FLASHBACK: Nicolás Maduro Interview From 2021 on US Relations, Oil Industry

It's a great pleasure and honor for me to be here.

Thank you.

First of all, Venezuela is not and has not been isolated. That's the perception given by the world media campaign. Venezuela has great friends and allies in the world. In Latin America, the Bolivarian Alliance for the Peoples of Our America is going strong. In Africa, Asia. The world is not only the West. The West should understand that. America should understand the world is bigger. In the 21st century we have a multipolar world. We're connected with the new emerging developing poles, with the new powers. And we're expecting to restore our relations with the governing elite in Washington. Our relation with American society is good, as well as with academic centers, activist, labor and intellectual movements, and all of American society. It's only tense and confrontational with Washington governing elite. We hope to restore our communication channels, our dialogue and mutual respect. And we hope to reestablish a collaborative relationship with the United States as a whole and with its government, of course.

Let's remember, Erik, that we coped with four years of Trump's administration. Four years of direct aggressions, of cruel sanctions, and of damage to Venezuelan economy and society. The policy Trump established and left as legacy against Venezuela is an extremist one, an irrational one that broke relations between the United States and Venezuela. And it's been questioned several times and considered by the United Nations human rights organizations a policy that abuses Venezuelan human rights. According to polls, over 84% of Venezuelan population rejects all of these cruel criminal sanctions, which we call trade and economic blockade and persecution. Even Venezuelans in Florida who claim to be an influential group for U.S. elections, in a poll in 'Miami Herald,' 56% of them, Venezuelans living in Florida, reject these coercive measures against their country. So my belief is that something like that cannot be part of a legacy worthy to follow. President Joe Biden came to power with a message to the world. In his first speech on January 20, he spoke against demonization in politics. I'd suggest President Biden to put a stop from the White House, and the State Department to the demonization of Venezuela, of the Bolivarian Revolution, and of President Nicolas Maduro and find ways to get closer, to be more respectful and beneficial to each other. That will allow us to restore U.S.-Venezuelan relations.

Can I be truly honest? There hasn't been any signals.

None. It's been five months, he's just settling in. The only difference that you may hear from some spokespersons in the White House and the Department of State is that they're willing to engage in political dialogue directly with Venezuela, without mediation, to further democratic changes in the country. That's the only thing, and it's a lukewarm response. The core of Trump's legacy is still in place: financial persecution against Venezuela, technological, industrial, commercial, oil, and political persecution. The only thing we may consider a signal is his more lenient rhetoric. But the opposition, heavily dependent on U.S. money, heavily dependent on USAID's money, on the over 1200 million dollars they received from them, refuse to go to the negotiating table with us.

I think there's an interesting debate going on in the United States about its relationship with Latin America and The Caribbean. About the deplorable Monroe doctrine, which has damaged relations for over 200 years. About Donald Trump's deplorable legacy: aggression, coup attempts, isolation. I think there's an interesting debate about Venezuela. And my message for every political sector, be it senators, representatives, mayors, opinion leaders, intellectuals, or the media, is to refrain from demonizing Venezuelan society. Their demonization of Venezuela is plain wrong. Venezuela's reality is completely different from the one they claim day after day, in campaigns which cost U.S. taxpayers thousands of dollars. They must stop demonizing Venezuela, our revolution, which is democratic, constitutional, and pacific, and President Nicolas Maduro. And instead give real, objective, believable and verifiable signals of negotiation to restore relations between both countries in pursuit of a win-win situation. That's been our goal for a long time.

Totally, we've shown signals already. It's totally possible. The financial sector knows it and the bondholders, too. We've had a remarkable relationship with them. They know they can invest in Venezuela and it'll be a win-win if this persecution and sanctions stop. The oil industry knows it. They've invested in Venezuela and they still do. They know we can move forward. The cultural sector as well. The social sector. The political sector. During Obama's administration, we kept contact all the time. Obama's last four years coincided with my first four. And we were in constant contact with Secretary of State John Kerry, I met him myself several times. We'd talk on the phone regularly. I talked with President Obama in Panama at the Summit of the Americas. Under Secretary Thomas Shannon visited Venezuela regularly. And that communication allowed for a win-win situation in politics and diplomacy, it's definitely possible.

