left because I got to tell you what we see with ICE. People are afraid of what they're doing. People with green cards who are here legally are afraid to drive. Kara, I mean, they tell me all... I'm like, 'Well, no, you're legal. You're here. You didn't come across the border.'
I ran across someone yesterday who was worried about their... they're from Germany. They were like, 'I don't know. I don't want to leave the country.' My son had a girlfriend who couldn't go back home to Brazil because she didn't, you know, it was like all over the place. And those are minor things. I'm working on a book with someone who Marco Rubio is trying to deport. He's British. He's got an American wife and child. It's just, this is just everyone to me where we've gotten this is just my feeling is maybe people thought we had two loose borders. Fine. Good thing to debate. Likely, right? Likely. Not like this. Okay. This is not how we're... not this. Maybe we, you know, people have gotten too woke, maybe. But not what they're doing now, the book banning. Like it just goes that extra step. And I think that's where everyone is with Trump is like, and the same thing with Elon Musk that you... I mean, it's like enough, like...
Yes. I want to get $100 million. Are you... look, I want to get into it. It's like the money and how scary is it that a record number of money, not the top of my hit list on him about what he represents. It's still whatever he did with Palantir and DOGE. I'm going to get to that, but I just want to see if you agree with these two things. 50-50 in the prediction markets on Polymarket that the Democrats win Texas, Michigan, and Maine Senate things. I would look, I'm not a great prognosticator, but I'd be like, 'No, no, no. I mean, there's a lot going against you to win all three.' Absolutely. 50-50.
Yeah. Well, I think maybe people are tired of Susan Collins. That's a tougher one. She's got a barnacle-like way of staying in her office. Michigan, I think, I have to tell you, I was just there. He is, he's a better candidate. Like, get away from everything else. Like, first of all, I know it sounds dumb, but he's like handsome, young, fresh, jacked. Like I...
And he's what the Democrats want. Like people like, I don't know, he's got an attitude. He's chippy. Yeah. That's what they want.
Yeah. Exactly. They want someone who doesn't take, you know, like, 'oh, I don't want to do what he does. I'm not going to say even like that Obama like, hey, I don't really get into it and then I'll say something clever about it in the third reference.' This guy's like, 'yeah, fuck you. You don't want to go? Let's go.'
Couldn't be different. Couldn't be different from Ted Cruz. You know, there was a really funny meme where it was like, El-Sayed, you know, 'what kind of ice cream do you like?' He's like, 'coffee. I'll have the coffee and then I'll kick your ass.' Like that was his. And Ted Cruz is like, 'I'd like the vanilla with sprinkles.' They couldn't be more different as candidates, but they're both good candidates, right?
I like Mark Cuban backed him. He was one of the first people who learned...
I like him for Democrats. I wish that...
He might run as a Republican. I told him to run as a Republican and fuck them up. It would be so good.
That would be bad. They're worried about Alaska.
So, the other one is you're talking about running for president. I can't believe anybody. So, the Polymarket right now, and again these things...
You love this Polymarket, don't you? I just had dinner with the CEO. He's very smart.
I like, I don't know them, but I like putting money where your mouth is.
Yeah, it can. You know what I mean? It can be gamed. You know that.
How can Newsom be a 20%? How can he be leading the field right now? Does anybody believe that he's going to be the Democrat?
A little early, wouldn't you say? Like there's no other names. This is all on name recognition.
Maybe that's what it is. Maybe it's just straight recognition, right? You know, he's well known. He's really good at mixing it up with Trump. Don't you think the Democrats will want their own disruptor, that it's going to be someone who kind of comes from the outside?
I think the Republicans have more of a problem fixing their problem. But I think there's going to be like 26 people, like there's like 26. Great. They're all going to argue with each other. Great. They're going to be a better candidate. Great. We're going to hear...
And by the way, they won't. They won't. This is too big. And they're going to talk about policy and they're going to have like, you know, this idea that DSA is all one person. It isn't. It's different versions. There's DSA adjacent. There's DSA this. Some of the things people like. My son loves Medicare for all. Okay. He just does. I would say he's centrist. Like I think it's going to be this great big 26 people duking it out and we're going to have that they're going to have a great candidate, right? They're going to have a better... The Republicans have to do the same thing and they may or may not. If they sort of sit there with a limp JD Vance limping his way in, it's...
I can't believe Vance makes it through with all this shit that he's doing right now. Everybody knows he's a shapeshifter, but it's so grotesque. It's so in your face, you know, he doesn't believe it.
I think he's repugnant to voters. I don't... Without Trump standing next to him, I called him, he had the charm of a Cybertruck as a politician. Just like, no. Like there's six people who go, 'I want that.' And then you're like, no. Most people go, 'Oh, I don't think so.' You know, and so I just... That's it. That's where I... You just look at him and you're like, 'No, no, sir.' So...
You also went to school with someone like him, right?
Oh, yeah. Look, I know guys like him. Look, his origin story is amazing. His success is uniquely American. Only here. Great. What he's done with it, sure, forget it.
