He is the man who dared to dream on a continent where dreaming big has often come at a price, and today Aliko Dangote stands as living proof that Africa can build world-class institutions from scratch. Born in Kano State into a wealthy trading family, Dangote began his business journey as a young trader with a loan of 500,000 naira from his maternal grandfather, the late Alhaji Al-Hassan Dantata, one of West Africa's most successful businessmen of his era. What followed is one of the most remarkable stories in African business history. From commodity trading to cement, to sugar, to flour, to salt, and now to what could become the world's largest refinery and petrochemical complex, the Dangote Refinery, built at the cost of over $19 billion in the Lekki Free Trade Zone in Lagos, producing refined petroleum products at 700,000 barrels per day, ending Nigeria's painful paradox of being Africa's largest oil producer while importing refined fuel. And this week, Dangote opened his refinery to the Nigerian public through an IPO priced at 525 naira per share in what could become the largest public share offering in African history, valued at approximately 46 billion. His projected net worth of over $38 billion makes him the wealthiest person in Africa and one of the wealthiest in the world. I sat down with Aliko Dangote for an exclusive interview on the people's IPO, fuel prices, his legacy, his family, and his vision for Africa.
Mr. Dangote, thank you very much for joining me on the program.
Great to be here with you, Oji.
Thank you. Now the Dangote Refinery IPO has opened at 525 naira per share, and you have said that you intend to raise 2 trillion naira. Now, we have called it the people's IPO because you say that it isn't primarily about raising money but about giving Nigerians and Africans an opportunity to participate in the business. Now, why is this the right moment to open up the refinery to public ownership?
Thank you, Oji. Well, you know, OJ, it is sort of, it's a dream and it's a vision. At the same time, I know exactly where this company is going to go. This company, give it three years, it will be the biggest company. I'm not talking about our group. No, biggest company in Africa is going to really grow beyond people's imagination. Doesn't matter what. And with the profitability that we have, why are we even going there to list it as an IPO? When we had our private placement, we had a total of three, we were looking for $1 billion.
Initially, when this whole thing started was to raise $2.5 billion.
So the $2.5 billion that we have, which we are to raise, we have number one, which was to do $1 billion of private placement and then the IPO to be 1.5 billion. The IPO for 1.5 billion, that is the most important thing for us, is to now make sure that we bring in democracy into the stock exchange where now small people like my driver, your driver, the cooks, the driver, I mean the market woman, everybody will now be a shareholder like me. And so no matter what we do, we will now carry these people along. And the issue is that you look at what has happened in Amazon, Microsoft, you know, Tesla and co, where people bought shares for little amount, and now those shares, everybody has become a millionaire, some even billionaires. That's the intention. Because if it's not the intention, we have no reason to go and do it. Do you know how much money you are going to pay, you know, stock brokers, advisors, there is going to be a commission. Whereas the one that we did, private placement, we had no cost. It was direct invitation between me and some couple of friends. We were looking for 1 billion and they gave us 3.7 billion. So we had to return 1.2 billion and we took 2.5 billion. The 2.5 billion was what we were looking for in the entire program.
But which we have already met. We returned that money. So that amount of money that we returned, which was 1.2, in this IPO we're only looking for 1.6.
1.6. Now you had said that these shares, you're seeking for them to buy between 50 to 100,000. Those are the people that you're looking at at this point.
But how do you plan to achieve this? Is there like some sort of tranche reserved for them or you're prioritizing those?
We are going to prioritize those smaller people. Yes. Somebody who will come and request for 10 million, you're not going to look at it. Lucky. No, we'll look at it. But we have to satisfy all the smaller ones. All these market women, mechanics, laborers and co. These are the kind of people that we want to get. It's not about getting money. It's about democratizing the capital market. It's about us inviting these people. So let them also understand that look, you know, wealth creation in anywhere starts from capital market and that's what we want to really do. You know what I said before is that we want to, when we are doing annual general meeting, we don't want to go and hold it in any hotel, no, we want to hold it in the stadium. So we are targeting at least something like 10 million shareholders.
10 million shareholders and they're all small retail buyers. But what is the time frame for these retail?
Sometimes even bigger, you know, this, I'm not saying that you shouldn't apply.
Because I'm thinking if I bring 5 million you're going to turn me back.
No, I won't throw you back, but we will now give those priority and then it will be shared according to, you know.