Yes, we've always tried even before Donald Trump's oath on January 20, 2017. Current Vice-President Delcy Rodriguez, former Chancellor of the Republic, was in Washington in the days prior to his taking of the oath. She was at Trump's Tower in Washington. You'll find her on the records. She talked with many people who were close to Trump. And since then, we've kept contact through different channels. Trump's administration was chaotic since day one. The White House and the Department of the State too. Trump's method was mixing things up and imposing his will. He'd say one thing today and the opposite the following day. And he imposed this method. But we always kept contact with him. I was about to personally meet him on September 2018 when I went to the UN General Assembly in New York. We got a call from the White House. But we knew about John Bolton's pressure, and that of other people around Donald Trump to prevent his attempt to meet me. If we had met, it'd be a different story today.

We were to meet in New York. We made all the arrangements by phone to meet in New York. But eventually the pressure was too much for him, for Donald Trump, and that meeting was canceled. Then in 2019 and towards the end of his administration in 2020, before the elections, there was some contact in Mexico, the then Venezuelan Minister of Communication, Jorge Rodriguez, current Parliament president, the National Assembly president, had many talks with delegations from the White House. And there were some pending matters. But all of them were convinced that were Donald Trump to win the elections, he was going to change his policy on Venezuela. He was sick and tired of Juan Guaido. He was against Juan Guaido. And he believed he had failed. John Bolton and others had forced him into that move and made him fail. That was the private message they were communicating to us.

Opening a line of communication, restoring diplomatic relations, getting to a harmonious, collaborative agreement, reactivating oil investments and U.S. economic investments in Venezuela, moving forward and paying bondholders again by lifting the sanctions against our oil industry. And moving forward in any other topic that we have in common on our agenda. That was the main goal.

That's what they were telling us in private. They said many of those efforts failed because of John Bolton's deplorable influence and that of other people.

According to his spokespersons, yes. He'd change his policy. They said they wanted to change their policy. They considered that the change of regime, the attempt to impose Juan Guaido on Venezuela had failed. They wanted to turn the page and start a new phase with direct negotiations with Venezuela's government. That was what they said. We don't know what would have happened had he won. That's a whole different question.

First, every step had its own purpose. The so-called Citgo Six were sent home by the court that handle their case. They were trialed on serious corruption charges as Venezuelan citizens. They were all born, raised, educated and they lived in Venezuela. They have dual citizenship, Venezuelan and American and they had committed serious corruption offences. Deplorable corruption offences that are being dealt in court. It was not my decision. It was the Venezuelan court's decision. The court that's handling their case. As for the new Electoral Council's composition, I think it was a good political negotiation with all of the opposition save for the extremists. The new National Assembly, the new national Parliament, established on January 5, 2021, formed a good electoral council. The five members got off to a good start and organizing Venezuela's mega-elections on November 21, 2021. It was a step in the right direction. As for the World Food Programme, we'd been contemplating it for three, four years. We've had a good relationship with David Beasley. He's a remarkable American man and the World Food Programme's executive director. They're happily working in Venezuela now. I publicly thanks David Beasley for everything he's done and everything he is doing for Venezuela. So I believe, if you have to interpret these three actions that you just mentioned, that you can safely say that Venezuela's institutional and social situation is on the right track.

I should highlight that in the last 20 years, Venezuela has held 26 elections. Presidential elections, parliamentary elections, elections for governors and mayors. We've had referendums for social matters. Including these two: one to approve the constitution and one to reform it. So there has been 26 elections. Out of those 26, we've won 24. We've always had international observation missions. In some cases even from OAS. And they've stated Venezuela's electoral system is one of the best in the world. According to those missions. On one occasion, former American president Jimmy Carter, aware of the emerging mechanism for digital elections, said he'd never seen such a thing in the world. He considered it to be one of the most transparent globally. That automatized election mechanism undergoes 16 audits before, during and after the vote and has been improved and it's legitimate. Now, there's intense and diverse negotiation with every opposition forces. Venezuela doesn't have one opposition force. The opposition is fragmented in several leaders and parties. And right at his moment, there are intense negotiations to extend election safeguards for the November 21 mega-elections. They're doing a good job. I think we'll soon hear good news about new safeguards for November 21 mega-elections.