I don't know. I don't know. I knew, I met him when he was a venture capitalist, and my favorite, and he wasn't very good at it, I'll tell you that, and leaves behind many people who agree with me on that one. But my favorite expression, Rachel Maddow said, 'he's Peter Thiel's failed intern,' which...
It is good, but it's a sophisticated way to look at him. I mean, I think at the end of the day he's a shapeshifter for... he's bought. Americans don't like that. Americans don't like that. They know when you're faking the funk and it's a problem. You know, that's what Trump's saving grace and man grace is in all caps on that one, is that, well, this is who he is. This is...
There's a bunch of them. David McCormick from Pennsylvania, very attractive candidate. There's, you know, I hate, I can't believe I'm saying this, but Kevin Stitt is interesting. I just met him. I'm like, I don't agree with him on a lot of stuff, I can tell you that. You know, I like Tom Tillis, like even though I call him Too Late Tom because he took so long to turn. But it's only, they only talk like him when they're leaving. Right. Yeah, exactly. That's why I call him Too Late Tom. Yeah. And that, look, that's the problem.
Yeah, but they kind of... he had a good point, and I don't love it, but he said, you know what, a martyr is someone who's dead. Like he has a point. There is no getting out of the tractor beam of Trump. And so the Republican Party has to have a real come-to-Jesus meeting. So maybe not so much Jesus, but like maybe...
They need less Jesus, but they need to figure out where they're going. It'll be a really interesting moment. And who is going to... like they need an invigorated group of... think about all the Democratic candidates. They're every size and shape and interesting. They all have interesting parts to them. So, they need that. Both parties.
I just wish they had an Alaska model. I wish they had a top four. I wish we had ranked choice. I just think like, I love that Alaska is in the news for a hot second for the wrong reason. I'm not bothered by what Blanch is doing there, frankly, legally. Whatever. He hasn't crossed the line yet. The motivations are bad. And the irony is that people don't know. Sullivan benefited from exactly what they're saying right now. When Sullivan first ran, there was another Sullivan running who was a mayor who was very popular, and it helped him get in. Sure. I mean, honestly, on that whole thing, wet candidate, you'll win. Like, that's it. That's it. That's pretty much it.
Support [music] for the Chris Cuomo Project comes from Soul. If you've heard me talk about Soul before, you know that they're out-of-office gummies for me. They work, all right? They're drinks for me. They work as an alcohol alternative to relaxation. I say I'm closing some of the applications that are open in my mind. That's why I take them and they work for me, okay? They are now six years strong in making these hemp-derived out-of-office THC gummies that have provided a great alcohol alternative to me. On December 11th, a national hemp ban takes effect, okay? And it's going to impact the entire hemp industry. After that date, Soul can no longer sell out-of-office THC gummies. [music] So, they come in a range of strengths. They come in a range of different amounts so that you can have different experiences. But I'm telling you, you better stock up now just like I am. Now through December 11th, Soul is offering listeners up to 60% off their entire order. Just go to getsoul.com and use the code CUOMO. That's getsoul.com promo code CUOMO for up to 60%. And don't wait. All right. Some strengths are already selling out because they can't make any more of them because they've got to prepare for this stupid ban that is coming that they had nothing to do with. After December 11th, they'll be gone for good. So, if you believe in these the way I do, do what I'm doing and stock up now. [music]
Which takes me to why I begged Kara to come on today. All right. Elon Musk to me is the personification of the problem of wealth. Abonicio, I don't even think the guy is in the country legally because I believe it was fraud in the inception.
His brother said, 'We're in a weird gray area. We're in a weird gray area.'
A lot of people are in a weird gray area. I think we shouldn't litigate that. We shouldn't do it with Ilhan Omar. Any of them. Come on. Stop it. Like this is the kind of thing. Look, he's here. He's an American citizen. If you want to investigate it, go ahead. But to me, you need to...
I'm not saying investigate it. I'm just saying his money got him through it in a way that other people can't.
Well, he wasn't rich when that happened. Right. He wasn't... I met him. I knew him then. He didn't have...
Right. But he had people with money who wanted him here who helped him get around the process.
Welcome to the United States of America.
But they're chasing those guys. If that guy was doing this for Basher... Andy Basher, they would be trying to throw him out of the country right now.
So then you got what? That's not my... That's not my top hit by far. The money that he's putting into elections.
Mine is DOGE. I don't know what he did with Palantir and what they're doing with the databases, but there's no way DOGE...
And his involvement was what they told us it is about. It was not about cutting money, Kara. It was not about changing because everybody knew he didn't have any acumen in that area. They did something else. And I don't know what it is, but that's what I'm worried about with this guy. And that's why they protect him.
Well, you should worry about it with this guy. You know what I mean? You should worry about everything because one, he can be very mendacious on whatever topic, just like with Ukraine. Like the time when he said, when he tweeted that, I put out, I'm like, he's lying, and then he was lying, right? Because that's what he does. He does whatever, you know, he's very Trump-like in that way. He'll try.
And then again, money and power. Where else in American history has a private individual ever had this kind of hand in open warfare, helping the president? The president said, 'Oh, I don't know anything about it.' You know he's lying, and now this guy's lying, and there's no accountability and no voice about it. And they literally...