So the question is, is it going to be locked up for the amount of shares for those small retail buyers? Do you know what I mean? Like how do we know when to apply or who?
No, we should just apply. Just apply and pay. You know, if you are lucky, you might even get whatever that you are looking for. But I can assure you, I don't mind to be diluted as much as possible because I want people to actually be part of this good journey.
That's fantastic. Now the IPO values the refinery at roughly about 47 to about 50 billion, 49 billion.
46.3 billion. About 47, less than 46.
About 46 billion. Now what is the fundamental basis for that valuation and what should investors believe the refinery can earn to justify it?
Well, the refinery is going to really earn quite a substantial amount of money and what we are actually basing our own income, the EBITDA and co, we are basing it under the normal circumstance, not this abnormal circumstance where there is war in the Middle East. No, it's not about that at all. If you look at our numbers, that's what it is. And these numbers too, mind you, in January, February, and February we did not really operate because we were doing repairs so that when we start the refinery, it will now start very well. So these numbers are only numbers of really March, April, May, and I'm sure, you know, once we open up the IPO, then it means people will now start buying. By end, before they finish, I'm sure our nine months result will come out and they will see what kind of numbers we're going to have.
Now you have described this as the biggest IPO in African history and you expect it to be massively oversubscribed with a US listing planned once the refinery hits about 1.4 million barrels per day.
Now when Wall Street comes knocking, how do you guarantee the ordinary Nigerian who bought at 525 roughly? How do you guarantee that they wouldn't be pushed out or diluted?
No, nobody is going to be pushed out or diluted. If there's going to be dilution, it is the old investors that will be diluted. But those people, their uncle investors, we hope not only them, we hope their future generations will still remain holding these shares. This is not a share for somebody to just buy and go and sell it tomorrow. This is a future for anybody's family. You're actually investing for the future of your family. And I think it is good for people to understand that it's not something that you come and buy today, you go and sell tomorrow.
So you're guaranteeing these small retail buyers that their shares will not be diluted once in US stock exchange or Wall Street or London?
You know, OJ, sometimes when you look at it, with that we do business, especially in, you know, in Africa, one of the biggest issue and problem is to do with the stability of currency. Where now, you know, you have, you know, say maybe 10,000 naira, you know, which is worth today at 10,000 naira, but because we are doing local business, okay, maybe in five years time the rate of exchange can change from 1,300 to maybe 4,000. If it changes to 4,000 in naira terms, you will lose money, okay? You'll be out of pocket. But this is a dollarized business. It's a business that is in dollars. Okay? That's why we are saying that yes, you can choose either you take a local currency as your dividend or you choose dollars, and we pay both because our own business that we are doing is actually in dollars.
The Dangote Group spans cement, food, petrochemicals, and now energy.
And fertilizer, of course, sugar. Now you have a vast and of course a valuable empire. Yet you are retaining about 85% of the Dangote Refinery shares. Why not give up more shares?
We'll give up more shares. You know, we want as many people as possible.
But at this moment, you're locked at 85%.
We are locked at 85%. There is so much demand. Definitely we'll be able to increase the number of allocation. Rather than 1.6, maybe we go up to two billion or more. We can go up to, I think, about 35%, 30% more. So with that, I think we will convince other shareholders to make sure that we invite these people in. I want to make sure that, you know, this is my main mission, to make sure that yes, we democratize this share, you know, I mean, give to everybody. I cannot see my driver's money being returned. So I mean, we will do whatever it takes to make sure that we satisfy people who have actually requested and paid for the shares.
That is comforting. Mr. Dangote, the refinery certainly has changed how young Africans see what is possible on this continent. Now I'd like for you to just, you know, share with our viewers one message you have for every African who wants a stake in what you have built but does not even know where to start. Can you just tell them how they can actually get this?
They can actually get this and when it opens everybody will see it. I think this is one of the few shares that are being sold digitally. Yes. That's, you know, you can go into even anywhere, when you go now, you pay through POS, for example. POS will not charge you a dime because we will pay the POS. There's a commission that's left for POS, so you'll get your own money neat, you'll get your shares neat. When you pay the money, POS will not charge you any amount. So you can go to anywhere, from your village, from wherever it is. And even now, you know, we're going to use PAPS which was done by African Bank, and people from any part of Africa can actually, you know, participate and get into these shares. So I think it's something that we have actually, you know, opened. It is very simple. As simple as it is, you know, once it opens now people will understand how to buy. We couldn't do that earlier on, you know, because the Securities and Exchange Commission did not, they don't normally allow people to start marketing shares unless if the sale is open. So as soon as we open, we have a whole month of, you know, educating people how you are going to get. Even myself, I got a call last night from Canada, how do we participate?