I can't speak on the American government's behalf. But one thing I tell you, Erik, the election safeguards that will allow for transparent, reliable, verifiable mega-elections will be extended. All of them, according to political negotiations with all opposition forces. And there will be a good outcome. We'll see what the U.S. government thinks of it. But I can tell you this, Erik, we don't do this because of the U.S. demand. We're doing it because it's a constitutional right and our own political conviction and because the country is in the right conditions to negotiate agreements.

Yes, and they're all invited. Invitations have been issued to important political centers, important election expert centers, to global organizations such as the African Union, ASEAN, the European Union. And international observers from the United States, etcetera. They're officially invited.

Not the government, but the electoral power, the election directors. In Venezuela, we have five powers. The classic powers by Montesquieu, that is, the executive, legislative and judicial powers, and two more: moral or civic power, and electoral power. So in Venezuela, any electoral process is ruled, organized and ensured by this power. And they, with the recent decision reached through political negotiations, have issued several invitations to the world. Anybody who wishes to come is welcome.

I think those sanctions are immoral. That's the main thing, they're cruel for any country. And I believe that at the negotiating table, even if it's behind-doors, the United States or Biden's administration should deem them as such. And those actions, just like human rights organization have said, and the special spokesperson that visited us to talk about the sanctions against us, are a serious violation to Venezuelans' human rights. And it's not only a cruel mechanism that attacks the population, it's also a failing mechanism because all of those sanctions were irrationally implemented by Trump's administration against Venezuela to prompt a regime change. And they failed, and will keep failing. So those sanctions should be considered illegal, irrational, extremist and cruel, and they should be lifted.

It's a closed game then, Erik. We have our own principles and constitution. We have a right to life, to economic freedom, to free trade. Venezuela and the whole world have a right to free trade. One country that holds the power of the currency and banking system cannot impose on the rest of the countries what should happen in their political system, who should govern and who should not. If that prevails, it'll be the end of the United Nations, the end of international law. The U.S. must acknowledge the existence of international law and a multipolar world, a world outside of themselves. And sooner than later they must admit that what they're doing to Venezuela is savage, only comparable to the Vietnam War and the massacre they perpetrated against its people. They're perpetrating an economic massacre on us. Venezuela has a right to produce oil freely, to sell it, to make profit from it, to comply with international regulations, to provide for its people. Venezuela has a right to mine ore and sell it. Why shouldn't we have that right? Why are we being prevented from free trade? Why? I have faith that someday... I'm a devout believer, you know? I'm a man of action and prayer. And I believe that message will be heard someday and it will bring the changes we need for a better world, a more humane and respectful world.

We make changes every day in Venezuela. But we shouldn't live in a world where someone can put a gun to your head and demand, 'Do as I say or I'll shoot you.' They can't threaten Venezuela to do as America says. That'd make us a colony. That'd make us a protectorate. That'd be submission, betraying the great historic legacy of giants like Simon Bolivar. No country in the world, let alone Venezuela, would be willing to submit and betray its legacy.

It'll be possible if they restore and normalize the lines of communication. Through communication we'll be able to negotiate and reach agreements. Both countries will benefit from that.

I believe in political negotiation. I've called for political dialogue a thousand times. Venezuela's opposition under Donald Trump's command has refused since 2017 to engage in serious political negotiation. When historic conditions forced them to sit at the negotiation table, they kicked it and left. With that mind, today we offer a negotiation process with the help of the Kingdom of Norway and with the participation and auditing from other countries. That process is yet to start. We're taking the first step to set an agenda mutually agreed upon, a fair, egalitarian agenda. And dialogue should be gradual. There should be gradual and progressive agreements that will lead us to a bigger national agreement. And we'll build trust with partial agreements.