He now said it is killing Ukrainians. He said it is him. He said he did it. Like...
Yeah, because it was going to come out. But yeah, yeah, of course. Meaning he's a liar. Hello, he lied. Yeah. But I think one of the things, I think you need to absolutely focus... I agree that, look, I'm about to interview Michael Lewis, who wrote a book about the blockers of DOGE, which is great. And then there's Jacob Weisberg who has profiles and cowardice. I do think Elon does a lot of flimflam around, you know, sort of the idolatry of innovators that they must be smart because they're rich, and he takes advantage of that. And look, that's our own fault for falling for it. But one of the things that I focus in on, I mean, look, you can focus in on his crazy tweets. He just threatened me the other day. Like, fine, whatever. You can focus on his white supremacy tweets, or he's obsessed with trans, or he's obsessed with James Talarico largely because he's going to ruin his party in Texas. I don't pay attention. Look, I don't like any of that, but I'm focused on the money. He's got a ton of money, possibly a lot of data that could be problematic, an ability to fuck with an election. Talk about, you know, I always say every accusation is a confession. Every time he says something, I'm like, 'Oh, you did that, didn't you?' Like, 'Oh, look what you did today.'
I mean, look what he did with Twitter.
I mean, Twitter is a dumpster fire for MAGA. I've lost 200... I don't really care about this stuff, but I've lost followers there.
I don't use it. I haven't used it for four years because of him. I've gained followers. I have now 1.9 million. It's crazy. I hate you, Twitter. Stop following me. I don't know what to say.
I mean, for me, it's like you got to go on there because that's, you know, the business is to engage. But...
You don't got to go on there, Chris.
Well, I mean, look, to me, it's like you got to go where the people are. I am no longer... I'm coming to your way of thinking, which is...
I don't change anybody's minds. I'm not changing anybody's mind.
One, what people... Second, I have the number four news podcast in the world. I am not on Twitter. How does that help all the people that are yammering on Twitter? They're down around 400. Sorry, it does.
You don't need it. I'm not going to lecture you. If you want to be in a Nazi porn bar, Chris, please have at it. Have a schnoz. That's my jam.
Have a schnoz. If there's one thing I like, it's Nazi porn. That is my fetish. Stop outing me like that.
But he changed it. So we talk about the media and influence in the media, and he's chasing after CBS or whomever, and fine, but look what this guy did.
Yeah. And MAGA is fine with it. And it's like, come on. I mean, I think that's going to matter.
I would focus on the money, but you know, the money has always played an important role in politics. I'm not so sure it's going to play as big a role as it does sometimes, because look, he went into Wisconsin and tried to change those judgeships. That's $25 million blown. Any of this money he spends is money well spent for Elon Musk because if he can at least stave off the Democrats in some fashion, he will. Like with DOGE, he went in and got rid of the agencies that were investigating him. He got rid of them. Like he got rid of every... there was like seven, I forget how many investigations, all gone. When the Democrats return, and this is why he threatened me with some sword or something like that, I said, 'When the Democrats return, guess what's going to happen? It's hell to pay, right? Of course it is.' And that I was just factually speaking because I've been talking to them. And it's not just Democrats. It's some Republicans are like, 'Not cool, dude. What you did there.' And so I think he's got... they're all going to be back. And so he wants to mitigate how many there are. I suspect he will continue, you know, through the presidential election to fund things to try to control the situation. But a lot of these tech people, not just Elon, have figured out these, especially Trump, are coin-operated. You put the money in and you get contracts out, you get influence out, you get no legislation out, you get self-policing AI, whatever that is. You know, you get whatever you want. And that's what they want. And so it's relatively easy to put money in and get the stuff out. And he's already made more money through his contracts than he's lost in any that he's spending here. It's nothing. It's a parking ticket to him.
I mean, we have never seen anything. You know, someone said to me the other day, I was like, 'this Trump man, the way they're making money right in your face, the way he's doing it,' and you know, the guy said, 'well, I mean, this is what these people do.' I said, 'Oh, not like this.'
No. And that's got to start to matter at some point.
Remember when they were mad at Hillary Clinton's defense? Remember when they were mad at Hillary Clinton for a speech after she left? I don't give a fuck of three...
Scott Jennings just put out a tweet about Obama. Talk about weak sauce.
Oh, he just got paid 500 grand for a speech. He hasn't had a meal under 250 bucks. And who are you talking about? I know. He's not president.
But it shows how weak the ammo is.
Has very expensive taste, I suspect, too. So,
But I mean, look, the fact that this guy is now a star for CNN tells you something about the sign of the times.
Don't go there with me and Scott Jennings. Just
But I mean, look, he used to sit next to me. I used to have him on set on a regular basis. He was one of the first big time with Kellyanne. Kellyanne was with Cruz in 2015. They used to go at Trump personally like, 'Hey, I don't, he's not, I'm not taking him seriously as a policy person.' So, I want to answer your question. This is a bad person, okay? And that matters to us. I know it doesn't matter to you, Chris, and people. I know, but to me, it matters. Okay. Character counts. He was part of that.
He was part of that. Wow.