And I said that no, it is very simple. You will be able to participate and you will be able to get your shares. So I think that's what we need to push because when you look at the future, what are you even buying? So what you are buying into, because the capital is going into the company, it's not going to the pocket of Aliko or the other old shareholders. So we are diluting ourselves, allowing more shareholders to come in. So at the end of the day, in the next, by end of 2028, first quarter of 2029, when we commission the new, what are you buying? You are buying a refinery that's the largest ever built in the history of the world. 1.4 million barrels per day. You are buying 2.12 million tons of polypropylene, which is a lot, is huge, the capacity.
Yes. You know, that's the one making plastics and, you know, all this even covering of, you know, this tablets, the one you do the capsules, you know, capsules.
So and we are doing also what you call linear alkyl benzene. This is the raw material for detergent, which we Africans will need. Any human being on earth needs, you know, detergent. So that one is going to be the largest plant ever built in the world. In Africa we have only two. One is 50,000 in Egypt. The other one is 100,000 in Algeria, but nowhere else in Africa. So you can't have, even today as we speak, 1.6 billion people, they have to import detergent that they need to wash their clothes, or they have to import the raw material.
And that's why, so we are now going into deeper, the sort of things we will start doing most likely, look at other opportunities like base oil. So the refinery, we're going to continuously think of what best to make so that we will guarantee that people will continue to collect the right return for their investments.
And do you think that this 525 naira per share is going to increase to about 10,000?
I pray so. Yes, that's, yeah, it can get up to that, you know, depending on where, you know, I've seen shares listed at 100, they go to 1,000.
But our own, it will get to maybe 5, 10,000, you know. So but at least what you are looking at, if you invest like something like maybe 100,000 naira, you know, within one year, two years or so, you are talking about you becoming a millionaire.
Fantastic. So why do you want to sell it? You remain there, you'll be collecting money, and if at a point when you have your kids studying abroad, even if there is devaluation of the currency.
Of the naira, you are safe.
You are safe because your dividend, you'll be collecting in dollars.
Mr. Aliko Dangote, I don't think this 10 million subscribers you are talking about is going to be, I think after this interview be about 100 million subscribers. Wouldn't you think that would be too much because it appears too good to be true?
No, but that's what it is. You know, I think we're looking at now not having, I told you, not having annual general meeting in a hotel like what we have been doing with our other companies. No, you want to see, it will be stadium. I'm sure 60, 70,000 people will arrive for that annual general meeting.
Yes. And we'll encourage them to come and tell us how good we are running their company. If we are not running it well, they should blast us and tell us what to do.
Before we move forward, I hope you have reserved my own shares.
Yeah, they are there. You have reserved my own. Oh, yes. Okay. Fantastic.
All right. Let's talk about fuel prices. Now the war in Iran has sent another shock through global energy markets and Nigerians are already feeling it. As of this weekend, Dangote's petrol gantry price has risen to 1,350 naira a liter, while I believe diesel is around 1,850 naira. Now with Nigeria now refining on this scale domestically, what can Dangote Refinery actually do to cushion Nigerians from these global price shocks and what remains beyond your control?
You know, the issue when you look at it today, when even prices move, the last increase we did, which was about, not this last one, before this last one, the market was actually, we know what do you call it, was at 1,265. But 1,265, none of the importers were able to, you know, they were at a standstill because if they sold, they would have lost a lot of money. So we allowed it to go high. We were watching it to see whether it was going to drop. But it wasn't dropping. It was escalating. But you know, we are actually buying crude and we have bought crude in May at $124, you know. So we don't, we can't go now and subsidize everything. But what we are doing to cushion that effect, we're actually now saying, okay, you know what, just pay, we have rolled out, you collect your product free. And I'm sure if you check Maiduguri, you check the South East, you check South South, you check Lagos, you see our trucks all over, they are delivering free of charge. So somebody who is going to Maiduguri, he will save 17 naira per liter, nobody's paying that, and that is not free. We spent 1 trillion naira to invest in 4,000 brand new 50,000-liter tankers, brand new. And we offer to give people free. We're even advertising that please come and collect and we're going to give you at, we will transport at zero cost, which means from the refinery, the cost refinery is the same with Apapa, is the same with Ota, is the same with Asaba, is the same with everywhere. Nobody can do that and nobody has ever tried it. And you know, if you look at what we had a problem with before was this equalization, where now government say yes, they will equalize the transport. It's a very difficult thing to do. I mean, like what I told you, if we're going to do it at full scale, we're going to give 90 billion naira back to people, which means one something trillion every year. That's huge.