Norway is helping us, it's not mediating. It's helping us communicate. I've always trusted Norway. They're highly professional. Every time they visit us, I welcome them personally. I have long talks with them, I give them my opinion. We treat them with respect. With kindness. So I trust in their help.

Not yet. But I do hope so. Sadly, in the United States, the electoral process has been constantly tampered with as Florida's vote goes. And Florida media is making a dirty campaign against Cuba, Nicaragua, and Venezuela. And sometimes they make things more difficult and make more noise to limit Americans' freedom. Practically all of U.S. administrations in the last 60 years have seen their political power thwarted by Florida's corruption. There are upcoming elections in 2022. Mid-term elections. Let's see how those mid-term elections will influence the American government's policies on our country.

Certainly, I care a lot. That's the result of a 20-year-old campaign. A campaign against a historic process in Venezuela, the Bolivarian Revolution. The powerful, American power elites, and Latin American corrupted oligarchies do not want that process to consolidate and be an alternative to the capitalism and neoliberalism that have filled the Americas, just like the liberator said 200 years ago, with poverty and corruption. Latin America has taken its own course and it should be respected. Every Latin American country has a history, a path, their own demands and fighting causes, and Venezuela has won those fights. Now, there's a fake Venezuela constantly mentioned in the dirty campaign, repeated day after day in the media. Every day, it's unbelievable how much money they invest in campaigns against Venezuela in every country of the world, the USA, in Mexico, Argentina, Colombia, Spain. There's no other country in the world, Erik, that launches more campaigns to slander our social and political life. So there's the media Venezuela. The dirty campaign Venezuela. And there's a real Venezuela. The one we live in. Do we have challenges? Of course, we do. The most powerful country in the world is plotting against us, attempting on my life, trying to incite violence in our country. Is it really surprising that the CIA for almost 60 years has conspired against Latin American changes of power? Is that even new? It's not. They did it to Joao Goulart in Brazil, to Salvador Allende in Chile, to commander Hugo Chavez. They made 300 attempts against Cuban Revolution commander Fidel Castro's life. That's not news, everybody knows about that. We're permanent victims of a national and international conspiracy. But there's a real Venezuela. And real Venezuelans works hard, they love their country, they fight for their country, and we are a democratic, and peaceful country. With challenges? Certainly. Do we face up to them? Definitely. We're a country with huge potential and hope. And little by little we'll go back to the welfare state that has been weakened with the recent sanctions.

There's a real Venezuela that's very different from that of the international campaign. The international campaign makes up lies, and repeat them a thousand times. Other times they exaggerate real issues. They exaggerate them and close in on them. For instance, a conflict with a Colombian drug group at one section of our border will be 'Venezuela lost border control.' They exaggerate and repeat lies a million times. 'The New York Times' will talk about it, 'El Pais' from Spain, 'Semana' magazine from Bogota. They keep repeating the lie. Check the border yourselves. We have a long border with Colombia. For over 60 years, we've been victims of Colombian war on drug trafficking. But our state has that border under control. Is there a conflict? Yes, we're in constant conflict. We declared all of our borders free from drug cultivation and drug production. Look at the Venezuelan side and go some miles into Colombia, and you'll find the kingdom of drug cultivation and drug dealing. The dirty campaign magnifies and invents problems. And they do it constantly, Erik, like no other country in the world. They magnify problems and use that to slander the situation of a country that has challenges, but also has a high morale, courage, and strength. And a country committed to its future.

They've always been a threat. They're part of a project to fill the border with violence. There was an attempt on March 23, 2019. Ivan Duque was in power. An invasion of Venezuela through international bridges. There's always been an attempt to encroach on our border and fill it with violence. And that has risen our citizens' awareness about the need to protect our borders, to enforce our sovereignty. Listen, 80% of cocaine that gets into the United States. Where does it come from? Colombia. Has that number decreased? No, it keeps increasing every year. Coca leaves hectares. Cocaine tons exported to the U.S. If the United States, with their great military power, is flooded with cocaine exportation from Colombia, just imagine the threat we face every day with over 1200 kilometers of direct border with Colombia. You do the math.

Permanent military and police inspection on the border, we...