But we're trying to do that to see how can, in this period, how do we cushion the effect. The issue is that can we now go and sell below what the traded market is? No, we can't do that because we too are not getting that discount. Actually, we are paying heavy premium on the crude and people don't understand. This period too is also a crazy period. It's a period that I know one time we paid transportation from Forcados, which was just half a day journey into Lagos, for less than one million barrels, you know what you pay? $4 million.
Now if, you know, supposedly crude prices and international product prices begin to fall again, should Nigerians expect to see that reflected fairly quickly in Dangote's petrol and diesel prices?
We've been doing that now. Even last month and a half we did that, we dropped. Nobody asked us, you don't have to tell us, you know, to drop. And you know, when we drop sometimes, or what people need to understand is that we're actually being very patriotic. Let me tell you how price of crude is fixed. Like right now my price of crude, I won't even know that price until end of September because it is the month average that we will now, you know, they will tell us, okay, this is the price now. At the end of the month they will take every day and now they will have an average and that is your price.
So for these Nigerians that are always asking this one question, I want you to be direct with them. If we are producing our own crude, like if we are refining our own fuel, why is petrol still expensive? What do you want to say to them just in plain terms?
Expensive is relative in the sense that today, maybe, you know, a lot of them, there's ignorance also. What they need to do is to ask what is the neighbor's price? I don't know whether you know that there's still a lot of smuggling of the same petrol we are producing to our neighboring countries because those neighboring countries, they are about 30% to 50% more expensive than Nigeria.
Mhm. So it's not actually like for like.
Right. And people can now go and ask, okay fine, what is the price of, even now at 1,350, okay, the price in Niger is 20, 25% more than Nigeria. So what business are you going to do that will make you have instant 25% return? So it means that yes, you take the risk, you go and take it across the border, you pretend you are taking it to, so you go and just take it to a village and you sell. Actually they don't have. And the problem now going forward, I must also warn that with this crisis of Middle East, it's not even about price, it's about availability.
Whether people will get enough, no, we will make sure that Nigeria will be fully, you know, delivered. We will deliver to Nigeria. Nigerians don't need to worry. There will not be any shortage from our own part. There won't be any shortage. There will not be any queues. And we'll make sure that we keep satisfying the market despite all odds.
All right. Let's now switch gears. Now you have spoken about how policies during the Obasanjo administration encouraged your transition from importing to domestic production and it transformed your business. Now what specific policy decisions do you believe the present government must make to drive the same kind of industrial transformation across Nigeria?
You know, the issue people don't really understand. First of all, it is very difficult to industrialize with interest rates at 30%. I can't see the magician who can actually industrialize a country with 30% of interest, you know, cost. It means that if you are going to build a factory that will take you three years, cumulatively the interest you'll be paying on the loans that you've been taking from the beginning, it means that if you need $10 million, you will need now 20. And when you borrow money in dollars and you meet devaluation, good luck to you, that one too is a problem. So you can see, I'm not saying yes, but in a way, this is one area that I supported President Trump. President Trump has fought almost every single country on earth because of protecting his own industry. With our own, we are already there. Whether there's protection or no protection, we have, it's about survival. Yeah. So we have to survive, but under the current things that are going on, especially in the downstream, I cannot see any new refinery in our lifetime. Where there already we have entered, are there going to be any other refineries? The question that I've asked you. And you know, this thing will be there. You know, this recording will be there to why me and you are even gone.
So I am writing, I'm telling you today is 13th, right?
Of September 2026. I want me and you to review it another September, I mean 13th of September. Okay. There, 2036.
By God's grace, if we are all alive by the grace of God, there will not be any refinery.
